Draft prospects

[Mike Sixel]

And not one of those guys is a legit MLB player, are they? Valencia, Plouffe, Parmalee are at best backups, at worst AAAA players. Revere and Benson and Dozier, we don't know yet......Lots of guys come up, but not one of those guys is legit for sure. Of course I'm not talking about the last 4 years.....and MLB production. You need 5-7 starters every year, and 5-7 relief pitchers every year. Ignoring the position isn't going to help. Again, I'm ok taking toolsy OFers (sure would be nice if one worked out), IF you are willing to deal prospects for pitchers, and/or to sign pitchers. But, that has NOT been their MO, ever, and certainly hasn't been with Ryan.

[gunnarthor]

And not one of those guys is a legit MLB player, are they? Valencia, Plouffe, Parmalee are at best backups, at worst AAAA players. Revere and Benson and Dozier, we don't know yet......Lots of guys come up, but not one of those guys is legit for sure. Of course I'm not talking about the last 4 years.....and MLB production. You need 5-7 starters every year, and 5-7 relief pitchers every year. Ignoring the position isn't going to help. Again, I'm ok taking toolsy OFers (sure would be nice if one worked out), IF you are willing to deal prospects for pitchers, and/or to sign pitchers. But, that has NOT been their MO, ever, and certainly hasn't been with Ryan.

And yet, somehow, they've remained extremely competitive until last season. Weird.

[Mike Sixel]

Nothing weird about that....my post is about last year, this year, and the future, not the last decade. I'm happy to discuss the past if we want, but this thread isn't for that.

[gunnarthor]

Nothing weird about that....my post is about last year, this year, and the future, not the last decade. I'm happy to discuss the past if we want, but this thread isn't for that.

Well, if the people that had created the past decade were the ones in charge of the future, why so glum? The Twins have shown an ability to develop talent. I agree with Nick that this is the natural down cycle teams go through but I don't think there's any reason to think the Twins can't fix that. Each recent draft has it's own issues - either overall lack of talent (07 draft wasn't good overall - if held over, Revere wouldn't make it to #28), few picks or injuries. And I think people seem to think that if a first rounder doesn't turn into an all-star it's a failed pick. It's not.

[Mike Sixel]

Because the world changes, and they refuse to bring in outside perspectives and hire new people. It's the classic 1980s view of the world from Detroit, why worry about Japan, they make crappy cars....and, I'm tired of the "they picked late" argument. Philly has had no issues drafting great players recently (that they then trade for proven players). There is no natural down cycle that explains three years of zero legit MLB players coming up, that's just bad development. I agree it is a lot harder to build a team through the draft when drafting late, but that's their philosophy pretty much, to build through the draft or by signing older players. So if that is your philosophy, you need to EXCEL at it, not be average, or the same as everyone else. You need to be great at it, and they haven't been.

 

Why so glum? Look at the last three years (counting this) and who has come up, and look at AAA and AA players, and tell me, why should I be hopeful this year or next? I'm glum because I like it when they win, and I don't see that on the horizon, unless they significantly change their modus operandi.

[gunnarthor]

Because the world changes, and they refuse to bring in outside perspectives and hire new people. It's the classic 1980s view of the world from Detroit, why worry about Japan, they make crappy cars....and, I'm tired of the "they picked late" argument. Philly has had no issues drafting great players recently (that they then trade for proven players). There is no natural down cycle that explains three years of zero legit MLB players coming up, that's just bad development. I agree it is a lot harder to build a team through the draft when drafting late, but that's their philosophy pretty much, to build through the draft or by signing older players. So if that is your philosophy, you need to EXCEL at it, not be average, or the same as everyone else. You need to be great at it, and they haven't been.

 

Why so glum? Look at the last three years (counting this) and who has come up, and look at AAA and AA players, and tell me, why should I be hopeful this year or next? I'm glum because I like it when they win, and I don't see that on the horizon, unless they significantly change their modus operandi.

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[Jeremy Nygaard]

Ugh, you guys are going to kill this thread.

[gunnarthor]

Ugh, you guys are going to kill this thread.

Yeah, you're right. Sorry.

[tpb8]

And not one of those guys is a legit MLB player, are they? Valencia, Plouffe, Parmalee are at best backups, at worst AAAA players. Revere and Benson and Dozier, we don't know yet......Lots of guys come up, but not one of those guys is legit for sure. Of course I'm not talking about the last 4 years.....and MLB production. You need 5-7 starters every year, and 5-7 relief pitchers every year. Ignoring the position isn't going to help. Again, I'm ok taking toolsy OFers (sure would be nice if one worked out), IF you are willing to deal prospects for pitchers, and/or to sign pitchers. But, that has NOT been their MO, ever, and certainly hasn't been with Ryan.

