JADBP

Coincidentally also involving the Red Sox (I call em the Good Sox--used to live there--compared to the Bad Sox in Chi-town--used to live there too!). My worst Twins moves ever: 1, Simply releasing Big Papi 2. Not trading Ryan last year (I almost tied this with #1 because of the long term impact to the team) 3. Trading Varland 4. Trading Johan Santana (after pissing him off so because he wanted an extension and the Twins refused to extend the best pitcher in baseball!!!). 5. Trading away Rod Carew 6. Releasing Killebrew....to play another year with KC. Why????? Such disrespect! Now maybe the ownership would not allow Bill Smith to pay what Santana deserved. Maybe Smith thought just refused to extend the best pitcher in baseball!!! That set the team back years. But, the BS from the GM office over the last 3-4 years has been off-the-charts insanely stupid! There was absolutely zero reason on the planet to trade Varland. But, not taking that amazing offer from Boston was as horrible a decision as FLZ ever made.

LOL....no......only an idiot would choose Martin over Jenkins! Wait....uhhhh...oops, I forgot, Zoll is choosing....your right....F'n A, man!

Ummmm....there is NO comparison between Wallner, Miranda, and Julien....Kirilloff is a kinda maybe. Only Kirilloff was a first rounder, Miranda was 2nd, and Wallner, Julien taken deep (18th round +). Jenkins is a true five-tool player. He may take some time to adjust, along with Emma, but he is a keeper. But, then, I said the same thing about Royce. Dang. That was a tough draft--2016, when the Twins took Kirilloff and Miranda, as 1-2 (comp). They missed out on a ton of great talent, like Shane Beiber, Aaron Civale, Zac Guillen, Corbin Burns, and tons of others, taken after Miranda. The Twins didin't take a pitcher until the 5th round, and then it was the fighting Jordan Balazovic. I was looking at the top 100 prospects...and I keep seeing that name...again...there it is, as t he #2 rookie in all of MLB, Franklin Arias. Remember, the Red Sox offered Arias and Payton Tolle for Joe Ryan. Geez, the #2 prospect in all MLB, along with a SP that looks like an Ace for the Red Sox. That was a fantastic trade opportunity, but instead Falvey decided to trade away Varland. Seems like FLZ just don't want pitchers...they just want to hit more HRs than anyone else. Fire Zoll...before it is too late and he trades Emma and Jenkins for a catcher.

Of course teams need 2-4 inning guys. We have just been using guys for one inning max. That’s stupid. RPs come in throwing with max effort and are just not set up for 6 innings. We need guys who can pace 2-3-4 innings without damage. We seem to lose a lot of games when our RP comes back out.

Nooo…one of the reasons that Duran is so good IS because he is limited to one inning, and maybe 60 innings a years. He throws so hard that you cannot sustain that for 200 innings.

You make a lot of great points. But, ...... 1. We don't need Jeffers for four years! We need him for 1-2 years. THe last thing we need is Jeffers blocking Vahn Lackey. 2. I'd be happy with Arreaz returning to the Twins. I loved the way the guy hit. But, he's not a 1Bman. He's been spending most of his time at 2B. And, I suspect Cullpepper will move over to 2B when Marek Houston arrives, and that could be as soon as mid-late 27. At least I am hoping! 3. The f'in Falvey-Levine-Zoll three-headed monster has already destroyed our opportunities to trade Ryan and Lopez...and Jeffers and Larnach. The wasted opportunities are in the past. Yeah, we can still trade Ryan (he's never, ever going to sign a long term contract with this moronic team leadership!) and hope we get something half-way decent in return. The Boston Red Sox offered Franklin Arias and Payton Tolle for Joe Ryan, an immense haul! But Falvey said NO. Tolle is already a better SP than Ryan! And Arias is the #1 prospect for the Sox--a 65 grade SS/2B prospect (Marek is 55 grade). So, it is think kind of inanity in the GM chair that has put us in this unhappy position! So, you are right, first order of business is fire Zoll. Please finally decapitate the three-headed monster known as Falvey-Levine-Zoll....and put us out of our misery!

"His experience with Minnesota, including his emphasis on analytics, defense and communication, could still appeal to organizations seeking a new direction...." Really....his emphasis on defense???? Come on...gimme a break. I don't see any of his teams being a defensive powerhouse. Outside of Buxton...who else was a memorable defender for Baldelli? OMG, his emphasis on communication? Yeah, kinda like communicating with the statue of Liberty! He was never, ever the communicative type. Cody, I think he said these were his emphases, but that was wishful thinking on his part! But, yeah, his emphasis on analytics lead him to inane decisions (as some have highlighted here) and he was unmovable from his slavish love of analytics....to the detriment of the team. He may be the reason why Royce is so f'ed up.....he could never get Royce going in the right direction. Like Royce was going to hit 45 Grand Slams a year...that's what his analytics told him...so, maybe he "communicated" that to Royce? Whatever, he was a loser manager here. Glad his is gone. Now...for Zoll...so we can finally behead the FLZ three-headed monster in the GM chair!

