ThePuck
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Everything posted by ThePuck
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Nathan turns 39 this year, Frasor turns 36 this year, Cotts is 33 and they probably aren't relying on him too much since this is the first year he's been in the majors since 2009. Anyway, the point was, teams like Texas go get talent when they can. To suggest they would consider going after Perkins is hardly a reach and not the slightest bit of a slam against our FO. Additionally, no one says since he closes for one team he would close for all teams. Rafael Soriano led the league in saves in 2010 and then set Rivera up in 2011.
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Exactly. Yanks did that when they got Rafael Soriano. He led the league in saves for 2010 with Tampa and the Yanks signed him and still had Rivera as a closer in 2011.
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There's been rumors that Boston is considering Papelbon again if Philly was interested in trading him. I imagine since the are eyeing the playoffs, they want a guy they feel can, for sure, get the job done. As far as trading in the division, we've been doing that in-season lately. I wouldn't want him to go to Detroit, and I don't think he necessarily would. I don't think they have the chips.
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Not one person here is saying trade Perkins for the sake of trading him. That would be silly if someone actually said that. People are saying if we can get really good talent for him, talent that will help the rebuild, then the Twins should do it. Two different things, entirely.
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We are on pace to have even less quality starts than last year. Our rotation has a BAA over .310. No rotation has finished with a BAA over .310 in at least 10 years (that's as far back as I went). I wouldn't be surprised if that was the case if I went much farther back.
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I'm not making anything up. Teams like the Rangers, they go get talent. Teams like them look at the whole picture. They don't go year to year, they plan ahead. They may even wait until next year to try and trade for Perkins, but teams like them don't sit and wait for a guy like Nathan to leave the team and then say, oh, now, we got to go get a closer. If they can get Perkins, they'll consider it. And where in this debate am I saying the Twins FO doesn't know what they're doing? Where? Point it out. In fact, when have I ever said they don't know what they're doing 100% of the time. I came out and said I loved the Span and Revere trade. That was Ryan doing that, right? I haven't backed off that. In fact, I reiterated that yesterday. We're talking about hether or not he should be traded. Since the deadline hasn't passed and he hasn't been traded, how is there even a shot to take at the FO on the decision, if one was so inclined to do so?
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I love Perkins, always have, but if we are supposedly building for the future (future being realistically 2016), he's only for sure signed till 2015, though they would take the 2016 option. Since he's our best trade chip, you have to seriously consider it, cause developing from within and trading for prospects who need to develop is how they're going about making this team competitive. That takes time. If he stays a very good closer, he'll cost too much for Ryan to re-sign when that time competitive time supposedly comes and/or when the realistic competitive time comes, he'll be 35 or so.
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Detroit isn't set at closer and the Rangers could go younger and cheaper. Boston is supposedly looking as well.
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Yes, the guy (me) who all along has said you should always add quality talent to your team any chance you can get is now preaching wait four or more years. Yeah, okay. I'm saying there is no way to know that 2015, 2016 (or even 2014 as you said), we'll be competitive. You say it as if it's fact. You've stated recently we shouldn't bother adding a talented pitcher like Sanchez (again, not him, just the scenario of whether or not it would have been right to try) because we won't be competitive until 2015, 2016, so why waste the money? Now you're saying keep Perkins during the same exact time frame you say is a bad time to sign quality talent...and keep him during his peak trade time when we could get players to help us when we're supposedly going to be competitive again in 2015, 2016. You don't see anything contradictory with that whole line of thinking? Same principle applies. In fact, he's older than Sanchez. And closers' effectiveness is a lot more unpredictable than starting pitchers. Who is to say he'll be good enough to keep when he's 33 or 34 at the time we're supposedly competitive or that we'd spend what we need to to keep him if he's still a top closer?
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Nathan got his real big paycheck from us when Smith was GM and we were always contenders with him except for his last season with us. We aren't contenders now and there's zero guarantees we will be next year or in the next two or three years.
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Because all of the prospects will turn out just fine and do so right away. No duds and no learning curve.
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Ryan doesn't draft players in the first year's player draft. He has said so himself. Ryan has also said that he goes and talks to the stats guy before he makes a move, but if he disagrees he makes the move anyway. He's basically going there to look for affirmation on what he's going to do anyway and does it whether he gets that affirmation or not.
