h2oface

I like this take, a lot. But 27 year olds ........ not really "youngsters" in baseball, even if it is just their first full season in the show. If Gibson is too old at 30, as some suggest, we only have a couple years left before Garver can't catch, as catchers seem to have to come out from behind the plate all too soon. These careers seem to be getting shorter and shorter. I hear some talking about Realmuto, who is 2 months younger than Garver, getting old at 27. Not me, but it is curious. 27-29 is usually heralded as the "prime". Here's to the 30 something stars. I really don't like how the system doesn't pay players what they are worth in the great early years, and then pay them too much in the lean later years.

I forgot about Lee. Not a bad pitcher in his 30's.

Yup. I have watched him his whole Twins' career, of course. I have always liked him, and was disheartened by his struggles. Jake Arrieta didn't look that good for the first 4 years. Then he took off, at 28 years old, and Baltimore had missed out, after he was cultured in their system. Sure, there is a list of pitchers that failed, and never got better, and it never clicked, and I am not saying he is a Jake Arrieta. But I like home grown players, and I have always had faith that he would get there. And now he has. To say, when Arrieta went 10-5 with a 2.53 ERA in 156.2 innings in 2014, "You watched him pitch the last few years right? There's plenty of reason to doubt..." would have been a valid way to look at it, granted. He was way worse than Gibson's worst. But it happens. Players do get better, and at different ages. Justin Turner is another example, albeit not a pitcher. I like betting on a player that has come of age at the MLB level, much more than a prospect. Gibson lost a good year, and more, really, as one comes back from TJ, so his age could be considered a comparable and a year less (Arietta has had no TJ), and being in your 31st year does not make one 31, and he is, by most, still considered to be 30, and won't be 31 until October 23rd, and next year will be his 31 year old season. (One poster has even called him 32 on this thread, and someone that the turnaround started in September, and not July! No need to not be accurate). But that is all somewhat meaningless, really. I hope he is a life long Twin, and we get the best he will and has become. I feel prospects are a much worse bet, than Gibson being a star pitcher for the next several years.

I know that the farm teams are for development, but it would sure be more encouraging if the top 3 levels, at least one of them, were playing winning baseball.

Boston is the only team without any top 100 prospects in the just updated list. They are pretty depleted. Perhaps the would trade Sale? He is getting so old though.....

We just need to ignore a sweep by the next to the worst team in baseball.....

Definitely a Gibson doubter. Diversity is a great thing.

And to return the compliment, you are doing pretty good yourself.

That's too bad. Already signing your team off for next year before the previous season is even over. Some teams even still go from last to first, and this team doesn't even have that far to go, especially if healthy and progressing instead of regressing. Tell Oakland they have no right to be doing so well. Nobody has said they wouldn't listen to offers. Listening is a fine and noble skill.

Amazing they ever even signed Santana, then, and especially for 4 years.

Yup. That is what we need. More prospects that may never ever get out of the minors, and if they do are years away. Who needs reliable MLB pitchers, anyway? Just every team, including this one.

It would be so totally foolish to trade Gibson. To all the Gibson doubters.... I say it for him...... "Bite Me."

If they trade Gibson, there will really need to be some explanations.

"Twins manager Paul Molitor said. "Garv just had a phenomenal day. Started his first at-bat, the homer, the hit to right, the double. It was just one of those games where we needed everything." " So now he calls him "Garv"! Molitor won't play him, nearly enough, even when he is the hottest hitter on the team.... but now he acts like he is fond of him. Nice.

I get your point. I would like the fans to have that kind of power. But unless the "state" owns the team, the private ownership is solely the person or corporation paying the bills. The fans are just the revenue source. There is no profit sharing, and the losses and and risk is not shared.

Well, they are.... meaningless. A lot of fun, most times, and an outlet for many things, but you hit the nail on the head. They are meaningless. I am not in denial. And that is OK with me. The meaninglessness. It is an obsession and addiction that we are all here. We chose to pretend we are all so smart and form community of sorts. Folks that are extreme fans, and like to argue. But in the end, it is pretty meaningless. But a lot of fun is. And assumptions are always a self trap.

At least Berrios was given an opportunity, eh? Then you really know. And who is to say that his progression would not have been the same if he wasn't returned to AAA? You can't. It is an unknown. Professionals. Hmmm. I understand that the choices they have made have produced results that don't show great acumen for making the right choices. Have you seen Rochester's roster? Mostly pretty depressing, and they have a hard time winning games. You never ever know, unless you actually give the young man an opportunity. The rest is all talk. Yep, we need to trade Lynn for more prospects that stay in the minors until they are 28 and released, or let go so they can be on a contender's roster, like the Dodgers and the Cubs, and then there is Rodriquez for the Giants! So much for professional pitching talent identification - we can't find room for them but can find room for the likes of Belisle, who Cleveland, with a failing pen, didn't even want. And this just in from Tom's minor league daily summary..... "Top prospect Stephen Gonsalves took the mound for the Red Wings looking to improve even further on his six-start stretch where he had lowered his ERA from 5.89 all the way down to 3.34. He delivered his best of that bunch on Tuesday, tossing seven scoreless innings. He allowed just five hits, struck out four, and most importantly in that timeframe, issued zero walks. He gave up a leadoff triple in the fifth, but his defense caught that runner at home on the next batter. Gonsalves then finished by retiring the final eight hitters he faced. Of his 98 pitches, 68 went for strikes (69%) and he improved to 7-3 on the year in Triple-A." The big league team sure could have used a little of that. And we really could have used Dereck Rodriquez this year. Or maybe on the Twins, he wasn't ready yet. Put me down on the list that would like an explanation.

The proof is in the results. It is NOT a good move if the players don't perform, even if you thought it would be. It was a horrible guess. The performance of Odorizzi and Lynn and Morrison is horrible, regardless of who else is on the team. Absolutely horrible. Even if Sano and Buxton and Polanco and Santana were on the team through the trios ineptitude, they would still be horrible. Their performance stands on its own. The FO chose wrong. No if, ands , or buts about it. There is also no excuse for Wilson to be on this team. That stands on its own, too.

Berrios should be 13-4 if he had a bullpen that didn't blow games and some run support in at least 3 of the games he took the loss in. Good thing the hitters decided to support him, tonight.

I have. (5.6_9 for the year, 5.9_9 in Rochester). Have you seen Lynn's? (5.70_9). Not a problem for Lynn to get starts. And he is a one and done tourist, and not a possible part the team's future.

Ahhhhhhhh. So play him at the positions that are secondary, at best, instead, at the highest level. Makes complete sense to me.

Prince Fielder hit one against the Twins on a misplay...... lumbered all the way around....

That effort by Cave reminded me of a Torii Hunter attempt against the A's in game 2 of the 2006 ALDS.... right after back to back homers by the Twins. http://www.espn.com/mlb/playoffs2006/news/story?id=2612925

Wow. And the sweep ends with Polanco watching a called third right down the middle. I am really sick of this team.

Delmon Escobar didn't help in this game. We could have had the FRE to start the second half in the bottom of the ninth with a one run lead. Gibson would have been out of the game with only 2 runs given up. Instead, he gets another hard luck loss.