Article: Brian Dozier Is Entering Elite Territory

[DaveW]

 

 

2nd basemen who all ended the year 3rd in WAR for the season.  Omar Vizquel is probably an All-Star due to his ability to be this consistent for so many years.  I hope Dozier gets into that category but I don't think he is there yet.

 

Brian Roberts 3rd in WAR in 2008

Mark Ellis  3rd in WAR in 2007

Brandon Inge  3rd WAR in 2006

Rafael Furcal  3rd in WAR in 2005

Omar Vizquel 3rd in WAR in 2004

Rafael Furcal 3rd in WAR in 2003

David Eckstein 3rd in WAR in 2002

 

How many of these guys are Elite "now" in your minds?

You are only using one stat "WAR" in a 64 game sample size.

 

How many of those guys also lead in OPS, HR, Runs, Slugging, etc etc etc

[DaveW]

 

 

I was responding to the guy above me who said he was 1st in WAR.  I wasn't at all trying to diminish what Dozier has accomplished.

If you read what I have been saying this whole time you would see that I said he has been first in WAR since the start of 2014, instead of using a smaller 64 game sample size I am going off what he has done in the last year and half, since then he is #1 in WAR, #1 in OPS, #1 in HR, #1 in wRC+ in the 200+ games. (much more accurate sample size IMO to gather somones value)

 

 

Edited June 17, 2015 by SpiritofVodkaDave

[jimmer]

How under-rated is Dozier?

 

Today's Fangraphs chat:

 

Comment From hscer
How many of the current top 6 second basemen in 2015 WAR do you think you could name?
 

Dave Cameron: Kipnis, Gordon, Panik, Wong are easy. Is Travis still in that mix, despite a month on the DL? Espinosa, maybe? Peterson?

[DaveW]

Also one other note when using WAR in a small sample size is that often defensive metrics (which make up a good chunk of the WAR equation) often can't be trusted in small sample sized measures. For instance, Kipinis had a combined negative 10.8 defensive value in 2013/2014, in 2015 he is at 4.4 already (on pace for 10+ overall), now it's very possible he could have improved, but to go from a below average defender to an elite in the span of 60 games? Not very likely.

[DaveW]

 

Calling Dozier "elite" is homeristic-hyperbole at its finest.

If you say so.

[clutterheart]

 

I would have agreed last year.

 

Coming from a guy who is as suspicious of the direction of this team as anyone:  When considering his age, consistancy, and overall production in all statistical areas, if I had to pick one 2B in all of MLB to ride with over the next four years, it would be Brian Dozier.

 

Why not just say "i only follow the Twins and I like Dozier a lot" 

 

Off the top of my head, guys I might consider over Dozier for the next 4 years:

Kipnis - He is the best at 2B in the league right now.

Wong

Altuve

Espinosa

Gordon

 

And this is to take nothing away from Dozier.  I am happy he is signed and playing for the Twins as he is playing at an All-Star level.  But the hyperbole on this thread is getting carried away.

 

[jimmer]

 

If you say so.

only if we stop looking at the actual numbers.

[DaveW]

Why not just say "i only follow the Twins and I like Dozier a lot"

 

But the hyperbole on this thread is getting carried away.

You are being extremely dissmissive and ignoring people's posts that specifically point out statistics (which aren't hyperbolic at all btw)

 

You are certainly entitled to your opinion of top 2B, but you shouldn't dismiss everyone else's well thought out posts as "people who only watch the twins and are homers"