I wasn't talking about the world outside. We don't have consensus in this thread that no individuals are being attacked. I would very much like jimmer and Chief and Mike to not feel attacked. (Or anyone else for that matter) I have no reason to attack them. They all seem like fine people who often have interesting things to say. I don't, in any form, think of them, or even their comments, as racist. However, for whatever reason, they seem intent on feeling as though they are personally attacked, even though I want nothing to do with breaking down personal comments and only want to talk about the issue more generally. I feel like Brock, Carole, diehard, and yourself would fall into that camp as well. And while I agree with Psuedo and gunnarthor on a broader level, I've taken issue with the tact they are more inclined to. I've stated openly that I'm not sure it's helpful. But by the same measure, at some point you have to drop the "I'm being attacked" if you're not being attacked. If you're going to rush to be offended or insulted by the conversation, then you're making it about you and it's hard for any of the rest of us to penetrate that. Regardless of tact. As Carole's article suggests, I guess some of us can keep saying they can trust the intent, but until they do there isn't much of a consensus unfortunately.