Absofinlutely!!!! Maybe even "monumentally stupid" is too kind....

and OMG Varland....

Actually, this is due to Falvey-Levine-Zoll. I don't see any daylight between the three. And I certainly do not see any philosophical changes with Zoll! You are right, the F-L-Z pitching development plan didn't work at all. Ober is no longer a viable MLB pitcher, unless he learns the knuckleball. Remember, Ryan was a nearly finished product when we traded Cruz for him. Same for Taj Bradley and Mick Able. The real problem, as the article states, is drafting and developing pitchers. Like Zebby Matthews, Conner Prielipp, and Louis Varland. You can add Dasan Hill, who is in Toronto and likely to become a very good SP for them! So, there is indeed some good talent that bubbles up and some ho-hum talent. There are several problems here: 1. Not drafting pitchers high in the draft. The FLZ model is to take position players in the first couple of rounds and then start picking up whatever pitchers happen to fall to the lower rounds. That's why we are stuck with guys like Ober (12th round). You really are not going to find a lot of diamonds at the 346th pick that 29 other teams missed! This is lunacy. 2. Lousy pitching coaches in the minor leagues. This is a no-brainer, and I am amazed that Twins management has not figured this out yet. I recall when TK became head coach. One of the first things he did was visit every Minor league affiliate and make sure that the coaches were teaching the things that he wanted them to teach. He knew he had a young team and was going to rely on a steady stream of well-coached, well-taught talent from the minor leagues. And it worked with players like Knoblach, Tapani, Erickson, Ortiz, Hunter, Pierzynski, Mientikiewicz and Jacque Jones. Has any of our recent head coaches ever visited our A or AA teams? 3. Unreasonable expectations (dreams, wishes, etc). Let's take Ober for example. He's finished. Release him and I doubt any team will pick him up. I dare you! But, honestly, the FLZ model keeps trotting him out there, dreaming that his 87 mph fastball will suddenly become unhittable. The FLZ model is not ground in reality. It is grounded in wishful, dreamy thinking. Like trading Varland, or keeping Ryan. Dreaming that this is going to work out fantastically for the Twins. It rarely has with FLZ.

No… the prob here is that teams believe hitting HRs puts more fans in seats than winning!!!!

exactly, Mike He's the best C available this off-season, no doubt. And NYY will probably outbid everyone else. Give him the QO (because Zoll screwed up and didn't flip him at the trade deadline) and then let him go to the Yanks. Fine. But here is the main point...we have Vahn Lackey waiting in the wings...and I believe he could be accelerated up to the Twins (like, say, Keaschall). We could see Lackey get a cup of coffee in 27 and be up in early to mid 28. Lackey has the Mauer-level skills, maybe trading AVG for HRs. We don't need four years of Jeffers...we need maybe 1-2 years to bridge to Lackey/Diaw/Tait/Tinney. That's the big picture, the future, which seems to escape so many in the Twins shop. We just have to make it through that gap. So, Jeffer's accepting the QO would be ideal, actually. If not, a 2-3 year contract, but that seems unlikely. There is just no reason to keep him beyond 2 years because then we are doing the same thing we did this year...block out top prospects! Like we did to Jenkins, Cullpepper, and Emma. If we keep Jeffers, no matter how good he is, we are blocking the next wave of top C talent! And the move to 1B...if we haven't solved 1B by 2028, then we have far bigger problems in the front office! Its time to come up with a smart plan for every position over the next few years, instead of this flailing around trying to fit players where they don't fit. I expect to see Marek Houston next year...and he can be a lights out SS. We WILL have to move Culpepper...so MOVE him. Don't block out Marek because Kaelen will never be as good at SS as Marek. Twins have to fix this crazy roster! I agree that we need to clean up the roster, and guys like Kreidler, Sabato, Wallner, Gray, Ross, Bell, Ober and plenty of others need to be moved on to their next team. But, I doubt that the Twins will do so. Therefore, I strongly believe that they also need to move Zoll to his next team also. This roster is crazy.

