Article: Twins MLB Draft Profile: Braden Shipley, RHP

[bird]

Wow, mike. Whatever works. Ten years, last year, a few years, five years, three years. You got it covered.

 

1. You Could look at it THIS way: for the third year in a row, the record will improve. And the team IS improving slowly.

 

2. Everyone concedes the systen went through a drought, but it takes players about 1500 MLB AB's to scratch the ceiling, so not acknowledging the new guys "in the last few years" is bogus. How are Arcia, Hicks, Parmelee and others supposed to meet your challenge of being "consistently good for more than a year or two" when they're in their first or second year. You're being unreasonable, maybe a bit obtuse.

 

3. Yes. The pitchers sucked last year. Every one of them: Liriano, Baker, Marquis, Pavano, and Blackburn all sucked last year. This has nothing to do with your point.

 

4. St. Louis. That's your evidence? No others? You SHOULD apologize, my friend.

 

5. Ryan has acknowledged the poor results. This is different than acknowledging the kind of ineptitude you suggest constantly. To his credit, he also has admitted that they've made mistakes and need to get better. I don't know what more we could ask of him.

 

So you're right, mike, we'll keep arguing past each other, because you refuse to consider the evidence others point to, which is perhaps the third best farm system in baseball. And you will insist that the facts and data you supplied above is some kind of proof that they are really bad at drafting and developing starting pitching. You used to always include a list of every position of weakness on the current roster as evidence of their ineptitude. I applaud you for being fairer than you used to be.

[gunnarthor]

Ok, ace is hard to define so lets make it simpler, how many times have the Twins had a pitcher who could be considered a top 15 starter in the league? With 30 teams, the Twins should have a guy like this every other year, yet they don't. It shouldn't be hard if the odds are 50/50. Santana certainly qualified, he was a top 15 pitcher multiple times. But why is this consistancy so terrible to expect of our GM? We could expand the peramiters to the top 20 pitchers, even top 30 and we would all too often be coming up empty.

 

Santana is the only Twins starter in 40 years to have made more than one All-Star game. That is not acceptable.

 

Yeah, I think you make a good point here. I'm not sure if all-star games are really that important since it's not always the best pitchers. But the Twins have had a few pretty good pitchers but I agree they haven't really had one with sustained success since Santana and Radke left. (Radke was in the top of WAR 6x. I honestly think he qualifies). Hopefully Meyer and Gibson can both turn into solid front end types soon.

[diehardtwinsfan]

I'd be careful with the definition of surefire ace. There are maybe 15 of them in MLB right now. We won't adding 3 to 5 more to that list through this draft. If history is an indication, it will be 1... the question is which of the pitchers in this draft is gold, and which are fools gold.

[Badsmerf]

We've had the Ace pitcher discussion already. The Twins love affair with toolsy HS OF has put them out of the potential to draft an Ace. Garza was the last draftee that had that potential. He has yet to grow up and overcome the mental part of the game, but the talent is still there. You don't always have to be at the top of the draft to get an Ace, it certainly helps, but you pretty much HAVE to draft them in the 1st round, especially in the last 10 years. This is why I am against the Twins drafting a position player so much this season. To get top of the rotation talent, you have to draft them in the 1st.

[cmb0252]

We've had the Ace pitcher discussion already. The Twins love affair with toolsy HS OF has put them out of the potential to draft an Ace. Garza was the last draftee that had that potential. He has yet to grow up and overcome the mental part of the game, but the talent is still there. You don't always have to be at the top of the draft to get an Ace, it certainly helps, but you pretty much HAVE to draft them in the 1st round, especially in the last 10 years. This is why I am against the Twins drafting a position player so much this season. To get top of the rotation talent, you have to draft them in the 1st.

 

Getting any top level talent typically results from taking someone in the first round. Ace or position player. Just because we want an ace at 4 doesn't mean there is one there. I wanted to win the lottery when it was close to 600 million but that didn't happen. Scouts make a board and then the front office picks who is the best player. Does it always work? Heck no. That's why you have to hold your scouts responsible.

[Badsmerf]

Getting any top level talent typically results from taking someone in the first round. Ace or position player. Just because we want an ace at 4 doesn't mean there is one there. I wanted to win the lottery when it was close to 600 million but that didn't happen. Scouts make a board and then the front office picks who is the best player. Does it always work? Heck no. That's why you have to hold your scouts responsible.

Maybe not the true definition of an Ace, but every draft has pitchers that become top of the rotation guys. To think only Appel and Gray will become these types of guys is naive. The key is being able to identify it. An argument can be made making that distinction is tricky. However, you can't win if you don't play. To draft an Ace, it has to be done in the 1st round. I'd rather have a chance at getting "that" guy than refuse to be in the mix by drafting a position player.