NYCTK

A lot of people here seem not to understand every contending team carries old vets that are only expected to get 2 games a week and fill in when holes open up. The obvious example is the Twins fans complaining about Ty France, only for Ty France to go to the Blue Jays where he made the World series roster. And sometimes, when you so completely misunderstand MLB rosters you fight against signings like that of Harrison Bader and you show you don't know ball.

You could tag @RpR and ask them rather than be a passive aggressive vocal bystander over it. Not every down vote requires a comment. You're allowed to just disagree with someone.

That 40 games was over the entire season. And, yes, a large chunk of those games were over the course of one month, when Larnach got demoted to AAA (I think I said injured, but that was earlier in the season). I really don't think a one month trial with a veteran role player plugged in is demonstrative of a team that is overly reliant on veterans over young players. They gave the job to a young guy, he sucked, and then they gave one of the veterans a month, and then moved on from him to go to the young player. This goes against what you think it does. You wish it was 2 weeks instead of 4? Great, sure, hindsight is 20-20. It's very easy to argue in hindsight that they should have just gone to Wallner, and I don't doubt there were people at the time saying as much. And I might have been saying the same were I paying attention at that point in the season. But it's also worth keeping in mind Wallner had a 32% K rate at the time Larnach was sent down and still played his terrible OF defense. The Twins could have been very intentional with what they were working on with Wallner in the minors and didn't wish to bring him up and get sent back down right behind Larnach. This narrative around Gallo is just fans being petty. A bench player came in, was around replacement level and helped them get into the playoffs. And rather than just forget about him and think back fondly on the season, so many here can't stop ****ing on him and the one month he kind of sort of blocked Matt Wallner. Get over it.

If there was no revolving door, how did all of Castro, Luplow, Gordon, Garlick and Stevenson start games in LF in addition to Larnach, Wallner, Kirilloff, and Gallo? The Twins weren't reliant on Gallo as a player to start the season. He was essentially given the role Bader filled last season, not expected to be a star with the bat but just to pop a few dingers while having the positional flexibility to play any of the OF positions, as well as the vacant 1B position. He was actually one of 3 veterans brought in at the start of that season to play those veteran support roles (4 if you count the waiver claim Castro) yet no one ever talks about all the other role players and their combined 6.4 bWAR. They just constantly complain about Gallo. All this complaining about a veteran that LOST his job due to ineffectiveness, as evidence the Twins refuse to move on from veterans. And all complaining about the roster of the only decent Twins team in the last 5 seasons. It just gets really old. I was a Day 1 DaShawn hater. But you don't just cut people without someone to replace them. As ****** as DaShawn was, he played at least some role. And when Martin was hurt, there was no one in AAA that could fill that role. But, that's because of complete organizational failure.

Gallo did only start in 40 games in either Corner OF position. But there was a month long stretch where Larnach got hurt [EDIT: not hurt, but sent down to AAA] and during which Gallo took over primary LF duties. I think 100 PAs is a fair estimate of the number of plate appearances that Gallo withheld from Wallner, but overstating it a bit. During that stretch Gallo received 69 PAs with his typical low BA/OBP high slugging 737 OPS. But then Wallner was called up, because he wasn't blocked, and the Twins decided to stop playing the veteran because he was playing at a replacement level. Which is what we all wish for them to do. You can hope they have a quicker hook, but the fact that Wallner was called up and was essentially an every day player after that date is the only evidence necessary to prove that Wallner wasn't blocked.

There was a revolving door. And that revolving door tried internal options and they all stunk even worse than Gallo. He stunk, but he still had a 300 OBP and decent OF defense, making him effectively a replacement level player. Cutting a replacement level player without any plan to replace them is far worse roster management. Joey Gallo was not the top of the list of the 2023 Twins issues. The team actually managed him and his frustrating season pretty well. DaShawn Keirsey was barely any better with the glove and significantly worse with the bat. He was very obviously a below replacement level player (which is why Margot never lost his job in '24), but I still didn't lead any sort of charge for just cutting him without anyone else to replace him. That was the reason I was such a big fan of the Bader signing. In fact, I'm pretty sure I argued against cutting Keirsey because there WERE no better options in AAA or on the waiver wire. False narratives that take root in this community, which can be argued is the entire basis of the article.

But the question is, who was he stealing playing time from? Over the course of the regular season there are just long stretches where you just need warm bodies. That seems to be how Gallo got any playing time in the second half. Gallo played a lot of 1B because Solano and Kirilloff missed time. He played a lot of LF because Larnach missed time. He played some RF because Kepler missed time. He didn't quite meet the desired expectations, but Castro and Solano exceeded them, and as a result they both won the playing time given everyone being healthy. Gallo only started two games in September! Are fans really still upset about the 13th man on the roster on the 2023 Twins, and that it wasn't someone like Kyle Garlick, Nick Gordon, Andrew Stevenson or Jordan Luplow instead?

I'm sorry, but this is just very foolish. No, Harrison Bader did not need to be 4 WAR player for the contract to be a work out well. He only needed to be a 1.5 WAR player. This explains why you looked so foolish about his signing from the very start. And goes to prove my original point. Are you forgetting the 2025 Twins were wishing for Miranda to be able to win that job? France was not Plan A. To claim he was is revisionist history. In fact, Ty France was a perfect signing to a team wishing to give runway to an internal player they want to win the job. And, Bader was the perfect signing to help out in the OF for a team with a fragile CF, a primary LF that can't play LF, and with a lot of prospects in the high minors that you're hoping can breakthrough in the near future.

