Riverbrian

You should always be looking for ways to upgrade the roster. Having flexibility provides you more chances to do so because any position upgrade is now possible. If you have the chance to add Altuve to your roster. If you have Dozier you may not because why have two good 2B on your roster when you have holes elsewhere. You are limited to shopping for your holes. This limits your options. If you have Escobar. No problem... add Altuve and move Escobar to 3B or SS. If you don’t have flexibility you don’t get Altuve and you live and die with what you have. If Sano gets hurt you are hurt. If Morrison sucks... you suck. I suppose you could acquire Altuve and trade Dozier but we tried that... there wasn’t a market for Dozier and regardless... the acquisition of Altuve just got harder.

In my cartoon example a page ago. I already have Escobar and Polanco along with Forsythe for middle infield. A. This allows me to move Forsythe over to 3B to get him some playing time if he is earning it. B. It allows me to move Forsythe over to 3B if Sano has to report to Ft. Myers. C. It allows me to move Forsythe over to 3B if Gordon is ready to come up. A. Escobar/Murphy B. Escobar/Gordon/Murphy C. Escobar/Gordon/Murphy

It's isn't always better... Because it didn't go so well this year.

In my opinion, these are the only two reasons that Ryan LaMarre would be on any major league roster. A. The front office believes that he can play everyday in the case of injury or terrible play. B. The front office doesn't believe that anybody will get injured or play terrible and rostered him with the expectation of not needing him and wasting that roster spot. So yeah... I'm with you... Get better players.

I agree about being left in the dust but this particular curve is still ahead.

I agree that he needs reps without question. But.. my unprofessional FWIW opinion is that he might need a little re-tooling and then the reps.

Yeah that's right... Perkins was also a 2009 issue. That one got contentious... and also an example that the supposed "bad will" that is created doesn't seem to stop players from eventually signing extensions.

Hardy was sent down 1 day short in 2009. Alcides Escobar was called up. The MLBPA on behalf of Hardy never filed a grievance. Of course... Hardy was traded during the off season for Carlos Gomez. It could be argued that the extra year increased his trade value. Maybe we could have traded the Brew Crew Alexi Casilla instead if the Brewers wouldn't have increased Hardy's value with that manipulation (that was a joke). Alex Gordon was another in 2009 and he is an interesting comparable to Buxton. Gordon was also a former #2 pick just like Buxton. At age 25 (Buxton is 24), Gordon was a weak hitting 3B approaching his third year of service time when he was sent down to the minors. He returned to the majors in 2010 as an OF. Interesting enough.. At the age of 27 Gordon finally exploded for a dang good 5 year stretch of solid baseball. So let's not give up on Buxton yet.

Ok... but... You are quite a few miles from the point I was making. If my point was in Florida... You are somewhere in Idaho. The context of my point was in response to a couple of posts stating (paraphrasing) "The Twins seem to be playing better". I was responding to why they seem to be playing better by stating that was because they were playing pretty bad before... meaning... It's easy to look better when they were playing so bad before. Instead of typing "they are playing better because they were playing really bad before" it would have simplified my point. I confused things (like I tend to do) by using examples of how bad we were. I used the example of Adrianaza once being our 3rd best hitter to point out just how bad we were. It wasn't a statement of how great Adrianaza is, was or will be... it was a statement that things are pretty bad when Adrianaza is our 3rd best hitter in terms of actual production and he was. If that was a compliment of Adrianaza... it was about as backhanded as you can get. Now... If I head over to Idaho... We might have a different opinion on that but we might not be understanding each other and are probably closer than you think. If you feel that I'm benching Dozier for Adrianaza... I've been misinterpreted. If you feel that I'm not going to tolerate a 3 month slump... then I've been interpreted correctly.

Sure... I'll go with this as well. Whatever gets me that year back.

Sadly... Yeah he was. It was sometime in June, Mauer was on the DL. Kepler was in a deep slump. After Rosario and Escobar... It was Adrianaza who was next best in terms of season production in the every day lineup. He had better stats than Dozier, Kepler, Grossman, Garver, Morrison. If you are talking potential and who should be the best hitters... Of course not... But in terms of actual production in 2018. Yeah... We had a stretch where you could sadly... He was. The mention of Adrianaza wasn't meant to inflate his value... it was just a reference point to how bad we were and how easy it would be for us to be playing better in August.

Agreed but... Because 2nd base is a dead end position. You can can back fill it. Instead of finding 2B that can play elsewhere... Find other positions that can slide into the dead end position. Escobar is an example of this. Daniel Murphy brought on board as 1B is an example of being able to dead end back to 2B on occasion. Also keep in mind that with the shifting... 2B isn't what it was in 1977. Plus there will also be examples of players moved to the dead end position because of the presence of other players at the other positions. Someone like Forsythe may have been dead ended at 2B because of the presence of Longoria. The Dodgers then played Forsythe at 3B on occasion once he was acquired. My examples were extreme in total and strictly for example purposes. I don't expect the Twins to go quite as cartoonish as I did but I want the Twins to start considering flexibility hard and start implementing as soon as possible and I want a manager on board with the concept. The Ultimate goal is getting your best bats in the lineup and not having to die with a slumping whoever because that's all they have to choose from at 1B and not having Ryan LaMarre on the roster because nobody assumed he would play unless the world came to an end. The days of the Tigers moving Castellanos to RF and forgetting that he ever played 3B are soon to be over. In the future... the Castellanos types will play both positions as the team needs change and they are ever changing during the course of every season. I want the Twins prepped for all possibilities and to get ahead of this curve.

