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  • Prospect Dilemma: Should the Twins Roll the Dice on a Pete Alonso Trade?


    Hans Birkeland

    The Twins have a good roster, but with potentially very little money to spend, as they start preparing for 2024. The Mets happen to be owned by a fellow with a lot of money who loves dynamic outfield prospects. Could a trade of Emmanuel Rodriguez for Pete Alonso make sense?

    Image courtesy of © Bill Streicher-USA TODAY Sports

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    The Twins have a real team here. However, they fell short against the Astros, outclassed in their ability to take a professional at-bat. In addition to replacing the likely departing Sonny Gray, the Twins will have to decide whether adding a middle-of-the-lineup bat is worth pursuing.

    They could, and perhaps should, decide to allow the needed offensive improvement to come from within. Brooks Lee and Austin Martin will hopefully steal at-bats away from whatever middling veterans the Twins sign/retain. They will get a full season from Royce Lewis, Edouard Julien and Matt Wallner. Byron Buxton might reemerge, and there isn’t much reason to doubt Carlos Correa’s track record. Maybe we’ll see more of catcher-OPS-leader Ryan Jeffers.

    Still, that doesn’t sound particularly imposing unless all of those players play to their 85th percentile or so of performance, while all staying healthy.

    So it might make sense to add an established, durable bat. The problem is, the Twins may not have any money to spend, given their uncertain TV-rights situation. So they would either need to drop significant salary by trading Max Kepler or Jorge Polanco, or acquire a cheaper player that may cost a ransom in prospect capital from their middling farm system.

    Or maybe there is another way. Steve Cohen is still owner of the Mets, and may have a solution to the Twins conundrum that comes cheap salary-wise, while not costing their entire collection of top 100 prospects.

    The established bat in question is first baseman Pete Alonso. All five of his seasons have resulted in an OPS+ over 120. His lowest number of games played is 152 (he played 57 in 2020). His career platoon splits are separated by one hundredth of a percent. He has averaged 45 home runs per 162 games for his career, and while that may lead you to believe he is strikeout prone, that isn’t entirely true. His career strikeout rate is below the league average at 22.3% (vs 22.9% for the league). He has had multiple seasons in which he struck out under 20% of the time, pretty impressive for someone with that kind of power.

    Alonso will be 29 next year, in his final arbitration season. MLB Trade Rumors projects him for a hefty 22M salary. How would the cash-strapped Twins absorb that kind of salary?

    By trading away a prospect that catches Cohen’s eye.

    You see, Cohen is obsessed with building up his farm system, and has shown he is okay with throwing tens of millions of dollars to expedite the process, focusing on quality over quantity. He paid the Rangers 64M to take on the last year and a half of Max Scherzer’s contract in exchange for top prospect Luisangel Acuna, and the Astros got another 64M in exchange for Justin Verlander and their best prospect, Drew Gilbert.

    According to MLB.com, Gilbert ranks as the 52nd best overall prospect, while Acuna ranks 38th. In between them at 48th sits Emmanuel Rodriguez, the Twins’ third best prospect. It would seem to me that Cohen and his new PBO David Stearns, would be interested in acquiring a potential superstar slugger in Rodriguez in exchange for a player they don’t appear to be building around on an expiring salary. Chipping in 15M to make it happen would be pretty on brand, as well. Publicly, the Mets have expressed a desire to keep Alonso, however they were very direct towards Scherzer and Verlander in saying that 2024 will constitute a "competitive rebuild", leading to both pitchers agreeing to a trade. With Alonso a free agent in a year, he should be available.

    Rodriguez for one year of Alonso is still pretty risky. It's possible the “Polar Bear” would love playing for the Twins and be open to an extension a la Paul Goldschmidt with the Cardinals. But the reality is that any Alonso acquisition would likely be a one year pit stop for the slugger, while Rodriguez could debut as soon as 2024.

    And Rodriguez may be underrated at 48th best. Other publications have him ranked closer to the top 25, with immense power potential and elite strike zone recognition. His defense probably won’t be a major strength, but he runs pretty well and hit a huge grand slam in Cedar Rapids’ championship-clinching win a month ago. He’s been described as having a Max Muncy-type offensive profile, which paired with any sort of serviceable outfield defense and speed would be hugely valuable.

    But it probably means a batting average in the .210s, and that’s if things break right. If Rodriguez doesn’t adjust to the league and can’t get to his power, he’ll join a long list of failed power prospects who dominated the minor leagues but just had too many holes in their swing to thrive at the major league level.

    Brooks Lee is pretty much assured of being at least as good as, say, Gordon Beckham (terrible outcome, but rosterable), while Walker Jenkins could be Bryce Harper for all we know.

    We know prospects like Rodriguez flame out a lot, regardless of how great the farm system is. Some of the Muncy types make too little contact to matter, like the most recent iterations of Miguel Sano and Joey Gallo. Some guys are too passive at the plate, like the Twins were worried about with Edouard Julien. We also know the Twins have a somewhat similar player to Rodriguez in Matt Wallner, who has shown he can make at least some adjustments in the majors.

    To be clear, players like Rodriguez should be close to untouchable, but given the Mets' focus on stocking their minor league system with talent quickly, it might make more sense in this moment then it ever has to dangle him for a hitter like Alonso.