And he didn't need to have a career year for that signing to be a great move. He was added as a 4th OF to take away playing time from DaShawn Keirsey. It was a great signing from day 1 which is how I know so many people here have extreme biases against external veterans that end up making them look foolish. He was perfectly fine and took playing time away from...Aaron Sabato? Jose Miranda? It was another good depth signing, and was from Day 1. It just really seems like a lot of people here are unable to understand the weaknesses of internal players while hyper-focused on the weaknesses of external players. Or at least initially, because once a player comes up and fails, a lot of fans are then completely willing to give up on them too. This is just a really funny thing to say about someone that was deemed good enough to be on a World Series roster. Not good enough for the Twins on a near minimum contract, but good enough for the AL Pennant winners apparently. I count on it. Always annoying, but always right.

I'm just saying that many here have an apparent instinctive hatred of external veterans, which is how so many fans here were made to look incredibly foolish when the Twins signed Harrison Bader last season, and even Ty France. Constantly complaining about a player 3 season ago now that didn't block any young players, and didn't even make the Twins only playoff roster in 5 seasons.

For all this complaining about the Twins refusing to move off of veterans, I fail to see any evidence. One of those truisms that lack actual truth. Plus, you don't actually want to see your young prospects come up and serve the role of these veterans. What good would it do Emmanuel Rodriguez to come up and play twice a week? Fans here just constantly complain about Manuel Margot and Joey Gallo, never mind that Margot's replacement would have been Keirsey (lose-lose) and Gallo's presence didn't prevent Wallner from establishing himself as a near every day player by midseason, and then Gallo didn't make the playoff roster. For some reason these same fans never mention Donovan Solano, Harrison Bader, etc.

It is pretty funny to read comments on the same website about how terrible Kreidler is (true!) after months or years of some other fans insisting the likes of Noah Miller (and now Houston) should be promoted regardless of how well they would hit. Not to say it's the same people with these countering ideas. Just funny to see the spectrum of opinions.

Fair. I guess I got confused and off track since they all suck at their jobs and none of them can build a respectable baseball organization.

Telling your idiot boss that he's an idiot, in politer terms, is a lot of people's jobs in every industry. My boss is an idiot in many matters. And it's my job to remind him of that when that's the case. And sometimes, it's fruitless, yes. But to oversimplify Zoll's job, if my only job were to hire staff and my boss disallowed me from doing my job competently, I wouldn't expect everyone else to have sympathy for me. If I were to stick around exclusively for the paycheck, I would also deserve the scorn. Yes-men are cowards, not victims.

So...then we agree. He's a yes-man.

Well, then we go back to the original argument where someone claimed there's no evidence that Zoll is a yes-man. You're now arguing the exact opposite, and in fact, that it's his only duty.

To all this, I would respond, what do you think of Emilio Pagan? Good pitcher? Bad pitcher? Truth is, he's a good pitcher that a lot of people here hate because they're unable to look past 2022 where his results were...finicky. Just saying, if you take a look at payroll spending compared to output, the correlation is going to be weakest for bullpens compared to position players and rotations.

OK, and if Pohlad stopped him from doing his job then he should call up Jeff Passan and give him an anonymous scoop.

Yes. He should do his job, which is to improve the baseball team. Spineless yes-men acquiescing to idiot billionaires has sort of doomed our society. Zoll doesn't get my sympathy just because he wants to keep his job (and do it terribly, might I add). Most of these idiot billionaires are spineless themselves. Stand up to them, tell them off. Or, acquiesce, say "yes, sir" and enjoy your deserved ire.

On this point, we agree. On the point that bullpens are finicky, that's just a fact, whether or not you care to agree. Which sort of proves the point that you shouldn't overly invest in them. As for the "easily rebuilt" part, we may never know since we haven't had a competent GM is decades at this point.

We know that Zoll runs the roster. We know whomever ran the roster last season (ostensibly Zoll, perhaps Falvey) started a rebuild. Everyone who knows anything about the current state of the Twins organization recognizes a rebuild is the only prudent baseball decision. We know Twins ownership, in their quasi-change, declared there would be no rebuild. Joe Ryan, Trevor Larnach, Pablo Lopez, Byron Buxton, and Ryan Jeffers remain on the roster, signaling that Zoll has ceased any rebuild. That's the evidence. It sure seems like Zoll is an acquiescing yes-man to me. I get it, you want to protect your own neck, but that doesn't mean he doesn't suck at the job due to his apparent subservience to his boss.

You say this derisively, but what you won't admit is that there's a decent chance the bullpen is the most "successful" of the three units at the end of the year - looking at Position Players, Rotation, and Bullpen - when comparing them against the rest of the league. And this is precisely because bullpens are extremely finicky, not worth investing heavily into, and, yes, quite easy for a competent GM to rebuild. The Twins have made little to no effort to build a formidable bullpen and its still projected 20th, whereas their "strength" of the rotation is projected 14th and their position players projected 22nd.

I mean...have you seen the roster?

100 win team with a very fruitful farm! The future sure seems bright for that organization!

I feel like I need to pushback on this idea that he's a plus defensive CF. I think that could be true as a corner OF, but he doesn't seem to have great instincts out there. Good enough to play it, but not anywhere near good enough to be considered a plus defender. So, if he hits as well as Keirsey, but can't play a good CF, I don't really see any value in him. Arcia should easily win the job over him. Fun Fact Kreidler is the 2nd worst hitter in MLB the last 3 seasons with 100+ PAs. 3rd was Keirsey! wOBA xwOBA Kreidler 156 214 Keirsey 158 196