Riverbrian

In the end... it's going to be the money guys who will consider it because they can buy their superstar players. Dodgers, Mets, Yankees, Phillies, Jays, Red Sox, Giants and... Well... that might be it. Of that group... They would probably try to land Valdez and Suarez first before considering losing diamonds. The Mets need pitching but why trade Nolan McLean? They want to add to Nolan McLean and that brings you down to Baty, Vientos, Jett Williams territory. They are fine prospects but more of the same. The Phillies (Miller), Giants (Eldridge) and the Red Sox (Meyer) are the teams with a top level prospect to try and land. The additional problem is that those teams... if they lose out on Valdez and Suarez and King... they will call the Nationals for Gore, they will also call the Reds for Greene, they will call the Tigers to check in on Skubal trying to land that pitcher and keep Miller, Eldridge and Meyer in house. Maybe the Yankees consider giving up Rice. It's tough sledding on the GM hills.

Royce Lewis is probably the guy. Can't give up on him yet but a lot of shine has come off the chrome this past year.

This is exactly what I think. The Twins have a lot of the same type of options because there are a ton of these same types of options available on nearly every team to acquire. A lot of players cut from the same cloth.,, you describe them as Roden and SWR level. Jorgenswest will call them FV 45+ - 50 based on Fangraphs ratings. The Twins probably have more of these guys than most organizations and that's fine... actually... that's good to be loaded up with them because some of those players will exceed that rating. But... we don't need a bunch more to add to this growing pile. What the Twins lack and have lacked for years if not decades... is the superstar prospect. Walker Jenkins is perhaps the only player who fits into that bucket. These guys are tough to acquire because nobody wants to give them up. I believe the Twins will not consider any trade of Jenkins and the other 29 teams feel the same about their Jenkins level guys. It will take dynamite to shake them loose in a deal. Joe Ryan is the closest thing we have to T.N.T... actually the only player that could shake one loose so I think they should get the biggest baddest prospect that Ryan will produce and that's your deal whoever that might be. They may have to wait for the free agency pile of decent starting pitching talent to dwindle.... wait for the musical chairs to run out of chairs before the contenders get desperate enough to give one of them up. Until then... I would imagine the Twins can ask for the top prospect but I would expect an immediate counter offer... Umm... no... we are not giving him up but I'll give you 4 of these guys instead. This trading business is probably very difficult with 29 other shrewd trading partners.

Yeah Walker

Yes... Agreed At minimum.

Myself... My Opinion... For what it's worth. I don't think they need a full on rebuild. I also don't think they need to cut anymore salary but then again... I'm not watching the books. I think the Twins just need to concern themselves with getting return on the players that they are in risk of of getting nothing from and that would be Joe Ryan because his value is high and will only go down from here. And... Ryan Jeffers because he is a free agent next year. Perhaps the top catching free agent available in next years class which would make Jeffers probably a top trade option for any team that doesn't land Realmuto. We don't have to trade Lopez or Ober or Buxton. We can build around them. We need a young SS and a young 1B. And of course... build that bullpen back up. If Ryan and Jeffers can provide that... we would have a decent starting point with depth options for the road back and we could be back fairly quickly. You just let the players grow as quickly as possible as you sort out the winners and losers. We found a Luke Keaschall last year... let's see if we can find some more. We could have a decent enough core in place to actually strategically augment the roster with a better class of free agent by 2027 after the labor situation is sorted out. Just make 2026 about finding talent as quickly as possible and whatever happens... happens in 2026. No more Ty France band aids. Flood the system with players under team control. Show the world that you can develop. Don't narrow your development focus to a couple of players. Provide competition and sort out the winners and losers.

Unfortunately... not much was learned from that yester-year moment. There seems to be this default things are bad setting.... deep inside the souls of some that provides comfort.

I agree 100%. As much as people want to just chuck this season... and the next. This season matters huge.

What do the Twins get in return AFTER Byron asks to renegotiate his contract in order to waive his no-trade clause? If Byron's agent doesn't ask to renegotiate his deal. Byron will waste his leverage. Does anyone think he will waste that leverage?

