The posts I wrote a week ago? Oh right. I admitted to that hyperbole, but the most recent exchange of posts have (I assumed) been about my post yesterday, where I tried to be thoughtful and resisted hyperbole, even if I was snarky. I'm not stopping discourse from happening, in fact, another poster took the time to respond to each of my points.You've spent three or four posts trying to shame me; I'd say it's you who's being pathetic. What's your angle? My posts generated the admission. My angle was to call you out for the pompous fallacy of belittling jocko when, to that point, your contributions had bee slimy moral high-horse grandstanding with an insulting string of hyperbole. Pot calling the kettle black. Don't present yourself as some moral beacon with nonsense like that. I don't hate the welfare system in the name of tax breaks or hating the lazy. I want it gone because it is eating away at the middle class. You have no moral highground and should be ashamed for the insulting manner in which you tried to present that you did. Carry on with diehard to your hearts content. Gentlemen, please remember that we are all patriots who want a better country. We may greatly disagree about how to get there, but we will get there faster if we can find common ground. It seems to me that there is an obvious way to sort out the lazy from the motivated, which would be to make sure that there are enough jobs for everyone. It sickens me to work 50+ hours a week while unemployed people watch Oprah. It seems to me that if they are going to collect government benefits, then they should be working. There is plenty of work that needs to be done in this country that would benefit our people and our economy. Our roads, bridges and other infrastructure has been neglected. We could also use more teachers and teachers aides. There are also lots of fairly high quality jobs that are going unfilled because there are not enough Americans with the training to fill them. This is where government needs to come in and spend money for the long term benefit of everyone, while putting a lot of people back to work. Also, there are a lot of jobs filled by illegal immigrants that could be filled by citizens if we had better mechanisms for requiring genuine slackers to take such jobs, and to this end, a more decent minimum wage would also help. To me, the irony of this debate is that we taxpayers are going to pay for our less fortunate citizens one way or another. We can cut their Medicare and their Medicaid but that won't keep them out of the emergency rooms. We can give their kids crappy educations, but then we get to pay $35,000+ per year per prisoner to keep them in prison later. And we can starve them, but what's it going to feel like and look like around the world when the United States is allowing people to starve. I would like to try to weed out the slackers, by offering them jobs and cutting their benefits if they don't at least try to work, but I would also like to do a lot more than we do now in training and employing the non-slackers. Basically, I would like EVERYONE to work at least 30 hours per week, except people who are disabled from doing so. And I think that with the right policies, we could find jobs for the vast majority of people who are now unemployed. I think that the best solution might come if we can put aside party and philosophy and try to find ways to spend our tax dollars more wisely. It's no secret that governments at all levels waste many billions of dollars per year, and that there are programs that overlap and that are inefficient. It's also no secret that tax rates for high earners are very low compared with historical rates and that the top 1% has been thriving. If only the liberals could put social programs on the table and the conservatives could put tax rates (and the defense budget) on the table, then I think that we could still get out of this mess. On the other hand, our system seems to broken to allow for compromise, and the special interests are calling most of the shots, no matter who we elect. And with Citizen's United, this will likely get worse before finally there is a backlash and we clamp down on the corruption that comes from politicians doing things that they know are wrong in order to get money to get re-elected. Canada, anyone? P.S. - can we at least all agree that the billions spent on the drug war and on imprisoning users is a total waste?