Dman

So if you are a team that really wants to see what your left handed pitchers can do against really good right handed bats, just have them pitch against the Surge. The Riders lefty had a 2.70 EERA and nice peripherals coming into this game, but 4 home runs and 7 earned runs later he was a half a point higher at 3.28. They went to another lefty and he gave up 3 home runs in one inning of work. This lineup is death to lefties. Well except for the lefty batters in Jenkins who went 0 for 4 and Cespedes who K'd 4 times. Culpepper finally caught and passed Gonzalez for the OPS lead on the team. They both had Home runs but Culpepper had a 4 for 5 night that left him with a .996 OPS 10 points higher than Gonzalez. I will echo the Fedko love. A few years back when he was with Kernel's I went to a game in Beloit and he hit a home run that night too. I believe he leads the Texas league in HRs this year. He went through a mini slump, but seems to be back. OPS is close to .900 again. He's always had a good approach and now that he is tapping into power pretty consistently they should take a close look at him.

I would only trade Jax or Duran for something we need. We don't really need outfielder's with Rodriguez, Gonzalez and Jenkins close to ready for next year and they are our top prospects. A catcher meets a need as would a solid arm. So as everyone has mentioned Rushing plus would be my ask and they can give them a great defensive catcher back in Vasquez. If the Dodgers can work in Rushing I think they likely have a deal.

Since Keaschall doesn't really have much defensive value is that about the same area he would fall. A 1 to 1.5 WAR player?

I just feel like there is quite a bit of bias when it comes to Gonzalez. As far as power he has some already his slugging proves that and there is no reason once he focuses on getting to more power that he won't be able to. As far as being a free swinger. He has more walks than K's at AA right now. His eye can't be that bad. He might have to tone down the aggressive approach some at the MLB level, but his walk to K rate seems to indicate he has a great foundation to do that. As far as his running ability he is rated as a faster runner than both Larnach and Wallner so I am not sure where this too slow stuff comes from. The games I have watched he moves well out there. I don't watch every game but early in the year he looked a little stiff out there in the cold, but most guys do. He's not gonna be Bader and get to every ball, but he isn't going to be any worse than Wallner or Larnach that I can see. The whole premise is that he won't have enough power and I think that is short sited given the evidence. It might take some time before he clears double digit HR';s at the MLB level, but he can hit them. He'll get better at choosing his spots and if he drops some batting average I am sure he can sell out for power like lot's of other players do. I just don't get the negativity of a 21 year old who didn't miss a beat moving up to AA where good bats go to die. He has a .900 OPS and has looked good at the plate all year so far. What's not to like?

It's not a perfect comp as in he is exactly the same hitter. Just that like Arraez he is underrated primarily because of his defensive value. Arraez had a very narrow path to the majors and he became an AL and NL batting champion. Not saying Gonzalez will do that, but I think his lack of defense is overblown at this point. All the top evaluators missed on Arraez because they didn't value the hit tool enough.

I would concur. They said the same thing about Arraez. No room at the inn. Too slow, bad arm, no power, hit tool won't be enough and I'd argue Gonzalez has more power than Arraez even if it isn't home run power and I think you can see that with the slugging. Not saying Gonzalez will be the same, but you need hitters in todays game and he can hit. To the OP's point it isn't the prettiest profile of an elite prospect like Jenkins. He doesn't run that well, but the games I've watched he hasn't looked awful or anything in the outfield. Certainly will never be a plus defender and with Jenkins and Rodriguez coming up be may not see much outfield time except in a platoon role, but let's not pretend he is any less valuable than say Keaschall who doesn't look like a plus defender anywhere either. They'll have to hide him at second or first and maybe left. Granted he can run much better than Gonzalez but with a 40 to 45 arm does that make him Beninitendi in left? I am also not convinced they couldn't put Gonzalez at fist if needed. Sure he has plenty of warts on the defensive side, but as the saying goes if you can hit we'll find room and he can hit. They'll find room.

I don't disagree and that is likely why he was rated 2nd but that seems a bit of a trap to me. Because if he is that good at the MLB level then surely he should have an OPS better than .700 at AAA right now. Granted he is coming back from injury. Still small sample sizes can be dangerous. Even the ones I am using to compare them in AA are too small, but that is all the info available as they are moving so fast through the system.

A lot of things i have read have him ultimately in left. I guess because slower runners generally end up there? Still I agree with you that he has the arm to play right from what I have seen. It can't hurt to get him more experience in left and his arm would still have value there to throw guys out. As you mentioned earlier most evaluators don't see him as a super athletic guy and figure a more athletic player would be in right. Still I think he can play there as long as his speed doesn't decline too much. Unfortunately for him the Twins have some players that might move him out of left and right in Rodriguez and Jenkins. So I am not certain what his ultimate future will be with the Twins. Maybe as you stated earlier DH?

