SCHREIER: Minnesota Twins GM Terry Ryan: "We Want A Postseason"

[TheLeviathan]

Although my definition of ace is different I can concede that the numbers do not back up my assumptions that you need an ACE to win a world series.  Looking at Ryan's comment again I can see that I likely put words in his mouth when I heard the words solid rotation and not needing an ace.  I think I am hyper sensitive to pitching talk having witnessed the last several years or poor pitching so any talk of average pitching strikes a nerve.  

 

Yep get to the payoffs get hot and win it all.  I can get behind that.  Just don;t try to sell me on Pelfrey and Corriea or some other reclamation project to get us there.  I am really tired of having one of the worst pitching teams in baseball.

 

Definitely, I would imagine it doesn't need to be shown that average or below average players are a bad way to win in the postseason.  Then again, most likely you aren't there precisely because of those players.

[JB_Iowa]

Yep get to the payoffs get hot and win it all.  I can get behind that.  Just don;t try to sell me on Pelfrey and Corriea or some other reclamation project to get us there.  I am really tired of having one of the worst pitching teams in baseball.

 

 

But I think that you still need some very good pitching to be able to get hot and win it all.  Maybe not an ace (especially if you limit your definition to 8-10) but some darn good pitching and somone who can dominate a game if necessary.

 

Ask yourself if you were really surprised that the Twins didn't win a post-season game in 2010.  I'll bet a lot of fans --- like me -- were not surprised they didn't win any,  There was still hapless Ron Gardenhire totally intimidated by the Yankees; there was a team with little luminaries but no one looking very star-like and a team that had substantial downward momentum.  Then there was the pitching -- Liriano, Pavano, Duensing et al.  No one who could really take over and shut down a game  (at least not Frankie in MN).

 

I will never totally buy "Just get to the playoffs and anything can happen."

[TheLeviathan]

 

I will never totally buy "Just get to the playoffs and anything can happen."

 

JB, we had the best pitcher in baseball for several playoff rounds and we still took early exits.  Here is another way to spin this: take a look back at the playoff matchups the last ten years and just look how many inferior teams advanced.

 

St. Louis, just this last year, beat Clayton Kershaw TWICE.  (He's 0-4 in his last four playoff starts) And he's possibly the best pitcher we've seen since Pedro was in his prime.  Most of these maxims for how to win in small sample sizes are true in theory and then the chaos of the small sample size sets in and anything can truly happen.

[tobi0040]

there's a fighting chance that Torii Hunter will be our best outfielder in 2015

 

I really wish I could argue with you here.  But I got nothing. 

[USAFChief]

JB, we had the best pitcher in baseball for several playoff rounds and we still took early exits.  Here is another way to spin this: take a look back at the playoff matchups the last ten years and just look how many inferior teams advanced.

 

St. Louis, just this last year, beat Clayton Kershaw TWICE.  (He's 0-4 in his last four playoff starts) And he's possibly the best pitcher we've seen since Pedro was in his prime.  Most of these maxims for how to win in small sample sizes are true in theory and then the chaos of the small sample size sets in and anything can truly happen.

But I'd still rather go into a series--any series, post season or not--with Clayton Kershaw than without.

 

Because the best doesn't always perform that way in any given game or series is no reason to stop trying to be the best.

[TheLeviathan]

But I'd still rather go into a series--any series, post season or not--with Clayton Kershaw than without.

 

Because the best doesn't always perform that way in any given game or series is no reason to stop trying to be the best.

 

Of course and I've said repeatedly this is not an argument against having an ace.  It's an argument against the notion that ONLY teams with aces advance in the playoffs.  So if you're going to argue "aces are the way to win World Series" and treat that as some kind of "team + ace = world series" equation for winning it's worth pointing out how frequently that equation is bunk.  

[JB_Iowa]

No one i

 

Of course and I've said repeatedly this is not an argument against having an ace.  It's an argument against the notion that ONLY teams with aces advance in the playoffs.  So if you're going to argue "aces are the way to win World Series" and treat that as some kind of "team + ace = world series" equation for winning it's worth pointing out how frequently that equation is bunk.  

 

I'm not saying that but I do think you need some pretty solid pitching including someone who is willing to put the team on his back -- that very well may mean someone other than your Ace but having the security of an Ace can help the entire team's mindset (Of course it can hurt, too, if that Ace gets blown out.)

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

Since we've had maybe a half dozen posters now claim that the numbers back them up, let's see the numbers!

[TheLeviathan]

Since we've had maybe a half dozen posters now claim that the numbers back them up, let's see the numbers!

 

See the grantland stories or go through B-Ref.  I haven't found a good website for composite playoff data, everything gets lumped by series and I really don't want to do the math.  

 

And JB, I'm with you in many respects, but I think what has happened as we've talked is you've softened the maxim to where it belongs: Having an ace is better than not having one.  But people seem to take that idea too far and say you HAVE to have one and it's the ONLY way to win or that it dramatically increases your chances.  And none of those things are true.  But yeah, I'd definitely still take an ace.  The Twins weren't better off without Johan, he just didn't guarantee them anything in a small sample.

[Riverbrian]

But I'd still rather go into a series--any series, post season or not--with Clayton Kershaw than without.

Because the best doesn't always perform that way in any given game or series is no reason to stop trying to be the best.

Me 2... I don't care if Kershaw blew a tire in the playoffs... I'd start him game one if I had him and I'd love for the Twins to have him and I would pick him up for extra playoff juice at the trade deadline despite poor playoff numbers.

 

I agree with everyone but mostly with Levi. I don't know if luck is the right word but getting to the playoffs is the key... Once there... Play hard and hope the baseball Gods favor you.

 

Anything can happen and Wildcards will continue to win on occasion. Sometimes with an Ace and sometimes without.