My algorithm is being overloaded with reaction to a single sentence from Jeff Passan and I knew it would. And with that overloading... the crowd goes wild believing it. This is pretty simple. Could Buxton get traded... Yep absolutely... Would he waive his no-trade... I would certainly hope so because not being willing to even consider it is just wasting your leverage and limiting his options... closing doors. His no trade clause is his leverage. It is his protection. It's his ability to choose who he plays for. That is the important thing to understand as everyone loses their minds. If he chooses to be inflexible in regards to that leverage, all the no trade clause does for him is guarantee that he is in Minnesota through the 2028 season and he is looking for a new contract at age 35 and he's not going to get a 5 year deal at age 35. If he wants a bigger pay check... it's this current contract. Being absolutely inflexible with his leverage would be a terrible mistake even if he wanted to remain a Twin for life. That leverage could get his deal reworked. More money? Longer Term? Chance for a title? It's in his best interest to be flexible in all considerations. He can always say no if he doesn't like the team or if he would rather remain a Twin but he will have options to consider. If he isn't willing to waive. There is no sense for the Twins front office or the other 29 teams to have a second of trade conversation. Once he does the sensible thing... it's out there and Passan has a sentence to share with the world. As an example... Let's say... The Mets and Twins strike a deal that both teams are happy with. You know that Buxton's agent will be on the phone to get his contract reworked to get the no-trade dropped. 15 Million a year for the next 3 years. Nope... I'm Byron Buxton... you want me in New York to play CF and you want me to waive this thing. I want 25 Million per and an extra year. That's Byron's leverage at work. Once Buxton does that... If the Mets are willing (not a sure thing). It will drastically change the value of the return. The value would be lowered to the point that the Twins are no longer happy with the return so they pull the deal off the table. Basically... I'm saying. Buxton willing to waive his no-trade? Not a shock... Sensible in my opinion. However... it doesn't mean that Buxton is desperate to leave. He's just willing to use his leverage to his advantage and he can't do that with a flat out... I will not waive under any circumstance. I always assume that the front office and Byron's agent are talking and each is looking out for their own best interest and this is just how it works.

The only information that I can utilize myself is BBTV and that of course is faulty because sometimes those deals don't match up on BBTV and ultimately deals will be made based on individual assessments. Overall BBT does a pretty good job overall. Take Burridge or Eldridge for example. If I'm the Giants... he's 20 years old and the 2nd most valuable player in the organization. I'm trying to talk the you as the Twins into a package of lesser players instead so I can keep my potential superstar and get my needed pitcher... I'm offering that 18 year old Gonzalez kid and Roupp and a Reggie Crawford and hopeful that you like those players and it's better than what the Red Sox are offering. You as the Twins are asking for not only my potential superstar and more so we are ways off. So I call the Nationals and ask about Gore and you call the Brewers and ask about Made plus a throw in. In the end... the market will find itself.

Yeah... If Byron is willing to waive the no trade clause. The front office would know because it's rather important information to any trade discussion. Can't have a serious conversation with the Red Sox if Byron isn't willing to be shipping up to Boston. Passan can pick up that type of information quite easily but it's quite possible the information is going to lack some nuance.

LOL... Yes I did. I like calling him Burridge accidentally.

Could be Buxton's agent. Could another team spilling the info. I have no idea but I'm willing to bet that Zoll and Falvey have fielded calls from teams interested in Buxton. If they have fielded calls from team interested in Byron. The no trade clause would have to be discussed or there is no discussion. So... If Byron is willing to waive it. The word is out. However... it still doesn't mean that Byron will waive it... he may not want to go to Cincinatti or that the Twins will trade him... or even get offered what they feel is a worthwhile offer. But... Yeah... I can hear "Mets on line one" Phillies on line two".

The Twins will win each and every trade if they can develop major league talent out of the acquisitions. If they fail to do that. They will lose each and every trade they made. It's TBD at the moment.

That is the real choice... just not the choice that I'm asking. To trade or not to trade is the real shakesperian question. Along with trading at the deadline... or next off-season... or next seasons deadline. In consideration of Arb numbers typically doubling. 18M would be estimate on the remainder of his service time. That comp pick mention does matter because you would get something back... providing the Twins at least extend the 22 to 25 million qualifying offer in order to get the comp pick. If he Woodruff's that QO. we are at 40 million for 3 years and no comp pick nor a Jenkins type acquisition. Either way... the money to me is a secondary concern at the moment because the Twins have trimmed quite a bit of payroll. They can afford Ryan and others. It's simply... do you trade or do you not trade and what can you get back if you trade him. I'm trying to narrow that choice and just focus on... if the Twins decide to trade him. Let's say the Twins decide to trade him. Let's say they are looking for a deal and Passan raises his current 50% trade possibility to an 80% Jeff McNeil trade like possibility. Do you go for a 1 for 1 trade to get the highest rated single player you can get your hands on... A Walker Jenkins like talent? IF BBTV has it nailed and Ryan is a 52 value and Burridge with the Giants is also 52 value. Do you just go as big as you can get for one player. Or Do you split his value into two or three or even more players. We have a lot of holes to fill. Grab a 30 and 20 value or a 20 and two 15 value players? There is no way of knowing what anyone would offer. San Francisco would probably keep want to keep Burridge and try to sell the Twins on multiple players. My vote is go big... get the biggest baddest single prospect you can get for Ryan. I was just curious how others felt.