Uhhh...yeah....OLIVA, the best Juggernaut ever for the Twins! Killebrew a close 2nd. Puckett should also make the list. Blyleven played on the Twins for 11 years, same as Puck. Tony-O for 15 years (first two were cups of coffee). Killer? 21 years (Twins + Senators)! If that isn't a Juggernaut, what is?

OMG, I would trade Ryan straight up for Flora! Geez...no lottery ticket needed! He could have been a #1 pick in some seasons, was still the #1 pitcher taken. Damn. I'd jump at that! But I suspect Buster Posey is too smart for that. Might have to include a lottery ticket from our end...or maybe toss in Tait, Wallner, Kreidler, and Sabato...just to clean house a bit! LOL. But, prying out FLora would be a huge get! Ryan and Larnach? We don't need Larnach anymore....so, yeah...I wouldn't miss him. I"d miss Ryan but I highly doubt that the Twins will be able to resign him.

Certainly trading away Ryan instead of Varland...... But, as many posters have said here, it might be too late to trade him now. The window was the 2025 season.

Maybe I am being too harsh....andI realize these are very hard decisions to make with limited information. But the Varland trade was on par with the David Ortiz disaster. You just can't survive (especially small market teams) making these HUGE mistakes. I agree, we are going to make mistakes, but I can live with making a mistake with a Chris Paddack. Yeah, we would have had a very good 1Bman for the last few years with Brent Rooker. We gave up on him too soon. But you move on. Varland? He cost nothing to keep him around. He was on the cusp of elite performance. He was young and we had him locked up for several more years at minimal cost. That was just insanely stupid. Just saying "Yeah, we will make mistakes...." is not good enough. Sure, we all make mistakes. But the really BIG BAD mistakes, like Ortiz or the 2025 sale-o-rama, will haunt ateam for a few years. We just can't afford to make the really big mistakes. That's why Derek was canned! Interesting to search the internet for "bad Derek Falvey trades." There are too many to choose from!

Well....as others here have pointed out...Falvey's draft picks at the C position, while plentiful, have been far less than impressive. You are right, he did draft a lot of C's, but most of them were beyond the 20th round! So, in his first draft (2017), he drafted Andy Cosgrove in the 17th round! He never made it beyond the Rookie Level in two years of trying. He continued drafting 4 more catchers in the 21st, 37th, 38th, and 39th rounds. Three of them did not sign (the other made Rookie league). Two went to college and were later drafted and are still in MLB. This pattern was repeated every year by Falvey, Draft a bunch of catchers in very, very late rounds. Falvey drafted Jeffers high (2nd round, #58 in 2018) then didn't take another C that draft until round 29! There are a few other high-ish picks, Noah Cardenas, Alex Isola, being the only ones that ever got to AAA ball (with the Twins, seems we dumped some and they made it to AAA or MLB elsewhere!). I agree on Diaw, and expect to see in in AAA next year. He's batting well, just no power. But to say that Falvey drafted lots of C's every year is misleading. Other than Jeffers, he never drafted one in the top 180 picks or so, where you might find a useful major leaguer. Never ever. I assume he drafts a ton of C's just to stock the low minors as catching machines for drafted pitchers. So, yeah, I stick by my original posting that Falvey basically ignored the filling the catching position with a grade A catcher after drafting Jeffers.

Hoping that Kreider goes away and stays away. But we are stuck with Caratini. The problem with Twins Catchers is lingering Falvey/Zoll effect. For a very long time, Falvey didn't add C talent to the prospect pool. Only when it became obvious that Jeffers was going to blossom and become too expensive for the Twins did he try to get additional talent into the pipeline. Now we have a gap of 1-2 years before upcoming talent is ready for biggs....unless we trust Vahn Lackey enough to step in late next year (I would think that progressive teams can recognize a Keaschall when they see one).

Yes, Royce was pretty good with the glove at 1B. I think all of that SS coaching helped him with his receiving at 1B. He's no longer super fast, but could be fast enough for 1B. I think the only thing that is holding him back at 1B now is his bat. If he can get back to a good AVG and SLG, he would be a very good 1Bman. He will never be Vladdie Jr, but he could be very good. Maybe we were spoiled by Hrbek and Morneau? We just don't have a lot of good history at 1B. We gave up one Big Papi, who would have been the 2nd coming of Harmon! I am amazed at how similar their stats were!

