TheLeviathan

Pfft, a win you say? That just means Rocco stayed home. It's a little known fact that we're 78-0 when he's not in the dugout and 0-68 when he shows up to manage. The hippie should just stay out there devouring people's pets or something. Don't worry, we'll get Rocco'd again soon by such terrible decisions as *checks notes* Pitching his closer.

I saw @gunnarthorpost this, but I'll put it here too: That Harrison Phillips signing is really good. He's the perfect lunch-pail DE for Flores scheme. If they can draft another one, or get a true nose, it will really help this defense go to another level. My number one desire in next year's draft is a DT. Nic Scourton. Walter Nolen, or perhaps my favorite: Deone Walker. I wanted T'Vondre Sweat really badly last year but I'd take Walker. Imagine that guy eating up opposing offensive lines while the rest of the front seven creates havoc.

Good sir...we won. Therefore Rocco had absolutely no impact whatsoever. None. Impossible. This is how logic works my fine fellow!

Rocco'd again. When will this guy figure out that we'd go 162-0 if we'd just average as many runs per game as there are daily, whiney ass, gripefest threads about Rocco on Twins Daily?

This is the specious reasoning that is thriving right now. There is not a single ounce of this that is plausible or makes sense even though it sounds like it when you type it. Let me illustrate: 1) The Twins have been platooning and moving lineup positions from Day 1. For several years. This is not a new thing that just started as the team slumped. 2) In fact, they were doing the very same thing when the Twins were scoring 6+ runs a game during the heat of the summer and performing like one of baseball's best offenses. 3) To put it simply - Rocco hasn't changed anything he has been doing one bit, for better or worse. (Whatever your perspective is) His managerial approach is unchanged. Unchanged from the slump early. Unchanged from the binge in the June and July. Unchanged during this two week nightmre. 4) So the only rational thing to do is wonder.....what IS different. It seems rather obvious: no Buxton. No Correa. No Kepler. Lewis looks hurt. The book is out on Lee. Julien hasn't hit all year. Castro is out of gas. The lineup is devastated. He's fielding AA players at times. This isn't a slump because of lineup switching from the manager. This is a slump because his lineup no longer exists and the guys who are left aren't carrying the scraps of the team they can field. 5) To hammer the point even more about how unfair this analysis is: The accusation is that Rocco is overthinking it by using data to craft the best lineups he can with the few pieces he has....but we're to assume from your argument that Royce Lewis is coming to the plate and thinking "My god...I'm hitting 5th instead of 3rd....stupid Rocco....how am I supposed to hit now!" And ROCCO is overthinking things? Hit 8th. Hit 2nd. Hit anywhere and approach the at-bat like a professional. Or...maybe....just maybe.....this team that was thinned out by ownership penny pinching is out of horses.

You know what else doesn't? Spamming a message board with griping.

At some point, I'm just going to assume this is satire and ask you to continue to perform your act in your head. Then again, this is what the troll horde has wrought.

Making sense is an ineffective strategy on this topic.

