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    Report From The Fort: Pitching Focus


    John  Bonnes

    It should never come as a surprise when Twins news focuses on pitching, but even by that standard we have a lot. Today included a surprise demotion, the return of the Twins ace, a twist in the fifth starter competition and some news on Glen Perkins. Dig in.

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    A Surprise Demotion

    The big news of the day was that right-handed reliever JT Chargois, who most people expected to make the 25-man roster prior to camp, was optioned to the minors. Mike Berardino has Twins’ manager Paul Molitor’s quotes on the move from before tonight’s game. I hate this move to the point where it is disheartening.

    I’ll make some acknowledgments first. First, the Opening Day roster is not all that important. Second, Chargois didn’t have a great camp. Third, it’s clear they still believe in him and expect him back soon. Fourth, I’m sure that some of the aspects of his game can be worked on in the minors, and he might even have more of a chance to work on them there than he would in a low-leverage role in the majors. I also have only seen him pitch once since I arrived (and it didn’t go well). Finally, I’ll acknowledge that the bullpen is an all-hands-on-deck situation; there isn’t enough talent to hide non-contributors for very long.

    But to change course on the reliever with the highest upside because of a middling spring training performance is either short-sighted or a flawed philosophy. The hamstrung bullpen is exactly why a team should place a player with Chargois’ upside in a low-leverage role.

    Sooner or later (with this group, sooner) there is going to be an injury or a rough spot for Brandon Kintzler or Ryan Pressly or Matt Belisle. And when that happens, the team is going to want someone ready to plug into those high-leverage roles. That player isn’t going to be Alex Wimmer or Justin Haley, at least not long-term.

    (I suppose it’s possible it could be Michael Tonkin, but we’ve been saying that for several years and right now it’s very possible he is outside looking in for a spot. Tonight he gave up a home run on his second pitch, which might not be a big deal if that wasn’t his biggest issue last year as a Twins reliever. He gave up 13 home runs in 71 innings, about 50% more than the average major league pitcher. It’s hard to trust a homer-prone reliever in the late innings of a game.)

    I think the team’s motivations are correct. They are rewarding pitchers who do well with a roster spot. They are evaluating based on results. They are responding to those players who look more “ready” based on that criterion. But I also think that plugging low upside players into low leverage roles is a sound strategy in the short-term and suicidal in the long-term. We’ve been down this path for two years under Molitor, and we know that sometime in June it all starts falling apart.

    Return of Santana

    The Twins tied the Orioles 5-5 as Ervin Santana returned to the mound and gave up one run over four innings. This morning we studied his pitching style and a lot of our analysis held water. Santana does primarily rely on his fastball. His secondary pitch was his slider, and he relied on it versus right-handers (because it breaks away from them). And he used his changeup versus left-handers (because it move slightly away from them), most noticeably to strike out left-handed hitting Hyun Soo Kim looking to end a 10-pitch at-bat and the third inning.

    Tonight, however, in the third or fourth innings, Santana relied more on his offspeed slider and changeup than he usually did. He said it was mostly situational, but that he was also trying to get a better feel for his changeup. “It was working pretty good today,” he said after the game.

    One of the mysteries yesterday was that Pitch F/X listed about 1% of his pitches as a “cutter,” which he doesn’t throw. I don’t know if this is just because he fastball has a little more movement than most, or if his changeup is a little faster than most. Tonight he had a few changeups that were 87 or 88 mph, so perhaps that was what was being tracked.

    Finally, after watching him, I’m of the opinion that he has been successful because his fastball and his slider are both just very good pitches. What contact was made tonight was made on his fastball, but batters mostly have a very defensive reaction to both of those pitches. If he can rely on that changeup (he even used it a couple times versus right-handers tonight, despite it moving towards them), he could have another very good season.

    A Twist In The Fifth Starter Competition

    The fifth starter competition will take an unanticipated twist tomorrow. A few days ago I wrote about how innings are becoming scarce for players like Tyler Duffey and Adalberto Mejia who are trying to win the fifth spot in the rotation. Tomorrow was their turn in the rotation, but Hector Santiago is back and starting vs the Orioles tomorrow night. So at 10 AM, Duffey and Mejia will be facing the Red Sox AAA and AA teams along with their battery mates John Ryan Murphy and Chris Giminez.

    Perkins And Twins Meet

    Finally, we also got some news on Glen Perkins. He met with the Twins and they talked about developing a plan for him that doesn’t include throwing in any games this spring. Exactly what that plan is - whether it means putting him on the 60-day DL or whether he will continue working through his injury in Minnesota or Fort Myers - is not yet determined. But when asked if the Twins and Perkins see eye-to-eye on things, CBO Derek Falvey said “That was the best part of the meeting the other day. We went into it asking how he felt. He said he feels good; he’s progressing. So we feel on the same page, with respect to the plan. I’m not concerned about that at all.”

