bird

USAF, I believe those revenue statistics support the statement, made frequently by Twins management, that they intend to spend roughly 50-55% of revenues on player salaries. If the revenues, over the first three years at Target Field average say, $250M, then I think we can be critical of the organization if the average payroll over the next three years falls much below say, $125M. If they don't sign at least one decent FA pitcher this winter not named Hamels or Greinke, I'll probably fall in the camp of questioning them. The media in this town has been dreadful when it comes to the really tough questions, and they should pin Jim Pohlad down some time about this subject.

This thread was full of informed and sensible arguments. So the contrast between those comments and the opinions expressed by Mike Wants Wins and Fanatic Jack is stark. How can anyone possibly assert that the Twins didn't fill a single hole? And Jack, this C.H.E.A.P. crap you keep spewing out is ignorant at best. The facts back up what the Twins (not the Pohlad family) promised regarding spending. They spend, ON AVERAGE, roughly 50-55% of annual revenues. The Twins are not cheap. I will concede, however, that they might be as greedy as the fans, who want it all, or the players and agents for that matter.

Ryan's comments reveal his humility, and his willingness to be self-deprecating and to admit faults. Thrylos, you could learn a lot from this man. He may lack "education", and some of you may be smarter, but his sensibility is admirable. And what an idiotic notion, MWW, that this organization resists "math and science". What they reject is the pompous attitude of superiority some of you possess, thinking that your spreadsheets and numbers present the picture. My bet is that every single one of you numbers snoots were crucifying the Twins for trading away Billy Bullock, who threw 94, for Diamong, who threw 90. Every one of you. Guess what? You were wrong once again. The dinosaurs, despite their stupidity and backwardness, were right once more.

If you read back in this thread, MWW, you WILL find that "trade him for anything you can get message." And exactly what strawman argument did YOU see? THAT's the thing I missed. There are several viable options, including offering a fair three-year deal, trading him for Dan Hudson level return, offering him arbitration and either living with the compensation pick or living with his expensive presence, and perhaps dangling him again at next year's trade deadline. Those are reasonable options. The option that is unreasonable comes from the "dump him for anything crowd, and that crowd does in fact exist.

Good post, Andrew. Unfortunately, A+ Fort Meyers has a team OPS of .671, 9th of 12 teams. Rochester: .665 OPS 12th of 14, New Britain: .675 OPS, 11th of 12. Looking at all three levels, Oswaldo Arcia and Daniel Santana are the only two players who have decent statistics. Two players.

Twins, please please PLEASE be sellers. ALWAYS be sellers, but only sell when you will be overpaid.

He's snarky.

My wish list: 1. The team is NEVER a buyer, and ALWAYS a seller. 2. Selling is for prospects ONLY. 3. Sales happen ONLY when a team will overpay. 4. Every player is ALWAYS on the trading block.

Classic thrylos garbage analysis to support his belief. Calling this crap "proof" is blatantly dishonest from an intellectual standpoint. Congrats, thrylos. Aren't you a genius!

On the contrary, Turd, the Twins have gone over slot frequently. The notion that they have "let the better players go" is simply erroneous. Even the argument that the Twins have failed, relative to other teams, at drafting well is specious at best. All teams "fail" plenty. On a separate note, it will be interesting to see what the team does regarding international signings. Is this how they fill in the gaps regarding infielders? It would be nice to see them make an aggressive bid or two this year.

Classic thrylos "analysis". One-sided garbage to support a belief. Intellectually dishonest crap.

jharaldson, you on the right track in actually comparing the draft record against the other teams. Sure beats the ignorant statements in a vacuum about how the Twins drafts have been terrible in the past ten years. Wouldn't you agree, twinswon1991?

Jim Crikket, I think that's a pretty good take. There IS a strategy in place. Remember, last year, through 50 rounds, the Twins picked 24 LHP's as I recall. So apparently this year, the spotlight is on hard-throwing college pitchers. I'd sure love it if one of the mainstream scribes would ask the kinds of questions that might give us some genuine insight on this stuff.

shanewahl, this is not a criticism, just an observation about your take on the Adam Johnson draft year, where all of picks #2-10 were busts. So, if the Twins had drafted one of the eight others who busted instead of Johnson, that pick may have succeeded in the Twin's system? This logic is so very contrary to what most people seem to think, which is that being subjected to the Twin's development prowess greatly reduces a pick's chances for success. My belief is that these players succeed or fail on their own merits for the most part.