I definitely would like to have seen more of Cullpepper and Jenkins this year. Sad to wait out the clock on both of these promising players. I am not sure Jenkins will be in the running for ROY next year, so I think waiting was a wasted bench spot. He needs MLB experience and didn't get enough last year. That said, I believe both, and Emma, will be in the starting lineup next spring. I am still a little indifferent about Abel. Maybe it is because of the trade. Is he going to be another Prielipp? Greatness held back by injuries? Roden....1B....uhhhh,,,NO!!! In fact, NFW! For three reasons: 1, Power: none. 2. Experience: See #1. 3. Speed/Quickness: See #1. Strike 3, take a seat, Alan. He is just not built for 1B. Roden was a throw-in for the horrific Varland trade (worst Twins trade ever!), so I am sure the Twins will try to play him somewhere, somehow, just to make the trade look better. The best thing they can do at this point is just move on (even though I find it difficult to do so). The trade is in the past and we cannot undo it. We have Rojas so let's just focus on that. Roden doesn't have much of a home on this roster, just like Larnach, Wallner, Sabato, Tristan Gray, among others. Just move them along to another team where they can hopefully find a home. We are better off starting over with new prospects for these unneeded players.

Is that a justification for trading Varland or losing so much talent? I just see the Twins making far more draft/trade/DFA money stakes than most teams.

Actually the Twins gave up TWO elite relievers that year, Brent Headrick and Ronny Henriquez. They lost Brent to the Rule 5 draft and they just DFA'ed Ronny. Brent should have been protected, no doubt, for all the reasons that you give. Ronny was a weird case, actually doing much better in his brief MLB stints than in AAA. But, he had some promise and there is no reason why they just couldn't keep trying in AAA last Feb 5.. Instead, they just dumped him. Miami quickly grabbed him and he went 7–1, 2.22 ERA with 98 strikeouts in 73 innings. Unfortunately, he blew out his elbow and had TJ towards the end of the year. But, you are right, these decisions are tragic for small budget teams like the Twins! They need those low cost up-and-comers to help round out the roster. Don't even get me started on Varland, the worst Twins trade ever, but even if he was and AVERAGE RP, it was still a horrible trade because he was super cheap for another 4-5 years! This is all on Falvey/Zoll....they made these decisions. I can imagine Falvey, caught up in the excitement of the hyper-active trading spree, when the phone rings. "Hey, we will give you a couple buckets of balls for Varland..." I can imagine Falvey thinking "This is genius...I will solve our outfield problems here and now, and get a great SP too!" The bigger problem is that no one stepped up and said "NO WAY! Varland is starting to shine in the BP and you just traded the entire BP away! We desperately need him, he's cheap for a long time and he is doing well in the BP!" Varland had made 51 appearances in the BP for the Twins that year pitching to a 2.02 ERA and 47 K's. But, no one stopped Falvey-least of all Zoll. While it is an insane trade, perhaps the reason these boneheaded decisions are made by the FO is that no one steps up and says "Hey, that's a boneheaded decision! Stop and think about this for a minute..."

Right....here is what it comes down to: Baseball maxim: You never have too much pitching. There will be injuries. You will need SPs that bounce between the Twin Cities. Preilipp, Matthews, Abel and definitely Bradley belong in the biggs. And all of them have more upside than Ober. We have 7-8 SPs (outside of Ober) that belong or can be used in the rotation. We may have enough. Trading Ryan will hurt, but we could still be OK. Baseball trend: fastballs in the upper 90's. What SP (and even more so, RP's) can survive with a FB that peaks at 88 mph? It just makes no sense and it shows up in his stats. Twins reality: We need RPs, 1B, short term C. Not really to fill out some other positions more than we need to worry about Ober, so combine him with Wallner, Larnach, maybe even Royce to fill some holes. This is how smart small market (budget) team succeed. Puttig Ober into the bullpen makes less sense than non-tendering!

Uhhh...you are putting a guy into the BP with an 88 mph fastball? Really? Maybe if he learned a knuckleball.....but otherwise....trade him!

Sorry, I mispoke! Boston offered Tolle and Arias for Joe Ryan. That was a fantastic haul. Tolle would have easily replaced Ryan through 2030 at low cost. Just the kind of trade that the Twins need to be making to extend players through a series of trades lasting many seasons. Other teams do this all the time--its how small market teams can compete (look at Milwaukee, Tampa Bay, and other low budget teams). But Falvey chose instead to make insane trades at the deadline instead, like trading away Varland. I full agree...if Ryan is not accepting a deal for the next 3 years (and it will have to be at market rates for years 2-3), then trade him ASAP. It might even be too late alreay, because you are never going to replicate that Tolle/Arias offer! But, Mike, I am just so sick and tired of this boneheaded front office! They have been using "low budget" as an excuse for years when, in reality, they are making insanely bad moves. The result is a f'ed up roster.