    What do you think? Would you pull the trigger on a trade like this one?

     

     

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    6 hours ago, chpettit19 said:

    How much is Alonso going to cost to re-sign? Could you take Polanco and Kepler's money and turn it into 6 years of Alonso? If yes, then I'd do this trade.

    I agree with the idea that frontline pitching should be the Twins #1 priority this offseason, but I'd do this trade if it is available and they can extend Alonso for between 20 and 25 per year for 6 years. For reference Matt Olsen just signed for 22 a year, Goldschmidt got 26, and Freeman is at 27.

    I think his .205 BABIP in 2023 was an outlier and he gets back to being a .260-.270 hitter with 40 homeruns a year. Which is exactly what the Twins need to plug into their 3 or 4 hole for the next 6 years.

    I don’t get the predicting of guys stats to change for the better, or for the worse depending upon what we want to happen. We can hope they go one way or the other but have no idea & neither do they. You could have said the same thing about Kepler and his return to form at beginning of ‘21 & again at beginning of ‘22…….nobody thought fans would rally around him now, at the end of May ‘23. Nobody knows.

    I know Alonso hit .217 & struck out over 150 times - the impression I have is we already tied for the league lead in HR……& the league lead for K’s.

    Nobody’s paying part of his salary to take him!

    We can’t sign him at a minimum of $25M going forward.

    He’s a lower value with a one year stint being the ceiling.

    Moot point to justify IMO.

    I’d trade Polanco to free up his $10.5M & focus those $$ on pitching.

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    7 hours ago, JD-TWINS said:

    I don’t get the predicting of guys stats to change for the better, or for the worse depending upon what we want to happen. We can hope they go one way or the other but have no idea & neither do they. You could have said the same thing about Kepler and his return to form at beginning of ‘21 & again at beginning of ‘22…….nobody thought fans would rally around him now, at the end of May ‘23. Nobody knows.

    I know Alonso hit .217 & struck out over 150 times - the impression I have is we already tied for the league lead in HR……& the league lead for K’s.

    Nobody’s paying part of his salary to take him!

    We can’t sign him at a minimum of $25M going forward.

    He’s a lower value with a one year stint being the ceiling.

    Moot point to justify IMO.

    I’d trade Polanco to free up his $10.5M & focus those $$ on pitching.

    This article is literally about predicting what both Alonso and ERod do moving forward. I don't know why you don't get that. I predict his stats will bounce back to career norms whether he's with the Twins, the Mets, or one of the 28 other teams. It has nothing to do with "what (I) want to happen," it's simply what I expect. He had a .205 BABIP last year. That's extremely low for any hitter let alone a guy who's usually in the .275 range. Yes, he struck out 150 times, but that, as the article said, is basically league average at just 22.9%. He has multiple seasons below 20% K rate. Just looking at his 150 Ks and implying he's a K machine is inaccurate.

    I didn't ask anyone to pay any of his salary to take him. Why can't we sign him for 25M moving forward? That's Kepler, Farmer, and Polanco with some left over. All I'm told by you and others on these boards is that the kids are here and we don't need the vets anymore so we should have money to spend while the kids are all arb and pre-arb. Shoot, there's people on this very thread saying we don't need Alonso cuz we have Kirilloff. Are you confused by them predicting Kirilloff has his first healthy MLB season ever while hitting better than he's ever hit at that level? 

    I'm happy that's what you'd do. That'll make an offense that is already not good enough for the playoffs even worse, but they do need another pitcher. I don't expect them to trade for Alonso, but it's what I'd do.

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    I would do this deal if the price was reasonable.  I would not give up ERod, but would consider a package of other players. The reason I feel the Twins need to keep ERod is due to Buxton's health, or lack thereof.

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    Doc:

    "I am NOT saying anyone on the Twins will be as good as him, but, there are some guys like Lewis and Kirilloff that have a chance to be regular, heart of the order type of hitters with 22-35HR power to go along with solid AVG and OB ability. (Wallner to a degree as well maybe??) And they are all younger and more cost controlled."

    and Julien

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    I know a lot of people are saying "no" to this idea saying that we need to keep our young talent and focus elsewhere [pitching]. And, although I totally agree with going after pitching, I will say, we know what we would be getting with Alonzo. He would not be a reclamation project (Gallo), he is not a wait and see 'prospect'. He is a pure hitter that we know we can insert into this lineup, and not only will he rake, but he will also be in the lineup all season long... unlike someone collecting a check (Buxton). Alonzo had a down year in BA (.217), but his previous two seasons were .271 and .262, that would have slotted him at the top of this team...

    If we could acquire Alonzo for E Rod, I would do it! Especially if we could follow it up with a deal for Polonco and Festa to MIL for Burnes. Burnes is owed $10mm and so is Polonco, it would be a wash and we could keep a frontline starter for another year, to replace Sonny Gray. Yes, we would then have two premier players on one-year deals, but it will keep us winning and in contention while we work out another TV deal.

    If the Twins go backward too much in the name of saving money, they will lose far more revenue in tickets, merchandise and advertisements than their figures are telling them they will.

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