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Perkins. There are some people who consistently defend the FOs FA moves that say that we shouldn't bother signing quality people now, because we aren't going to be competitive until 2015 or 2016 at the earliest and there's all those wasted years, but also argue we should keep Perkins, who is only cheap now, but who we likely won't pay to keep when he prices himself out of town in 2015, 2016. In other words, he won't be around when the supposedly guaranteed competitive time starts either. I'm sure if Perkins is traded and there's outrage, those same people will flip again and say it was a good move to trade him. He's only signed through 2015 with a 2016 option, so if we can get a good haul for him, why not trade him?
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I'm guessing you never watch his post game interviews, because that's the only way you can say you don't often hear about when he kicks a players butt. As far as his players never complaining about him. After the 2011 season, Gardy did an interview on ESPN1500 in which he said many of his players were defensive with him when he tried to talk to them about things and they were upset because he throws them under the bus. He even used that phrasing. As far as players complaining openly about their manager to the press, you almost never see that anywhere in baseball anymore. That's not a sign of anything really.
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That's a stretch :-)
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If it's just about the stats, not sure how he hasn't already forced the issue. If he hasn't done it already, it can't be done.
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Again, I want someone like Ryne Sandberg. Someone not affiliated with the current team at all.
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How big of a list do you think it is of managers who have not gotten fired after managing their team to 12 straight playoff losses? :-)
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Did you see anywhere where I said that it was my belief he had so little talent when they were winning? I made sure to put supposedly, because, for me, I think most of his first 8, 9 years we had more talent than any team in our division. But if you haven't seen over the last two-plus years where people defend Gardy by saying how great of a manager he is because he did so well with so little talent before and then turn right around and say he can't be expected to win with so little talent, I don't know what to say. I see it a lot.
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Game Thread: Twins @ Rays 7-11 11:10AM
ThePuck replied to Riverbrian's topic in Archived Game Threads
Leaving him in, continuing to leave him in, because of the oh so overworked bullpen. As soon as the two home runs and double were hit, they went into protection mode. Literally. They said 'I don't know how anyone can criticize this decision with the way the bullpen has been overworked.' They aren't necessarily wrong, but I find it funny they have to jump to Gardy and Ryan's defense all the frakin time. It's like a preemptive strike at everyone who dares question Ryan and Gardy. -
Game Thread: Twins @ Rays 7-11 11:10AM
ThePuck replied to Riverbrian's topic in Archived Game Threads
The broadcasters are in full force in their defense of Gardy's decisions. -
I've wanted Gardy gone for awhile, since towards the end of the 2007 season. So the fact that people think he shouldn't go because he can't be blamed for the last three years, I don't know. I do find it funny how some can praise Gardy for supposedly doing so much with supposedly so little talent before and now say, well he has so little talent how can he be expected to win more.
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That was funny!
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I don't think I've argued against any point you've made in this post. I liked the Span trade, I liked the Revere trade. Liked those trades meaning that I liked what was trying to be accomplished by Ryan. The same reason why I liked the trade by Smith iof Garza and company going to the Rays for Delmon and company. hindsight says it wasn't a good trade, obviously, but I liked the intent of the trade, trading perceived strength for perceived weakness. The discussion, though, was about rooting for the team to lose in order to get higher draft picks. Doing trades for more established prospects, I'm all for that. I'm all about getting as much quality talent in ALL ways possible, but I won't root for them to lose. We end up where we end up in the draft and with the way they are playing, we'll get a quality player for sure anyway without having their fans rooting for them to lose. I'm also not a proponent of going hog wild on free agency. I think I've been pretty clear I'd be happy with them spending their 50-52 percent of revenue like they said they would.
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Article: Marketable Twins (1st of two-part series)
ThePuck replied to Jeremy Nygaard's topic in Twins Daily Front Page News
Anyway, to continue on with the conversation, I'd think Doumit would have some value. Willingham isn't performing up to snuff and is hurt. Not sure we'll be able to move him before the deadline but if we can, we should. I like the idea of letting Carroll go to a contender. We aren't playing him, so why not? I used to be on the trade Morneau bandwagon, but I think I've had my mind changed in here on that. I'd like to see us keep him if the price is right and if not. Perkins. There are people who say that we shouldn't bother signing quality people now because we aren't going to be competitive until 2015, 2016 at the earliest and there's all those wasted years, but argue we should keep Perkins, who is only cheap now, but who we likely won't pay to keep when he prices himself out of town. He's only signed through 2015 with a 2016 option, so if we can get a good haul for him, why not trade him?