Jham

How far does Jeffers jump at seasons end if he keeps this up?

I think most teams still view him as an all star. To me, the demotion to Ft Meyers was an extreme move. A desperate move. A make it out break it move. Now he's in the Dominican for a family situation. It reminds me a bit of when he "reported early" for spring training to shag fly balls to be ready for right field. Ruesse discovered he wasn't in Florida. He was home. Or the winter he turned down Arizona fall ball to return home. None of this is a slight on Sano, necessarily. A move could be best for all involved. I dunno. We haven't really seem him control his weight or stay healthy. If he's heavier next season... I just think it's a lot to assume at this moment that things are fine with Sano and he's still a as start who will be a perennial all star. My guess is enough teams still think that now. If his weight is 310 and not his batting average next year, that might not be the case. I guess I'm more worried than most. I specifically hope the kid is doing ok mentally.

Wait, how do you know this?

I just don't see the logic of trading for "whatever we can get". If all we're gonna get is trash or 40 man cast-offs then it doesn't really matter whether we keep or trade. This is how we end up with tons of AAA and AAAA guys we can't get away from, don't know enough about, or have to be released. I don't see how tanking or trading guys for suspect returns helps foster a winning culture, send a message about the importance of winning to young players, or give any reason to sign here as a FA or accept an extension. I don't think having a reputation of caving helps future bargaining either. Sometimes you try your best and it doesn't work out. High character means you don't quit absent a darn good reason. "Whatever we can get" isn't a good enough reason, imo. It's ok to demand a fair or even favorable offer. It's ok to play it out and let guys walk if the return isn't there.

I'm not even against signing Joe back of we are willing to A Rod or Ichiro the situation if he's bad or the team needs his spot. Mostly I just don't think Gordon is even a lateral move next year. And I don't think the market will love either Mauer or Dozier. And we'll have tons of money either way. If we get a good offer, take it. If not, who cares? There are lots of reasons to be a baseball fan that don't involve winning every single world series. Twins fans, of all fans, should understand this.

Where's he at this year?

The TD 1 through 5 midseason rankings were released. Gordon held 4th with Romero graduating. My point is actually that it seems like his trajectory and steam, if not his perceived ceiling have been lowered since his hot first half last year. I shouldn't have referenced lists, as that's not really what I meant. Sorry for the confusion. Thank you for the actual various rankings. Doesn't change my opinion (bolsters it?) that Gordon may be more valuable as a SS trade chip than an young mlb 2b on what should be a good teams.

I mean, he's fallen on most TD prospect lists. The most important and most accurate, obviously. I assume his promotion to AAA puts him higher on lists that consider proximity in their evals. Also, he can move up by attrition, that is other top prospects graduating. He's yet to establish himself as a short stop. His slugging may be limited by better fielding. He's a major league ball player. But a good one? In my mind, not likely.

I'm not saying that I'd rather have Dozier. But purely who is better at baseball? I guess insanity is too strong. "Probably" is more accurate. Dozier could be falling off the JJ Hardy Trevor Plotted cliff.

Insanity. I love Escobar. But Dozier is the better player. Come on. I'm not even the biggest BD fan. Looking at results, I'm not sure Dozier is part of any solution, his leadership mostly failed, and possibly blocked future leaders from stepping up. That said, is Gordon really or future 2B or AS? He's very young, and developed very questionable minor league power. His prospect status has taken a hit. Moving to 2B because he couldn't unseat Adrianza would only be a greater hit. Then when he struggles... There is still a chance he develops into a really good player. I'm trying to think of a player who's fallen down prospect lists then rocketed back up... Anyway, Gordon's future as near as it is, is no sure thing. He still had significant trade value, but less than last year. I'm not liking a lot of our choices at this point.

