gunnarthor

Well, we will see. In any event, we've spilled thousands of words on Carl and Ryan and Smith and they aren't here anymore. I really do hope that ownership doesn't interfere too much into this FO - although Molitor as manager is a bad sign, of course.

Wait, Molitor's managing a college team, too?

Could be a bit of chicken egg here. The Pohlad's weren't going to let a GM spend money and Ryan knew that. Ryan's natural baseball beliefs were that young cost controlled players were better value than expensive vets. (Your point on international signings is a bit out of context because for most of Ryan's run, the Twins weren't spending the money to get involved in latin america, for example, because the Pohlads weren't going to spend millions on it. Just like they weren't going to spend millions on draft bonuses). So Ryan worked well within the constraints he was given. But the Pohlad family hasn't done anything to suggest those constraints are gone. It's only the first offseason but the new FO cut payroll and has let high salaried players get first crack at playing time and looked for cheap vets to fill out the roster. A lot of Ryan-like moves. But I will never stop blaming the Pohlads for massive penny pinching that truly affected the Twins ability to win. Seriously, **** those guys. And until we actually see differences, I don't think we should give them the benefit of the doubt.

Well ... that's one view

I know some are really big on the old "take best college hitter" strategy but man, he terrifies me. He's hitting but he's striking out a lot against players who won't make it past A+ ball. Sickel's reported that he had trouble with the wooden bats in a very small sample size. I know we don't draft for need but if he's a defense only CFer, he doesn't really fit. I'd rather they went with a pitcher.

I guess I'm not following your logic here. If you're talking about the Twins not trading Mauer, Morneau, Baker, Koskie et al, you're talking about not trading key parts of winning baseball teams. I'm not sure there was ever a good period to trade Morneau, for example, although I do remember people advocating trading him in early 06 for Ty Wigginton. (Losing Cuddy and Koskie and Hunter and Everyday Eddie and Hawkins actually gave the Twins multiple draft picks under the CBA at the time). Koskie was the starting third baseman for three straight playoff teams, why would we trade him? During the early 2000s, the rip on the Twins was that they kept trading away players or letting them leave by FA to get draft picks. Smith did a fair job locking up a young nucleus of players through their first year of free agency but that was about it, other than Mauer and Morneau. If you think the Twins should have traded those guys while they were still cost controlled because they weren't going to win a world series, wouldn't you be advocating trading Sano now? I agree that the 2011 crash was really hampered by the injuries that key players got but Mauer was already under contract. Cuddy turned into Berrios. Liriano and Young just failed to develop, which was a real problem but I'm not sure it was realistic to expect either to have been traded right after the 2010 season (although in hindsight that would have been the time). So I'm not sure what moves would have been realistic at the time. Sure, Valencia had a nice rookie season but no one thought he was anything better than a serviceable third baseman, for instance. Trading him after the 2010 season wasn't going to bring much back.

I mean, to each his own but Ryan didn't want to contract the team, the owner did. The Pohlad family didn't go over recommend slot because they were close personal friends to Selig. Ryan didn't con the tax payers into paying for a new stadium that greatly benefited the Pohlads. Ryan isn't the one who set the fake 52% payroll theory. Ryan wasn't the one that cried foul on baseball economics for a ****ing decade while we slashed our payroll. Ryan played the good solider. Smith was fired when he didn't. Falvey and Lavine aren't going to have any more room to spend in FA than their predecessors did. Maybe they'll spend better, maybe not. But FA isn't going to fix the Twins.

Yeah but it's also pointless wishing that the Pohlad's operated any differently. I hate our owners and I think they should sell the team. But I've been bitching about these guys since 94 and it gets old. The Twins don't get to act like other teams in part because of market size but also because of ownership dictates. Fans should probably realize that. We can bitch - for instance - about some of our draft moves prior to 2012 but we should always remember that the Pohlad family had placed limitations on signing bonuses. We can bitch that we don't go over the international pool but we should probably note that ownership isn't going to allow it in the first place.