Observations: 1. We have so many of these threads going right now. How many places do people who are irrationally upset with Rocco do we need? 2. Yes....it is irrational. A rational person could disagree with Rocco at times (perhaps even most of the time), but also appreciate what he does well. Clearly he isn't always right any more than he is always wrong. Yet the prominent posters we have here (and in the other eleventy threads like this) are never posting about good moves made. No recognition that perhaps Jax is this good because of his usage. Or a successful pinch hit. Or the fact that this team had a sterling record for months when leading late. Do we see any of that acknowledged? Do we even see thoughtful criticism? The answer is quite plainly...no. It's just the same tripe shoveled out again and again. Irrational hate is the only apt description at this point. 3. Yet these folks who have completely abandoned reason want (demand) others engage with their completely ridiculous arguments. When those brave souls do try to point out facts about real-time meltdowns, manager-front office synergy, or reasonable ideas why the decision was made....there is no thoughtful discussion. When @ashbury does a frame by frame breakdown to refute an asinine suggestion for Royce Lewis...is there acknowledgement? Nope. Just banging the same drum. This toxic bunch of trolls wants nothing to do with discussion. They want to spew venom, get some thumbs up, and then rally and harass any counterpoints. @chpettit19is doing a fantastic job in the other thread. @Brock Beauchamphere. What are they getting for their efforts? Good discussion? Nope. 4. Contrary to the beliefs of these trolls...it is possible to disagree with Rocco while also doing so fairly. I would've left Ober in the other night. At the same time...we're talking a pitcher that didn't even start in the rotation last year for workload concerns. And he was taken out for the closer. I'm sorry, but I can never blame the manager when the closer comes in and melts down. Would I have done it differently? Probably. Does it make Rocco's choice worthy of meltdowns? Absolutely not. He went from his best starter to a plan for his two best relievers to come in. If that plan results in a loss...it ain't on the manager even if I would've gone a different route. At the very least, it isn't an unjustifiable path. 5. Rocco has a thinned out roster with exactly two good starters and two (ish?) relievers and a precipitous drop off after them. Including many of the other spots going to rookies. He has a lineup full of guys we either weren't counting on to be starters, abandoned at some point, or are here by sheer desperation. The only regulars in the lineup at this point are Santana, Lewis, and Jeffers. That's it. Yet we're leading in the wildcard. He may have cost us games, but he clearly is doing some things right to weather that kind of a storm and still have us in contention. 6. Constant focus on Rocco detracts from the real villains of this year: the Pohlads. 7. To pretend that he's a terrible manager of the clubhouse despite direct evidence to the contrary is the definition of trolling. You have zero evidence for your suggestion, yet you claim it as if it's true. It isn't possible to engage rationally with opinions that possess no rationality and attempt none. You are griping. Not discussing. Not criticizing. Griping.

This thread has exactly the kind of nuanced, insightful, factual discourse you'd expect. TD has been taken over by trolls.

This interview reinforced that we fired Zimmer at least 1, probably 2, years too late. And I say that as someone who very much appreciated him early on, but if you can only work magic with 90% of the payroll spent on defense.....that ain't magic. KOC is winning with Dobbs and Darnold and Mullins. That's a real coach. B-Flo had the defense playing well last year with a completely wrong set of talents in the front 7. That's a real coach.

This win probably shifts me closer to 9-8 than 7-10. The defense is even better than I thought and Darnold can clearly work this offense.

Whoops! Yup, but he may be out still then too.

Suddenly 2-1 to start the season looks pretty achievable with Malik Willis at QB for the Packers. Watching this defense play in front of the home crowd agains San Fran is going to be interesting.

Darnold looks really good. Like...stupid levels of hyperbole good. Jones looks electric and running with purpose. Lawrence was eating the interior alive early, but quarters 2 and 3 the OL has been dominant. Secondary is forcing Jones to throw to go through reads. Turner, Greenard, and Van Ginkel are a good pass rush.

Dumb penalties, but this is a bad take.

O-line has played much better.

The defensive front has been money well spent.

Oh shoot! A screen that worked!

Back to back beautiful throws.

This guy probably blames Rocco for the Vikings too.

Sitting it out with the board controlled by that exact mentality. I'm trying to find a reason to give it another go, but it's clear what brand of conversation controls the narratives here.

With all due respect Mike, I think you're letting the clickbait headline decide your takeaway more than what Royce actually said. He said he was worried that he wasn't helping. That he didn't feel comfortable. Dude was just being vulnerable. Should he have maybe thrown in some kind of "I'm a gamer" quote....sure. But he's a kid. One who is clearly scared he's going to hurt his team. That counts for a lot in my book.

I just love this thread for taking someone's pre-fabricated opinion, which they stated as a fact, and then having it put on blast by still-frames that show how comically ridiculous that opinion was. What happened to the TD that had insight and discussion rather than toxic preaching that people have to counter with literal frame-by-frames?

Or he's just being honest: he doesn't feel comfortable and he's worried it's going to work out poorly. I think it's fair to allow him to be honest.