I'm not questioning his sources. I have no reason to believe that Buxton wouldn't waive his no trade clause if the team fits his hopes and dreams. I also personally believe that inflexibility (will never waive it) is probably something nobody should ever do in any walk of life. What I'm saying is that a single sentence in an article ranking the 40 best players who are possible trade candidates doesn't mean we should start saying our goodbyes to Byron this morning. Especially when the plugged in guy himself is listing the probability at 35%.

When the discussion turns to just trading everything not nailed down. There is something in the CBA... that states that you must spend 1.5 the amount received in your revenue sharing allotment or the players association will file a grievance. I don't know what the Twins will receive in revenue sharing dollars. I read last year that the A's did a payroll push to avoid this potential grievance.

I read that. The exact wording of the sentence. Buxton is willing to waive his no-trade clause -- and not just for Atlanta (he's a Georgia native) It was placed in an article co-authored by Kiley McDaniel ranking the best players POSSIBLY available for trade. The odds by either Passan, McDaniel or both are listed at 35%. Which states that Passan, McDaniel or both would not bet the house on it. From that sentence. The internet will explode with other people taking this sentence and turning it into... Buxton is on Zillow right now. I'm denying what?

Dan Hayes stated that Buxton may be willing to waive his no trade clause back in November 12th. We all know the possibility is out there if he's willing to waive it and apparently he is if Hayes and Passan both are hearing this from Byron's agent or Byron himself. That's puts him on a list of possible trade candidates that Passan then ranks based on his personal ranking of talent. What am I denying? That Passan's 35% means 100%?

They casually announce news like this all the time because it isn't news yet. In the article... Passan ranks Buxton as the 5th best trade consideration. Skubal #1 He also places the chances of the Twins trading Buxton at 35%. He places the chances of #1 Skubal being traded at 10%. #5 35% 10% Are all numbers made up by Passan.

No Buxton should retire a Twin! He should take on a role with the organization after he retires if he chooses. #25 should be placed between #14 Hrbek and #28 Blyleven. He should have a statue built in the plaza His children Brix, Blaze and Baire should grow up in Minnesota and proudly walk by Dad's statue every time they go to a game. He's one of us. That is what should happen. The statue should be rounding 2nd doing the Buck Truck thing.

Weather Joe Ryan should be traded is certainly worthy of debate. He could be extended... traded at the deadline or next off season or remain a Twin for the next two seasons. On that subject. I respect the opinions of others. However, I strongly feel that the time to trade him is this off-season. His value will never be higher. BBTV isn't the be all end all in terms of value since value is in the eye of the beholder. However... using BBTV trade value as a guide... it suggests that Joe Ryan has similar value to Walter Jenkins. He would have to have a better year than he had last year... significantly better in order to maintain current trade value at the deadline. He would have to be Tarik Skubal like to maintain his current trade value next off-season with one year left at double the arb pay. Currently... BBTV has Skubal and Ryan at similiar value because of the extra year of control. And of course... a significant arm injury this year could potentially wipe all of his current value to zero. That injury nightmare scenario would be the same as just losing Walter Jenkins for nothing. Many won't see that but if his trade value is similar to Walter Jenkins. He would get a Jenkins type talent back. If you don't trade Ryan for that Jenkins type talent. If injury wipes out his trade value... it's the same as losing Jenkins for nothing. And of course... The Twins have holes to fill and nobody can fill a hole (or two) like Ryan could. This leads to the question... If you Trade Joe Ryan. Do you go for a single Walter Jenkins (or close to) type player. Or do you take a package with multiple players/prospects. In regards to the current roster. Their are 3 current infielders on the 26 man roster that could stand some serious upgrading. One of Fitzgerald or Kreidler will get a 26 man roster spot for SS depth. Yes Culpepper can break camp with a major league job but I don't see that happening immediately. Clemens and Julien would probably both get roster spots if this was the roster out of spring training. If you bring in a SS... Fitzgerald or Kriedler would lose a 26 man spot. If you bring in a 1B... Either Clemens or Julien would have to be removed from the 26 man. Fitzgerald is the only one of those 4 players that have options remaining... So... Kriedler, Clemens and Julien would be exposed to other clubs if that matter to anyone. I would love to hear everyone's thoughts. Myself... I think they should go for the biggest major league ready-ish prospect they can land to bring another Jenkins type prospect into the mix. Burridge with the Giants is similar value to Ryan and Jenkins according to BBTV. Vientos and Jett Williams and Christian Scott with the Mets would be an example of multiple players adding up to similar value to Ryan and Jenkins. What would you do?

@arby58 makes some great points... the quick return from reliever to starter is something seldom done. However... I agree with you completely. Just roster your best arms. Sort it out. Can you hang zeroes? How Many? The ones that hang more... those are your starters.