CDog

Was just coming on to say exactly this. I know it's not over by a long shot, but I would say it's already a candidate for the season's leader for "weird" moments.

No question they have issues at 2B. In fact, that's why the conversation on the radio during the game came up. Just passing along what Leyland reportedly said on the subject.

On the radio broadcast last night, they were saying that Leyland had, for whatever reason, said he wasn't worried (or interested or something like that...I forget the exact verbiage) about acquiring a 2B this year. Not that it would be the first time when someone said one thing publicly about their faith or confidence in a player or coach and then went and did something quite the opposite, but that's what they claimed he said.

Starting with paragraph 2...Understood and the sentiment is appreciated. As for paragraph 3, I will continue to take him as he presents himself as I try to do with others. And paragraph 1...I'm going to try not to get too defensive. I asked the question honestly and I'll take the reply at it's worth. However, the question I asked wasn't the one answered. Also, the "roughly 400" is, in fact, clearly made up and that seems not to be in line with the conciliatory tone I was hoping for. And the following comments are not meant to be dismissive of yours nor defensive, but simply continuing discussion (and granted, maybe that shouldn't happen here in this thread): I would truly like to know if I've made a slap--backhanded or otherwise--on a PERSONAL level (and not about the facts or the opinions in the post) that was not in response to one leveled at me. Again, it's an honest question. I don't think I have, and clearly you do. Fourth, when someone says something I don't agree with or think may be factually wrong but don't know, I often will ask them to clarify, and contrary to your claim, usually I am indeed looking for information. That's not typically disingenuous (there are obviously cases where something is really ridiculous and the question may be used as a way to illustrate rhetorically...and I will try to do better with that. There was one in this thread that was asked to illustrate the point I made later more directly. It wasn't meant to belittle anyone, merely to make an analogy). And finally, the post you originally replied to in this thread was in turn a response to a specific post. And, as I asked before, I would honestly like to know if I have ever, ever lashed out in the manner of that post, (especially unprovoked). Or even nearly to that level.

That's your version of an example? And another piece of the puzzle falls into place.

The point was made in the post you first quoted, and was about exactly the topic at hand AND subsequently more directly for anyone who wasn't able to catch the drift of the first question. This after a previous thread where you repeatedly tried to belittle me after taking the opposite of my actual meaning and then doing it again once I had repeated the original intent. Once again, you're showing your inability or unwillingness to read and interpret. I made an honest, sincere attempt to learn from my own mistakes. To you that makes me claim to be a completely innocent and poor martyr. See final sentence of previous paragraph.

You could actually provide an example.

I would like to make a very sincere request that you find a post I've made that: had as little (none) content toward the topic at hand as the one I had replied to that you quoted here; has anywhere near the level of personally aggressive vitriol as that post; or includes an unprovoked attack someone personally. I would like to learn from my mistakes to not be that person. So again...this is a sincere request to find one/some and bring them to my attention.

When and how were these players bashed? And do you really think that was the purpose?

And what did Bill Smith say of them that was considered "bashing?"

Thank goodness.

I didn't look back at yours, but many were silly and light-hearted. My post probably wasn't directed at you. There's having fun and there's being absolutely awful. Those aren't that close together to me. I'd be disgusted with myself if I hadn't reacted to what I read. I can't imagine how I'd feel if I had actually written some of those things.

There was nothing even intended to be funny in my post in this thread. Not one bit.

John's post only said that the team was disappointed not to have Pavano ready. There wasn't a word there to imply it was AT him. "By that" and "at him" are not the same. Which is why I was wondering if there was something from the actual team that implied what you had said.

Well defined by...? Your perceptions?

If you're unable to read and understand a point, apparently by being profane and adding nothing to anything.

Kicking someone when they're down. Ganging up and piling on. Trying to be clever and funny and being neither. Saying someone is worse than pandemic diseases or despicable pedophiles because he hasn't performed as well as you'd like at a game. Did I do that right?

Twins are likely disappointed that Willingham didn't make the All Star team. Are they mad at him?

What's that I smell? Oh...I know.