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    Unless Duffey somehow developed a third pitch this offseason, we should shut the door on his starting career.

     

    I'm not ready to shut that door personally.  We saw in yesterday's Santana thread that Santana gets by on two pitches.  Now you may be right eventually about Duffey, but given the success he had as a starter in 2015, I have to think he warrants another shot starting (unless of course he's front and center saying put me in the pen)...

     

    My bigger concern on Chargois is if a guy like Boshers makes it. He's been bad this spring, so I don't think you necessarily reward that with a roster spot, but the final configuration of the pen is what I'll be watching (that and how short the leash is for a few guys).

    I do think a young player should have to beat out an older/established player. That just mirrors the reality of most other industries. This isn't "rigged".

    I don't necessarily disagree with this paragraph or your post in total, but once again using Phil Hughes as an example, he's been bad for two years, is now on the wrong side of 30 and has seen a large drop in velocity. History would surely show there is much less chance of him bouncing back than there is of a prospect being successful.

     

    Now the front office may have other interests than the fans such as managing a bad contract, but he still is getting every benefit of the doubt over the young guys due to nothing that he has done on the field. Baseball isn't like other industries, we know that due to physical limitations caused be age and repeated injuries that youth is and should be a huge advantage but it's not treated that way.

     

    Not just with the Twins, I'm not singling them out.

     

    My old mantra - we need a coaching staff that knows how to get players over the hump from great in the minors to at least productive in the Majors.  We are wasting talent and the repetition of these events is a solid condemnation of the process.  I also have a difficult time seeing Santiago going as the MLB starter and the two promising young pitchers going AAA and AA games.  We know Santiago.  He can stretch out versus the MIBL players as well as MLB.   What does Paul have to see?  Shouldn't he want to see the progress and potential of the young pitchers?

     

    Chargois does not bother me when I look at his performance, but I have to question the pitching coach and staff who did not help him progress during the ST season when players are supposed to be learning, developing...

     

    I was on the record for not keeping Santiago to be clear.  But the May injury pretty much proved the front office right there. There are two vets in the rotation (Santiago and Hughes) that are not bets for long term success.  One will likely be serviceable... Maybe both will be, but one will likely fail.  The problem is knowing which one. That part isn't easy. You jettison them both now, and there's a real problem if/when the Duffey/Berrios/Mejia contigent struggles... which they will.  So honestly, I can kind of understand it.  If we are lucky, Santiago holds down a spot all year long and big steps forward by Gibson suddenly make the rotation serviceable.  Otherwise, he gets flipped in July and replaced with one of those guys once the season is over or just gets released. 

     

    I was on the record for not keeping Santiago to be clear.  But the May injury pretty much proved the front office right there. There are two vets in the rotation (Santiago and Hughes) that are not bets for long term success.  One will likely be serviceable... Maybe both will be, but one will likely fail.  The problem is knowing which one. That part isn't easy. You jettison them both now, and there's a real problem if/when the Duffey/Berrios/Mejia contigent struggles... which they will.  So honestly, I can kind of understand it.  If we are lucky, Santiago holds down a spot all year long and big steps forward by Gibson suddenly make the rotation serviceable.  Otherwise, he gets flipped in July and replaced with one of those guys once the season is over or just gets released. 

    My comment does not diminish what they want from Santiago, to me it is a question of which pitchers are more important to perform in front of the eyes of management, a vet they know or young players that are important for the future.  Do not forget that Gibson is now a veteran.  In both age and years of service he is not a young prospect any more.  He is now beginning his fifth year in the rotation 32 - 38 with a 4.59 ERA at age 29 with an accumulated WAR of 5. 

     

    I don't necessarily disagree with this paragraph or your post in total, but once again using Phil Hughes as an example, he's been bad for two years, is now on the wrong side of 30 and has seen a large drop in velocity. History would surely show there is much less chance of him bouncing back than there is of a prospect being successful.

    Now the front office may have other interests than the fans such as managing a bad contract, but he still is getting every benefit of the doubt over the young guys due to nothing that he has done on the field. Baseball isn't like other industries, we know that due to physical limitations caused be age and repeated injuries that youth is and should be a huge advantage but it's not treated that way.

    Not just with the Twins, I'm not singling them out.

     

    I see your point on Hughes - he does have the benefit of being a veteran and having a guaranteed contract. He is coming back from a very serious injury, so they are probably not counting spring as much as they would with others.