I understand exactly what you're suggesting. I'm just saying that I don't think your argument that we should trade for prospects is particularly well supported in fact. The comp pick rule you cited doesn't even exist anymore and didn't involve trading. I'm saying that the idea that you can trade expiring contracts for legitimate pieces sounds nice but rarely works. You tend to get cast-off prospects who eat up roster flexibility. If we were hopelessly years away, with no assets, then trade away and reset the clock. Who could we trade that would bring back franchise changing prospects? Probably just Berrios who would bring a pile. Maybe Sano, Buxton, Rosario, or Kepler? But all of those guys could be part of a winner as soon as next year. If we're gonna tear down and rebuild, do it right and go get some actual prospects with all-star level ceilings. Gibby, Rodney, Esco don't do that. so what's the point? We assume that guys like Dozier and Lynn can't be resigned (not saying we should) but what has either done this year to suggest they're going to get nice deals rather than 1 year prove its? I said before the year that I wanted to give this core a year to prove they could win. We brought in tons of support, and they failed miserably. Now I want to give them 1 more season for some reason. But if not, we need to trade our most valuable players. At this point, Probably Berrios which we'd never do. Then I wonder if teams prefer Sano or Buxton or Kep or Rosario. If you're not willing to part with valuable pieces, why would you expect valuable prospects in return? And if you're not getting vale in return, then what difference does it make?

Who exactly are we talking about that was traded and netted a major contributor? The Indians are the only team you referenced who was remotely built though trade. And that is because they had a CC, Cliff Lee, and Jake Westbrook (ditto Zack Greinke) to trade (returning Brantley, Carrasco and Kluber). That's a long wait for return on investment. Shin Soo Choo returned Shaw and Trevor Bauer which is really the only players I could come up with. The As have been irrelevant for a decade. And all other 4 teams you referenced have this in common: lots of hits on high draft picks and international FA signings plus a willingness to take risks by signing big free agents and trading away prospects. Yankees don't get Gleyber Torres from the Cubs without first signing Aroldis Chapman. What players are you referring to as examples of rebuilding through fire sale? Bad teams just usually don't have much to sell.

This is an awesome story. Thanks for sharing. There are a lot of reasons to love baseball and cheer for the Twins even when titles and pennants aren't within reach.

People give up pretty easily. This year I get. Next year, I dunno. I'd wait to see what sort of team we can build before assuming next year is total lost cause. Gibson is a close call. I find it unlikely that he'd return mite this year than as a rental at next year's deadline or after this season.

Trading for "whatever you can get" signals desperation which may well cost you in future trade negotiations. Being willing to hold an expiring contact is really the only leverage we have.

the 2017 draft looks pretty nice at this point. hopefully a sign that scouting, drafting, and development are figuring out out with the new FO.

I think our outfield was or there longer and did more running, as usual.

Could. Interesting idea. I think people still like the idea of someone being in charge. I mean look at our country. We have a legislature responsible for law making, a judiciary for oversight, and numerous executive agencies, but obviously the president is still the one the nation looks to.

People underestimate the importance of managers imo because they're worth isn't easily quantifiable. Motivating over 162 games is hard. getting though to players who think they know everything and make more money than you is hard. Getting players to think "team" in a contract year is hard. Getting players who don't like you or eachother to put differences aside is hard. Dealing with behind the scenes gripes about playing time and usage, briefing the fo, leading coaching staff, handling media is all hard. The lineups and pitching changes are the easy parts. computers would probably beat any human at that game.

Ouch...

Gibby went up and in on jd Martinez and jd reacted like a baby. wasn't close to hitting him. offer el caballo unlimited fogo with his deal. he'll sign... just don't tell sano...

I'm concerned about Nick Gordon already losing trade value. It's also disappointing that neither Stewart or Gonsalves have made it or even appear to be anything more than back end or bull pen filler. Seems like whether we draft college or high school arms we can't get it right. Otherwise great day for Twins affiliates!

The Twins have a lot of guys with unorthodox swings. Mauer and his inside-out metronome, Dozier's step in the bucket tomahawk, Rosie's wrist snaps, Sano's abrupt 2 handed upper cut, and Buxton's chest forward bent front leg just try to make contact looking thing. I think much of the struggle comes from poorly developed mechanics and/or approach.

2 out hit with the bases loaded scoring 1 worth a second on an error... Can we assume infield hit for Byron?

Everyone on the team needs to change their name to Ed.