To bring this back closer to the original topic (but more closely the one that got the tangent going)...The claim is made that you could even tell in the moment how Kirby was raising his game and putting the team on his back and doing all that tough guy stuff that he did in '91. There's also a story I've heard many times that before he went up to the plate in what became probably the most iconic plate appearance in Twins history, that he told Chili Davis he was going to go up and bunt to get aboard for the Chili Dog to drive him in and win Game 6. Davis basically told him not to. Regardless if the story is true or not, what if that story had been told about Joe Mauer? Try to be honest when you think about your reactions...

I got bored after the following...ALL CAPS lines are mine to indicate source. FROM THE PIONEER PRESS FROM A CONVERSATION LATE IN SPRING TRAINING '12 (AFTER HIS LAST OFFICIAL START): Last week in Fort Myers, manager Ron Gardenhire and GM Terry Ryan expressed frustration that Baker wasn’t throwing hard since being held back a few weeks this spring. Baker said it would all come at once; that his velocity would appear when his location did. It’s a process. FROM PIONEER PRESS AFTER START IN LATE MARCH: Radar readings on Baker's pitches were consistently between 83-86 mph. Baker, 30, generally pitches in the low 90s but said he's unconcerned. "As long as I'm getting outs, I really don't care," he said. "I'll pitch to the situation and not try to blow guys away. It's going to be there, I know that. I'm not even remotely worried about velocity right now." FROM ESPN 1500: In 2 2/3 innings, Baker allowed seven earned runs on seven hits and a walk while striking out one. He threw 51 pitches (33 strikes) and induced only one swing-and-a-miss in 23 hacks, and his fastball velocity sat mostly between 86-87 mph with a couple 88's and 89's sprinkled in. "I think, at the end of the day, it's about repetitions," Baker said, reporting no issues with his elbow after the start. "There's only one way to do that. Unfortunately I didn't make pitches when I needed to. Six runs with two outs... Just a couple pitches away from having a game totally different. I was just forcing it, the ball was up. But at the end of the day, as along as I'm healthy and getting enough repetitions in, all of that will come tomorrow." When asked if he thought the ball not coming out of his hand well signaled any major injury issues, Baker said no. "I know it's going to come, it's just a matter of when. I know we've talked a little bit about the velocity not being there, just like I said, it all relates - the velocity, the location, the not trying to overdo it. You have a tendency when you try to force pitches, the results are not to your liking. But sometimes it's not going to come out as good as it can." ALSO FROM ESPN 1500: Baker said the inflammation had subsided on Friday, adding, "it's just a matter of kind of pushing it a little bit and see how it goes. ... "It's tendonitis," Baker said. "I've been there, done that. It's just a matter of getting it taken care of. But if it's not taken care of, it for sure can be a problem if it progresses into something that you definitely don't want to be dealing with." FROM ESPN 1500 AFTER TJ SURGERY: In retrospect, it's clear now why Baker was unable to ramp up into the 90's, but when asked if there were any hard feelings between he and the coaching staff Baker said, "None whatsoever." "Nobody knows what's going on," he added. "Nobody knows what's going on until you get in there. I didn't know, doctors don't know. The doctors don't know until they get in there. I mean, they can have an indication from an MRI, but what can you do until you get in there? To be honest with you, you're not always completely forthright with the staff. I mean, that's any pitcher."

Even at the start of the year when things were going bad, someone who doesn't follow the Twins asked if they were the worst team in the league and I said, "They have the worst record in the league, but I don't think they're the worst team." That was probably more unfounded optimism than anything, but I think it's sorta the same as you said. AND...they also have been an above .500 team for over two months now. Man, that makes me sad that they started so so so so so poorly.

Source for them having that reaction?

Do you seriously believe that? That he may not know he has to try hard and adapt? If yes...wow. If no...I apologize for missing the sarcasm or whatever it was.

There are some guys who've come back and been pretty much all the way in a year. I think average/median/typical is a little longer, but expectation would be that he'd be pitching by the start of the year and more or less fully ready by mid-season. At least from what I've read. I'm not a doctor.