I've never wanted a Twins choice to suceed more than this pick. Why? Because I'm so tired of hearing how the Adam Johnson pick proves the Twins are bad talent evaluators by fans who conveniently ignore that NONE of picks#2-10 that year panned out. I have to admit Buxton makes me nervous, given the "hit tool" is the one in question, especially the power potential. But something else tells me they will, and SHOULD take him or Correa at #2. I'm even MORE nervous about these college pitchers.

What a great thread! Thanks everyone for an intelligent and thoughtful discussion.

A couple years years ago, the best we could put on this list were guys like Valencia, Plouffe, Hughes, Manship, etc. We correctly assessed that none of those players were going to be difference-makers. Sano, Dozier, Rosario, and Hendriks versus those guys? So, this farm system has improved. Anyone who thinks this top ten is void of exciting prospects is utterly clueless. Don't you agree, twinswon1991?

I seem to recall that Benson was injured for the better part of a couple of those years. This may have hurt his development some, but I think it's accurate to say that he's been assessed as being overly excitable and unfocused. These obstacles may be hard for him to overcome. Also, Tosoni is coming off an injury, so before we label him a bust, we should see how things play out.

So, twinswon1991, please regale us with a better explanation as to how the scouting department failed here. Tell us in which round Tosoni was drafted, for example, and then explain why you think competent scouts, as opposed to a band of clowns, would have found a better player with that pick. Back it up with a fact, OK? Band of clowns, huh? That's not what I see, but I do detect the smell of ignorance out there somewhere...

Back to booing Mauer...those of you who have managed stock portfolios know that a stock can go down because investors don't know what to expect in the future. When uncertainty is prevalent, a vast majority of investors get real negative and very emotional. This is when the minority buys what the negative guys sell. Mauer's stock has fallen because we don't know what to expect from him yet. I think the boos are from negative, uncertain fans. This WAR stuff? Nah. These boos have nothing really to do with a deep analysis by the boo birds. Now, I've thought of booing General Soreness too. You know, I don't want him to change his swing to produce more power. But dammit, couldn't he occasionally adjust his swing in hitters counts and look to loft it out? Geez.

I'm with Seth and others who want to lock and load for 2014 and beyond. ANd that's what I think they ARE doing. SO): 1. I do close to nothing before the trade deadline. Parmelee will get enough AB's and he's not overmatched up here. Yes, I might DFA Clete Thomas or one of the Gray/Maloney combo just because I can't stand watching them, but their 2012 replacements, guys like Tosoni, Revere, Waldrop, Guerra, and Robertson (unlike many of you, I think Slama will fail in MLB), are served well in AAA for now. 2. I dandle the whole damn 25-man roster at the deadline, for prospects only. I want value, but pitching will be my priority. I'm not fussy about the current level in minor league ball, just interested in future talent, hoping for two or more quality prospects per trade. No one will want Mauer bad enough to offer value, and unlike others, I'm not concerned about freeing up budget with him. The likely trade chips are Span, Willingham, Pavano, maybe Liriano, and Perkins. I have to get what I want, and if not, I continue to do nothing and let the season play out. BUT, I expect to get at least one pitching prospect that will be ready to challenge for a rotaion spot in 2014. 3. Baker gets an incentive-laden one-year deal. My rotation in 2013, with injury alternates, is probably Baker, Liriano, Blackburn, Gibson, Hendriks, Wimmers, Diamond, Swarzak, and maybe Stuifbergen and one of my trade deadline pick-ups. Maybe my 2012 1st rounder is knocking at the door by 2014. I will probably pick up one mid-level FA starter for even more depth. But, for 2013, I'm banking on keeping the fans engaged with my everyday lineup and the new blood: Benson, Dozier, Parmelee, Revere, Tosoni...and with growing excitement about that next wave: Hicks, Herrmann, Morales, Michael, Arcia, Rosario, Sano...PLUS whatever I've garnered at the trade deadline. 2015 is looking good to me now....

Which three Rock Cats everyday players impress you guys the most?

It's erroneous to conclude that the farm system is horrific based on a (probably pretty valid) perception that we lack MLB-ready starters right now in AAA. It's a problem, but there are strengths too, throughout the system. Unfortunately, the injury bug continues to make things look even bleaker than they are. If Gibson, Wimmers, Stuifbergen, and Soliman were healthy, if Gutierrez and Waldrop were healthy, if Tosoni and Roberts....this is not an excuse, but if the system were as thin as people suggest, our full-season teams should be struggling to win games to a greater extent than they are.

Well, thank God Maloney, Gray, and Burton are dumb enough to play for Gardy. Unlike those exceptional performers of the past like Slowey, Dickey and Breslow. Another steaming pile of bunk from thrylos.

This guy's premise is unadulturated nonsense. It's a bit offensive if you ask me.