Well, Plouffe is 25, Parmelee is 24, Revere is 23 and Benson is 24. All of them have played in the majors. They are hardly finished products at this point. Are writing them off already? I'm not. Just as i'm not writing off Wimmers or Gibson. However, many fans are clamoring for the Twins to pick a college pitcher at #2 because "the Twins need pitching" but that route is no more a sure bet than the toolsy position player. Possibly even less so. At #2 you draft best player available no matter which position they play. You don't reach to fill a need. Ever.

[Mike Sixel]

Ugh, you guys are going to kill this thread.

Good point, sorry about that. Lots of passion around the Twins and getting better....

[Mike Sixel]

Well, Plouffe is 25, Parmelee is 24, Revere is 23 and Benson is 24. All of them have played in the majors. They are hardly finished products at this point. Are writing them off already? I'm not. Just as i'm not writing off Wimmers or Gibson. However, many fans are clamoring for the Twins to pick a college pitcher at #2 because "the Twins need pitching" but that route is no more a sure bet than the toolsy position player. Possibly even less so. At #2 you draft best player available no matter which position they play. You don't reach to fill a need. Ever.

I'm not writing off anyone yet, and in the spirit of the thread, I'll only look forward in this thread, at new players.

[gunnarthor]

In his chat yesterday, Klaw was asked about Twins approach and noted, "I've heard them on Zimmer, and I know they've at least considered Giolito, so yes, they're looking at high upside arms."

[twinsfanstreif]

I had a dream last night that we drafted Richie Shaffer at #2, I was confused and pretty pissed. It was one of those dreams where it felt real so I woke up kinda mad. I guess it could be worse but I'm glad that was just a dream. Although I wouldn't put it past the twins to make a bone headed move like that.

[gunnarthor]

I had a dream last night that we drafted Richie Shaffer at #2, I was confused and pretty pissed. It was one of those dreams where it felt real so I woke up kinda mad. I guess it could be worse but I'm glad that was just a dream. Although I wouldn't put it past the twins to make a bone headed move like that.

Hey, he'd be our third baseman of the future!

[travistwinstalk]

in my mind the pick is between Buxton and Appel whoever is left you take them and move on to scouting for your comp picks.

[DJSim22]

I don't know exactly why, but I just don't think Appel is going to be anything more than average. Zunino, Zimmer, or the young SS should be the pick imo. I think they have the most potential of the players mentioned. Giolito scares the heck out of me with the arms problems the team already has, and the crack medical staff we seem to have.

[cmb0252]

After seeing his SEC splits I'm starting to cool on Zunino. Both KLaw and Callis point out that Zunino is a clear cut grade below Weiters/Posey. While he profiles as a +catcher his hit tools/power are both a grade or two below those two. Add in the fact the #2 overall pick slot bonus is 6.2M, same as Posey and .2M more than Weiters, I just cant justify taking him there unless he signs under slot. Now, if they were able to sign him for 5M-5.4M and relocate the rest of that money to the #32/#42 picks I could change my tune.

 

One of the players I'm sad that hasn't been linked to the Twins is Correa. He has best of class potential, only person with a higher ceiling is Buxton, while just turning 17. He is a year and a half younger then Buxton who is one of the older HS players in the draft. While he most likely wont stay at SS he could be a plus to plus plus at 3B. Having above average to plus defense and 25-30+ HR power from the hot corner. The idea of a a Sano/Correa 1-2 combo in the middle of our line-up just gets me giddy.

[gunnarthor]

Klaw's latest mock has the Twins taking Buxton. According to Klaw, he's talked to people around the league and the "Twins are really hoping Buxton falls to them at #2."

[tpb8]

If the Twins are talking about Buxton at #2, shouldn't we see it as a smokescreen? I have never heard the Twins leak their pick preferences before. I mean....ever.

[Jeremy Nygaard]

If it is a smokescreen, it's completely unnecessary. They can't trade their pick and if the only team ahead of them likes the same guy they do, it's not gonna do any good.

 

The Twins were in on Wimmers a few years ago and it wasn't any secret.

 

At the end of the day, the Twins could do worse than taking Buxton.

[gunnarthor]

If the Twins are talking about Buxton at #2, shouldn't we see it as a smokescreen? I have never heard the Twins leak their pick preferences before. I mean....ever.

I'm not sure they're leaking anything now, we just have more information out there. I don't know, but I could guess that Klaw has sources that might have confirmed to him things like 1) Twins were sending more of their cross checkers to view Buxton than any other player or 2) that they had been in communication with his 'agent' about what kind of signing bonus he's looking for. From that, Klaw might have talked to a Seattle scout who, putting two and two together, gave him his Twins are hoping Buxton falls quote.

[Jeremy Nygaard]

KLaw just relesed mock draft 2.0 and has the Twins still taking Buxton though he notes that he thinks they have Appel #1 on their board and that Buxton and Zimmer are both still in play.

[gunnarthor]

KLaw just relesed mock draft 2.0 and has the Twins still taking Buxton though he notes that he thinks they have Appel #1 on their board and that Buxton and Zimmer are both still in play.

With the Twins history with Boras, I just don't see how they'd take Appel.