Question on Oswaldo Arcia and service time

[ShouldaCouldaWoulda]

I was just curious as to how being kept down for the majority of the year has, or could effect Arcia's service time. Can anyone inform me on whether keeping him down for any certain length longer would save on either his super 2 or free agency control? I put his BR page with his accrued days linked bellow, but I am a bit confused on the math of it all. I am just curious as to if the Twins would gain another year or something by keeping him down in September, or for a certain length next year. Any help of knowledge on this would be appreciated.

 

I am not hinting that I think that is part of the reason he is being kept down, but only curious as if the Twins would gain any extra years by doing so. If so, his it may play into whether he is brought up as a left handed bench bat I would think. I know that writers were claiming that Marcell Ozuna was likely sent back and held down for an extended period this year due to this. Thanks guys.

 

http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/a/arciaos01.shtml

[stringer bell]

Pretty obviously, Arcia will be over two years service, but won't be eligible for arbitration as a "Super 2". The Twins will have four full years of control and he will be up for arbitration after next year.

[Seth Stohs]

 

Pretty obviously, Arcia will be over two years service, but won't be eligible for arbitration as a "Super 2". The Twins will have four full years of control and he will be up for arbitration after next year.

 

The "out-of-options" thing is a bigger issue at this point. 

[ShouldaCouldaWoulda]

So, there is no possible financial incentive to keep him down this year or next for any length?

[Otto von Ballpark]

So, there is no possible financial incentive to keep him down this year or next for any length?

No. He could have perhaps qualified for Super 2 if he had a full MLB season this year, but that was out the window after 20 days or so in the minors.

 

Arcia can't be sent to minors again next year (out of options) unless he clears waivers.

[Otto von Ballpark]

And this is where discussing service time seems kinda silly. It is almost certainly the least of the Twins concerns about Arcia right now.

[kab21]

 

The "out-of-options" thing is a bigger issue at this point. 

This and batting <.100 in August with 2 BB's.  Arcia should get every chance to make the team next year but pitchers (AAA and MLB) have adjusted to him and he is doing awful. 

 

This is a big disappointment but that is the way the prospect world works and a big lesson to anyone that suggests that X prospect can replace Y MLB'er.

[Thrylos]

I think that something is going on here.  In July he was Rochester's hottest hitter (.261/.352/.576) and come August the wheels fell off...

[ShouldaCouldaWoulda]

 

And this is where discussing service time seems kinda silly. It is almost certainly the least of the Twins concerns about Arcia right now.

No, I understand that, with him being out of options. I just wasn't sure that he was. But, it does sound like we saved a super two scenario at least. I honestly just wanted clarification on his overall service situation. I think i have found that. 

 

So, basically he should be up in September and get as many PH opportunities and some starts vs RHP's, giving Plouffe a break, or anyone. Seems that we basically have to find a proper role for him next year, or try our best to trade him in the offseason. Seems the only way to get anything of value for him in a trade would be to try and build his value in September. But, we are in race, so building Arcia's value likely is an afterthought.

 

Ultimately then, it would be best to bring him up, play him when the situation calls for it, and then do our best to get him right for next year, either on the bench or corner OF and DH? Thanks guys, I am not even thinking about his play this year....just looking at next year, and possible decisions the team will have to make. Should be very interesting who the team brings up on 9/1, and who plays where. Fun times.

[ShouldaCouldaWoulda]

 

I think that something is going on here.  In July he was Rochester's hottest hitter (.261/.352/.576) and come August the wheels fell off...

I hope its just not that he's that flukey of a hot/cold player, or mentally/emotionally tough, or unfocussed. I hope its just that he's hurt, or not in great shape, or something easy with his mechanics to fix. His potential bat fits nicely with our team, while the defense is another story. 