Agreed I'm OK with a May call up next year. I prefer shutting him down this year but am OK with that strategy as well. All in all... I want the year back. However the club gets there. I'm alright.

Agreed but I'm sure not unprecedented. OPS+ 7 would probably suffice.

Dozier, Kepler, Morrison, Sano and Buxton were bad and they played every single day. Adrianaza was our third best hitter and now he is not. Wilson caught more games than Garver... now Garver is catching more games than Wilson. Improvement was a poorly managed low bar to clear.

I admit I don't know the answer with 100% certainty but I'm fairly baseball attentive and I don't recall a ton of reports of clubs getting nailed by grievances filed by the MLBPA. Frankly, the CBA not only allows service time manipulation, it basically encourages it. The Cubs manipulated service time with Kris Bryant The Astros manipulated service time with George Springer The Braves manipulated service time with Ronald Acuna The Yankees manipulated service time with Greyber Torres The list is waaaaaayyyyyy longer than this... "the bad look" is worn by every major league club and it doesn't appear as if the bad look has cost the Cubs or Astros or Yankeees in terms of acquiring players.

I'd be somewhat OK with this. But, at this moment... we are theoretically in contention for 2019. Not so much in 2018.

Diehard... You had me at Hello. You are preaching to the choir. I would welcome Dee Gordon to my roster because I like guys who can move around. I see the value in that and like I said... I like speed. But, I do believe that we are no longer talking about a 5 year 50 million guy. Not because his skills have declined but because his skills that produced the 5 year 50 million are not as valuable today.

If he doesn't improve at the plate. The extra year will not matter. The scouts who predicted super-stardom will need to be fired of course.

Nick you did a great job presenting all sides but this one is an absolute no-brainer. Buxton does not see Minnesota soil for the rest of 2018. If he gets September off... he gets September off. Call it for the purpose of getting healthy but it is primarily for the purpose of getting that extra year... back. Buxton has nearly burned 3 years of service time and has produced 340 K's and 70 BB's in 1074 AB's. Career BA .230 - Career OBP .285 - Career OPS .672. This is not the superstar production that the scouts predicted he will produce. What this is... is nearly 3 years of service time wasted culminating in some of the worst offensive numbers ever produced this year. If you believe the scouts are right... you have to wait for it. If you have to wait for it... you need time to enjoy it when it finally arrives. That extra year is huge in case the scouts were right. If you call him up for a month worth of AB's in a lost season, what do you gain? I don't believe that a month of AB's are going to be the springboard to a changed man in 2019 and I know that his defense isn't going to get us into the playoffs this year. When you give up that extra year of control... you run a very real risk that Buxton figures it out, becomes the player the scouts predicted, the player we dreamed of... right before he hits free agency and we get 1 maybe 2 years if we are lucky of Good Buxton to go with the 4 or 5 years of Bad Buxton. If the front office burns a year of his control, while it is easily avoided and justifiable in consideration of production and health. And do it THIS SEASON with nothing to play for. It could only be viewed as irresponsible. If Buxton considers this a "gut punch". Better him than me. Because he has been gut punching me for 3 years and if we lose a year of superstar Buxton because of September AB's of Bad Buxton... that will be more like a cannonball to the crotch. A gut punch will feel good by comparison. This is coming from a guy, who looks at the terms of the CBA and consistently sides with the players. I do think they get the short end of the stick. But, the CBA is an agreement that a GM needs to consider when making decisions on long range plans. Until the CBA is changed to something more equitable to the players... I sincerely hope that my teams front office utilizes the rules of the CBA to their advantage and ultimately as a fan... that is also the front office acting on my behalf.

The Mariners don't have much of a minor league system so the trade didn't yield much for the Marlins. It looks like a salary dump and the Marlins were undeniably dumping salary during the off season.

I wasn't comparing Gordon to Revere directly but I was lumping them all into a light hitting speed genre that is losing supporters in this day and age. Don't get me wrong though... I love speed and I fully admit being in love with Revere during his short tenure with the club. Personally, I'd take Dee Gordon on the Twins roster with his new found flexibility of 2B and CF (Even SS) on his resume. I'm saying that there are some GM's that have moved away from this type of light hitting ball player. At the same time... I believe there are old school GM's (like Dipoto) who still find value in Gordon but those old school guys are starting to fade in numbers. I'm not sure what you meant by "not awesome things happened". If you were referring to his defense... I haven't heard reports of horrible play in CF and the defensive metrics are too small of a sample size to trust, since he made only 39 starts in CF before moving back to 2B before Cano was suspended. If you were referring to his offense... If a position change was impacting his offense... that would make him a china doll and I'm not a sports psychologist. Players have switched positions without collapse. Besides... I wasn't referring to his current numbers or even saying bad things about Gordon. I was just lumping him into a Genre that includes Ben Revere just like lumping Chris Carter and Aaron Judge into a power hitting genre. There will be degrees of ability in every genre.

I do mean that. In today's environment, Willie Wilson would have a real hard time reaching 7700 AB's. I also mean that there are GM's in the game that wouldn't consider Dee Gordon for their roster. And I also mean that the game is producing more 5 tool players then ever before. The Refrigerator that is also connected to the internet will eventually replace the refrigerator that just keeps your food cool.

Speed and defense guys are being replaced out of the game by speed and defense guys who also have power.

The short answer is: Yes he can. He may not but... Yes he can and I support his right to try.