Yeah FWIW Fangraphs has him as a 45 runner now, but projected to be 40 in the not too distant future. He is not going to get faster. Will have to see how well he stays in shape, but his speed likely declines earlier than most just due to body type. Hopefully he doesn't have to be a DH as that will take quite a bit of value out. He is only 21 I have to believe it won't be an issue for a while yet, but it will be eventually.

Yeah it's hard to argue against projection and he could be a top of the rotation starter. I am dinging him slightly due to injury which lot's of lists wouldn't as they would just do straight up projection. It is just my opinion but HS arms just generally get rated too highly too early, but I get it. For me I like to see them a bit before placing them too high.

That list is pretty close to my own and the guys you have listed 4 through 8 could really go in almost any order. I guess I have a beef with the industry because I think Gonzalez in criminally under-rated. Maybe it just takes them time to catch up. I mean if you are going to give Keaschall props all the way up to number 2 I just don't see how you can leave Gonzalez at 9. I would go and look at the numbers and I think you will change your list. Keaschall was 21 last year at AA and had an .832 OPS with a 12% walk rate and 19% K rate. Those are really nice numbers for a first year pro at AA Still Gonzalez has been even better. Gonzalez is 21 this year and he has played 10 games less than Keaschall did at AA so far and he currently has a .975 OPS with 10.7 walk rate and 9.8 K rate. Yep he is one of the few who has walked more than he struck out. The year isn't over yet and those numbers can change, but so far he has out performed Keaschal at the same age at the same level. You can argue defense is the reason as Keaschall is a faster runner and can steal bases something Gonzalez can't do, but Keaschall also has a weak arm and might be limited to 1st or second base which aren't premium defensive positions. Gonzalez at least so far can play in right as he has a canon for an arm. He runs slightly below average and I don't love his defense there, but it certainly would be on par with Wallner at this point. So he has defensive value if he stays in right. So I don't think you can count his defense against him. Gonzalez was on top 100 lists until he had a tough year last year possibly partially because of injury, but he has that type of talent and is clearly showing it again this year IMO. If Keaschall can be at number 2 with defensive limitation's I would argue Gonzalez should be at least number 5 on the list. Prielipp has been very good, but not really dominant and I don't see him mentioned for any top 100 lists. You could easily argue Hill ahead of Gonzalez due to age and projection as a top of the rotation arm, but it's a little early IMO. So IMO I would have Gonzalez at 5, but it's just a list and 9 works too. I just see it differently.

Yeah age not withstanding I would prefer an arm. Especially a high upside pen arm since they might move Jax or Duran at some point. They system has a lot of utility players as is so I get your frustration. Still he would be a good get for a deadline deal.

Yeah and if his OPS is north of .750 to end the year I think he could do better especially with the defense he provides. He certainly could get another two year deal and maybe without an option year. If his numbers decline to end the year I doubt the Twins pick him up for 10M next year. So yeah those mutual options are tough as one side usually has a reason to say no. I really have enjoyed him as a player. Seems like a great teammate too, but I'm sure he'd be happy to make more money elsewhere.

Gotta say that is an interesting find. Those AAA number are scorching hot. Not sure they would give him up for a rental as he looks like a better solution than Kepler and it sounds like they are grooming him for a Castro type role on the team. If they were willing I'd do that deal.

I am someone who does not do well with uncertainty. I hate when the Twins are the ones giving up the established player like a Duran or Ryan for the hope that prospects will work out. Teams fail with these types of trades all the time because that last big leap to the majors is a tough one and also injury can derail any kind of promise a prospect once had. It's a tough part of the game to get right most of the time. At any rate trading players on expiring contract should be a no brainer. They aren't coming back so something is better than nothing.. FWIW I still believe in the core of this team and with some help from the players almost ready to come up I think this team can be in a good spot next year.

FWIW I do think Rushing will hit better than Jeffers in time. He has hit at every level so far and generally at the top of his league. Still it's a gamble as there is no mercy at the MLB level they exploit every weakness. Sometimes guys never adjust. Personally I'd want more than just Rushing in the deal as LA gets a proven elite closer for three years. I just don't love the arms in their system. Maybe the Twins scouts can figure that out though. Jeffers will get expensive in the not too distant future and they won't want to pay him so it would be nice to have a solid replacement in the wings. Hate to have to trade an elite closer to do it but maybe that is the only way.