 

I also think that this will always be a team that is going to have to mix it's OFs by platooning. Hicks is way too flawed to start regular vs RHP's, and the same goes for Rosario vs LHP's. They make a good partial platoon I guess. Arcia is likely a platoon vs RHP's as well. I guess I am fine with both Hicks and Rosario starting alongside Buxton, but they should flip-flop from being top 2 in the order and bottom 2 in the order vs whatever handed pitcher they are facing.

[Badsmerf]

He almost has to be hurt. He's had so much success in his pro career, that this collapse is completely unprecedented. Arcia is stubborn, and emotional, but he is also a very good hitter. Hopefully they can figure out what's going on before he crushes 30 hr for a different organization.

[Kwak]

 

He almost has to be hurt. He's had so much success in his pro career, that this collapse is completely unprecedented. Arcia is stubborn, and emotional, but he is also a very good hitter. Hopefully they can figure out what's going on before he crushes 30 hr for a different organization.

If he was hurt--he wouldn't be playing.  There has been a change--Rosario.  Before this "rehab assignment", Arcia would spend a week or two in Rochester hitting rather successfully--then "up he goes" back to the Twins.  This time, NO.  I think he was informed that the Twins have decided that Rosario has "passed him on the depth chart" and that Arcia will remain in Rochester.  

 

True, minor league pitchers may have adjusted--but frequently they "foul-up" often enough that a good major league hitter  will still have success.  I believe Arcia is sulking thinking his dream of a $ 100 MM contract (some day) has died, and that he would be a bench player at best.  

[kab21]

 

I think that something is going on here.  In July he was Rochester's hottest hitter (.261/.352/.576) and come August the wheels fell off...

The disaster actually happened at the AAA all star break in the middle of the month.  I can't explain it but he was on a tear before the break (ridiculous numbers) and then he couldn't hit anything.  It has been 1.5 months now.

 

Perhaps he tweaked something and isn't seriously injured but it affects his hitting.  Perhaps he was crushed by not getting called up and is sulking.  Perhaps?

 

It makes no sense but being out of options next year is a big issue.

[Badsmerf]

If he was hurt--he wouldn't be playing. There has been a change--Rosario. Before this "rehab assignment", Arcia would spend a week or two in Rochester hitting rather successfully--then "up he goes" back to the Twins. This time, NO. I think he was informed that the Twins have decided that Rosario has "passed him on the depth chart" and that Arcia will remain in Rochester.

 

True, minor league pitchers may have adjusted--but frequently they "foul-up" often enough that a good major league hitter will still have success. I believe Arcia is sulking thinking his dream of a $ 100 MM contract (some day) has died, and that he would be a bench player at best.

The notion that he is sulking after this long is disingenuous to an elite athlete. Every time he has been sent to aaa he has crushed. Every. Single. Time. Except this one. His numbers aren't even bad, they are horrible. Arcia has the type of talent that doesn't just disappear. Even just going through the motions he should be posting an 800 ops in aaa. Something is wrong. Maybe the twins have tampered with his swing. Maybe his hip is still an issue. Maybe he is doing it on purpose to get on with a new team next year. Something is going on, and I have a feeling the twins are going to see him killing it for another team next year.

[Kwak]

 

The notion that he is sulking after this long is disingenuous to an elite athlete. Every time he has been sent to aaa he has crushed. Every. Single. Time. Except this one. His numbers aren't even bad, they are horrible. Arcia has the type of talent that doesn't just disappear. Even just going through the motions he should be posting an 800 ops in aaa. Something is wrong. Maybe the twins have tampered with his swing. Maybe his hip is still an issue. Maybe he is doing it on purpose to get on with a new team next year. Something is going on, and I have a feeling the twins are going to see him killing it for another team next year.

Arcia began his "rehab" hitting well--then tanked.

[diehardtwinsfan]

 

So, there is no possible financial incentive to keep him down this year or next for any length?

 

He is out of options, keeping him down means he has to clear waivers and some other team can take him for free.  The Twins would be very foolish to leave him unprotected this offseason.