     

    He'll have by far the shortest leash of the 4 veterans, maybe only 3-4 starts. If he can't perform he'll go on the DL or get bounced to the long man, and one of the young guys will get their chance.

     

    Duffey has an xFIP- for his career. There aren't very many pitchers 25 or under in 2016 with a better career xFIP-. They can't give up on that.

     

    a. Duffey is 26+ years old. 

    b. Duffey's career xFIP is 3.82

    c. Duffey's xFIP is Identical to Nolasco's career xFIP (I have not seen many tears about letting Nolasco go last season)

    d. At least the following pitchers Duffey's age and younger have lower xFIP:  Thor, Nola, Stroman, McCullers, Cole, Matz, Wood, Martinez, Jon Gray, Wheeler, Joe Ross, Erlin, Ray, Gausman, Velasquez

     

     

    This is disappointing as I was hoping that Shaggy could slide into the closer's role by midsummer. How much was the demotion influenced by his spring training numbers being down? The importance of spring training numbers has always been mysterious.

     

    I agree numbers are overrated in springtime but stuff isn't. Don't know this for sure but perhaps the Twins saw something in his delivery and approach that needed work. 

     

    Let's put the blame where it belongs. Monitor's family and Pohlad's family are friends. I would hate to see at midseason the FO wants to fire Paul and Paul tells Him Pohlad's they have not provided the pitching help needed. So the new FO either quits or is forced to trade prospects for immediate help, that would be the disaster.

     

    There is absolutely no way the Front Office will quit or this scenario will play out. I hate the Pohlads more than almost anyone I know but they've always been hands off owners. They aren't Steinbrenner or Jerry Jones. Unless this front office has legal issues, it has three years minimum to turn things around. The Twins are loyal.

     

    The most I could see is the Pohlads forcing the front office to keep Molitor on an extra year past when they want to. But even that seems way too interfering for their ownership style.

     

    What does Paul have to see?  Shouldn't he want to see the progress and potential of the young pitchers?

     

    I know hating Molitor is fashionable on TD but there's not a chance in hell he's the one making these choices. He's a voice in the room but the power structure for MLB franchises is pretty clear (exception being Mike Scioscia in Anaheim).

     

    The FO is making these calls. If we hate them, we should blame the right people. A year ago people would have been all over TR for this but now, they feel like they need to give the FO a chance but also want to vent - Molitor bears the brunt of that.

    There was recently an article on ESPN that teams that commit to rebuilding get better faster than teams that just keep trying to stay mediocre. Also, attendance is not helped by not rebuilding.

    Out of curiosity how did they define "committing to rebuilding"? Seems that would be nebulous enough to finesse the data to come up with whatever conclusion you want.

    a. Duffey is 26+ years old. 

    b. Duffey's career xFIP is 3.82

    c. Duffey's xFIP is Identical to Nolasco's career xFIP (I have not seen many tears about letting Nolasco go last season)

    d. At least the following pitchers Duffey's age and younger have lower xFIP:  Thor, Nola, Stroman, McCullers, Cole, Matz, Wood, Martinez, Jon Gray, Wheeler, Joe Ross, Erlin, Ray, Gausman, Velasquez

    I would take a Nolasco at 26 through his prime. I wouldn't give up on a career xFIP- of 91 through age 25. I certainly wouldn't shut down his starting career. If the Twins front office believes his ERA represents his true ability better than his peripherals I would be very disappointed.

     

    Just my opinion, but Duffy will never be a successful big league starter. He doesn't have the pitches. He might be a very good reliever, though. Move him there now.

    The counter argument is Duffey's control of his curve. If a guy can throw curves as well as Duffey, to me that means he understands the fundamentals of arm slots, which means he should be able to spot his other pitches with the same concepts as spotting his curves. Even if his heater never gets above 92, with good control a guy like Duffey can master the art of pitching, which is about disrupting the batter's timing and fooling his eye. 

     

    The league has plenty of room for a starter whose game revolves around a great curve ball. Could be that Duffey's just waiting for a catcher that knows how to take advantage of his stuff. 

     

    Much more likely they keep Haley as the long man for all the reasons you mention. It will be Mejia or Duffey in the 5 spot and the other starting in AAA.

    I'm hoping that if Hughes doesn't improve his velocity soon, he's the one that moves to the bullpen with Hughes and Mejia both going north as part of the rotation.

     

    I'm hoping that if Hughes doesn't improve his velocity soon, he's the one that moves to the bullpen with Hughes and Mejia both going north as part of the rotation.

     

    Hughes will get 3-4 starts in the bigs to start the year, but I don't think his leash will that long. If his velo doesn't recover he'll get bounced to the bullpen or the DL. But he is going to get a handful of starts.




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