Beyond Rushing it doesn't feel like a great match with the Dodger's. Even Rushing doesn't inspire confidence with a .574 OPS at the MLB level. Would you trade Duran for Jeffers? That might be about where Rushing ends up. We have no idea, as he has no track record unlike Duran and Jax who do. They have to do due diligence and check but I imagine they will end up doing rentals in the end. Friedman gets creative and rarely loses a trade so who knows.

Happy to see Lewis with a nice line. Was getting worried about him. He was giving up so much contact and so many runs. Still not sure what role he would fit best, but just nice to see good results. Would have loved to see that Sabato triple. Always interesting when those slower players get one. It's still a small sample but Winokur with a 1.058 OPS for July. Recently he has looked like the best hitter on the team IMO. Will see if he can keep this up, but nice to see him being more consistent here in July.

So which one is the "real" Clemens? He had an .958 OPS in May a .626 OPS in June and now has a 1.060 OPS in July. I think his career OPS is .600 something so he has never hit this well before. Its kind of been one bad month, one good month, another bad month, another good month, but this July surge has me wondering about his potential Is this a guy transforming himself into a mini Brian Dozier with a lower batting average and lot's of pull side power? Is this just a dream season? Or is he gonna go back to .600 something OPS Clemens? Granted he doesn't have the requisite number of at bats to qualify but his current .830 OPS would put him in the top 40 in OPS in Major league baseball right now. Also that OPS is second on the team. The average is lower and he is selling out for power. Only walking 8% of the time and striking out 25%, but the kid has been clutch. He is 29 right now and 30 in May of next year. I doubt he is the next Merrifield, but could be a late bloomer. Right now I have the Twins trading him if someone were interested as they have so many players set for 1st\2nd in Keaschall, Lee, Julien, Schobel possibly Culpepper in the near future and possibly Eeles if you are a believer. They all are younger than Clemens. Still while Clemens has no options left he is a pre-arb player so wouldn't cost much and it looks like he has more power in his bat than everyone except maybe Keaschall. He has created an interesting dilemma if you believe he has turned a corner. At any rate I love what he has been doing and he has sparked this team to wins on several occasions. Will be interesting to see how it plays out.

Yeah this where I am at. What you said plus trading Ryan would be a very, very tricky thing for this FO to do. It's the type of trade that if it doesn't go well get's you fired and really ruins your resume as a decision maker throughout the league. As you noted the cost of getting a top of the rotation arm with essentially three years of control would be pretty astronomical and if you look at the Lopez trade as an example the Twins literally had to trade the AL batting champion for a pitcher who at the time was viewed more as a mid rotation arm. So what would it take to get Ryan who just performed well at the All Star game? Likely more than any contender could spare to move heading into the playoffs. I also agree they shouldn't feel forced to trade Jax or Duran at the deadline. They could re-assess in the offseason or wait until next years deadline. If you are trading elite bullpen arms the return should be meaningful and hopefully for things you don't currently have in the system. I would be fine to walk away from anything less than an overpay there. Yep guys on one year deals, I would trade all of them. I don't know if any team would have interest in Clemens, but since he is pre-arb has an .800 OPS and has been pretty clutch if they could get something meaningful I would trade him as well.

Well so much for that fairly easy schedule heading into the deadline where they could sweep the Rockies and the Nats and gain some ground in the wild card. Things look pretty tough right now heading into LA. This team is really crazy though so you never know. They played so well against the Rays and the Cubs who were pretty hot at the time. Anyway this might be a good thing that they see they need to sell and hopefully bring back some future difference making talent.

That seems about right, but I would go with Wellington Aracena at number 14 on Fangraphs. It would be a reliever for reliever trade, but if he can harness his pitches I think it could be difference making stuff. I think that is about where Duran was rated when we traded for him.

As long as the Twins get something meaningful for him I'm all for it. Hopefully they get decent young arm in return. System could use more quality arms.

Yeah I'd say most of us that hang in this section are Prospect siko's. We care far more than we should, but it is fun to watch these guys all the way up even if 90% of them don't make it. The farm is so important to this teams success I can't help but want to see these players succeed.

I have been pretty hard on him recently, but his swing decision with two strikes had been horrible. They are pitching him outside where they know he will chase and he had been chasing plenty. Recently he seems to have tightened that up some taking some close outside pitches. Still a hitter with this level of experience shouldn't be having those issue's IMO. He has really only had one good month so far this year and that was May where he managed an .870 OPS which is really, really good and wouldn't you know that streak coincided with the teams 13 game winning streak, which shows just how important his bat can be. Still it's the overall results that really matter because that is the consistency you expect from a veteran player and he just doesn't give it and you can see what that does to this team when he is off. I do think he seems to be a bit more dialed in right now and his "hot" months with the bat are coming up as well. It is just that we need better than .600 OPS production out of him the first half of the year. He just kills the lineup when he is this bad.