Pohlad isn't going to pay for Machado or Harper or Kershaw. The 4/55m type FA deals are probably the biggest they feel comfortable doing.

Oh, wow, man. I mean, that was a tough chance with Dems in the White House. No chance at all now. We'd need another 2008 for that to happen.

sigh

No, the knock on him was his size - 5'10" - and weak arm. If his defense slid a little bit he was the dreaded "tweener" not enough power for the corners and not enough defense for center. I remember really hoping Tate would fall to us (shows what I know). I'm ok with Jay over that list for now. I think he can start and his stuff is still pretty exciting.

Yes, the Yankees did a great job of leveraging their money to impact their farm system.

Is this in order or just random? Because Faedo ahead of Greene is somewhat surprising at this point.

The Twins had a great farm system for many years. You keep saying Twins have been bad for 5-6 years so farm system should be better - arguably because the Twins would be drafting high. The problem - again - with your statements is that you ignore the graduated years and the years we didn't draft for and the year we drafted middle and make some grand conclusion that doesn't really fit. The reason the Twins system is ranked low by BA (and 11th by Klaw) is because of how people view Jay and Stewart, full stop.

They've spent just fine on the international market. You're complaining because they didn't go over the pool amount to compete with the Dodgers et al. As I posted above, they complaints right now are about the 2013-2015 drafts.

The Twins had a great farm system for many years - http://www.baseballamerica.com/minors/2017-organization-talent-rankings-line/#lyhgouhlRTS70kVV.97 They graduated out a lot of that talent. Not just two guys. So again you're just judging a three year window/snapshot and making far too large conclusions of that. And you're comments again seem to indicate that you expect the Twins to hit on every pick. You disparage the 2012 draft because only "two" guys were big time prospects while it gave us three other players - Duffey, Chargois and Rogers - who can play important roles for the team going forward.

I thought there was something about Santiago that took that option away. But I'm not sure. I think in general you're right but I think there might be an obstacle in this individual case. That said, it's a moot point since the Twins aren't going to cut him.

Sickel's write up on Kendell - http://www.minorleagueball.com/2017/3/6/14814248/jeren-kendall-of-vanderbilt-2017-mlb-draft-report Pros: Fast, good defender, good make up Cons: real questions about the bat. Did really poorly with wood bats in a SSS.

And yet the five year period you're using to judge isn't relevant to the current state of the system. Last year's record hasn't affected the system because we haven't had that draft yet (and as soon as the draft happens, it's very likely that the Twins will vault back into the top 10). The 2011 and 12 records don't impact it either because they've graduated. So, again, what you're really complaining about is that Stewart and Jay aren't universally declared top prospects.

If the Twins remove him from the 40 man roster (i.e. cut him), Hughes can refuse the assignment to the minors and sign with another team. The Twins would be required to pay him the difference between his contract and the new one. So if he signed with Atlanta for the league minimum, we'd save 550k or so while paying most of his salary. If Santiago has 5 years of service time, which he does, he can also refuse an assignment and sign with other teams. The confusion comes from waivers where a team can make a claim for a guy on waivers but takes the risk of getting stuck with the players contract.

You certainly seem to think so

And yet you constantly post like you expect it. Kohl Stewart was a risky pick - a HS pitching arm is the most dangerous pick in the draft. Fans demanded that we do so. And now those same fans are blaming the Twins because Stewart - despite being 21 at AA and logging a crapton of innings - isn't highly ranked on prospect lists. That seems to suggest an unrealistic expectation.

I don't think Hughes is in the same boat but Santiago might be, although he might not be either based on his service time. Someone smarter might know how that works better than I.

I think it's better to say some people aren't as pessimistic. As noted, guys like Klaw and Sickels have better views of the Twins system. I think it's a bit stupid - frankly - to expect that every pick hits. Top picks fail for everyone. And arguing that the Twins don't spend money in FA so they need to be better isn't particularly riveting. The Twins had four top 6 picks. So far, none of those four have failed and all are on pace to make the majors. Some of their ceilings should be lowered.