chopper0080

IMO, of course you trade him, and you try and get as many minor league power arms as you can. It was silly of the Twins to not move him at the deadline last year, and would be silly for them not to move him if his value ever increases this year. Glen Perkins will not be a top end player when this team is competitive. That, and Alex Meyer is looking more and more like a bullpen arm every day. We have other power arm talent in the minors out of the pen. No reason to not move him.

I'm so glad the Twins didn't trade him when his value was high...

I get neither May or Meyer set the world on fire, but throwing strikes is something they can learn at the MLB level rather than get fringe players to chase filthly stuff outside the zone the MLB guys will laugh at. At some point the Twins are going to have to stop protecting 25 and 26 year old professionals and put them in the deep end. Why not do so when expectations are low so they can be at full speed and can take the load off the hitter when they move up. Also, if these guys are good enough to beat out Pelfrey, Stauffer, Shafer, and/or Robinson, they probably shouldn't be sold as the future of the team. Again, I just don't see any reason Hicks, Meyer, and May aren't learning at the pro level right now other than they just aren't that good. If that is the case, then the team probably shouldn't be preaching those guys as the future of our staff.

OK, but I know what Jordan Shafer and Shane Robsinson are as MLB players, and I don't know it because of Spring Training. I know what Mike Pelfrey is, along with Tim Staufer. I understand Arcia's fielding issues, and Hunter's age. What is Pelrey going to do that Alex Meyer can't? What is Tim Staufer going to do that Trevor May can't? Are you really telling me that Hick's awful hitting is worse than Shafer? Is Molitor not creative enough to figure a way to get Hicks or Rosario at bats? I get it with Rosario, Sano, Buxton, and Berrios, but what more does AAA offer Hicks, May, and Meyer other than sub par competition? Allow them to figure out how to get MLB hitters out from the bullpen and possible spot starts. Force them to figure out how to get MLB hitters out IN the strike zone. If they fail, they fail. It will be due to poor scouting more than anything else, and the team can move on. Inconsistently great is better than consistently bad every day of the week for me, and our roster is consistently bad right now. Unless Vargas and Santana pick up where they left off last year, it could get real ugly, real quick.

That is a 2002 garbage excuse. The Twins payroll is what they say it is. If they choose to use it to buy several pieces of trash rather than one good player, that is their choice, and shouldn't be an excuse for failing.

Maybe you meant slowly unraveling, because I haven't seen one positive thing come out of the past three years of awfulness. The Twins have been treading water in terms of being terrible, and selling magic beans as the answer the whole time though they fail to ever plant them (other than Hicks/Gibson).

Many years ago I found out that I was going to be a father. It wasn't planned, but I went out and tried to gather information to prepare myself for the responsibility. I thought I was prepared. I wasn't. However, I used the information I had, found some things that worked, and learned that other things didn't. A couple years later, my second child arrived. It was still a challenge, but I took my previous experience and used it to become a better parent in those early years. I haven't been on this board for months, mainly because my time is valuable and the Twins haven't deserved my time with the garbage they have trotted out on the field the past few years. The Twins have refused to acknowledge that they have a problem, and that has been proven by being unwilling to ask questions and look for answers, which is how problems are solved. Some people on this board said they saw progress after the 2014 season, I disagreed because the Twins didn't get any answers. They do not know how their top prospects fit in the Major Leagues which is a problem if the team is serious about becoming a winning team. Some people point to Aaron Hicks and use that as an example of why it is best to proceed with caution regarding prospects because he has failed to date. I look to that as proof in why you need to bring your prospects up to see how they respond to the pros. As much as we all want Aaron Hicks to be succesful because of his high draft status, sometimes it doesn't work out that way. Just like I wanted to be a good parent, there were too many variables for me to know how I would do until I had to. Hicks has showed the Twins that he is a flawed player, may never live up to his draft status, and that is ok. Now the Twins know that if a better outfielder becomes available, they need to go after him because they don't know if Hicks will every deliver at the ML level. That is how a farm system should work. Don't fear failure, just search for answers. This Spring, the Twins have failed again. Buxton, Sano, Berrios, May, Meyer, Rosario, and Hicks all have shown flashes of ability, but we have very little information on how any of them will do at the ML level other than Hicks. So why not move those players who are furthest along to spend April with the Twins. Maybe they do well and stick. Maybe they do poorly, and move down to work on where they struggled in the bigs. Either way, it is a great measuring stick for both the team and the player to see where they are in the process. Instead, the Twins will trot out AAAA players who have no future with the team, whose equivelant will always be available, and will ensure the Twins have zero shot at a winning season in 2015 and possibly 2016. It is very possible that I am being over dramatic, and that those individuals who are paid handsomely know what they are doing better than I do. However, every year that seems less and less the truth, and appears the Twins fail to recognize that in order to progress, you have to move forward. Hopefully, I am wrong, and maybe this trade deadline we will finally be talking about something different rather than repeating the debates of 2014, 2013, & 2012. We will see.

When you consider almost every FA starting pitcher is overpaid for, this is a pretty decent contract. I like going about the SP spot with quantity. Should keep us from having to dig too deep into our system this year. I like the power arms that can potentially come out of the bullpen if May and Meyer struggle in spring training. Gibson can stay a 3 or 4. Santana is a fringe 2, but as hitting declines, pitchers are putting up better numbers. Depending on where Meyer, May, Burdi, and Jake Reed end up out of spring, there could be some fire coming out of our bullpen.

Bullpens are the new 40 home run players. If you look at the top bullpen era's in baseball, 3 of the 4 teams in the league championship series are in the top 10. The only team outside is the Cardinals. The ability to shut the game down after the 6th inning is huge and keeps you from having to depend on starters going deep in games. If I was the Twins, I would be copying the Royals model of top end relief pitching, athletic OF defense, and depth of starting pitching over top end quality. And we are a rebuilding team.

I'm sure Ryan's call to Maddon went like this. Ryan - "Hey Joe" Maddon - "Hey Terry" Ryan - "So Joe, you taking the Cubs job now?" Maddon - "Well, it's the only serious offer I have received so far, and there aren't many open jobs." Ryan - "Well Joe, it stinks that you are taking the Cubs job. We would have loved to have ya. Best of luck." *click* Maddon - "Hello?"

So, my final thoughts on Maddon not coming to Minnesota. 1-We are the only team with a managerial opening right now. 2-Our GM said he would hire the best guy for the job. 3-Maddon has more wins as a manager than all of the other serious candidates combined. At some point you either get things done or you don't. Sean Connery had a great quote in a movie about doing your best. This is just another time where the Twins will come up short in their pursuit of something, and will redirect the blame somewhere else. This mentality permeates through the organization. It is ok to consistently fail because of X, Y, and Z. Before we couldnt' compete because of big market teams. Now we can't compete because we are rebuilding. The problem can't be with us, it must be with something else. ridiculous

First, I don't believe the Twins will do what it takes to get him. Having to pay large money to someone outside the organization, especially someone who is unconventional, is not really the Twins MO. I'm sure the Twins will inquire about him, but I don't see them doing what some other teams will to get him in. Second, managers in baseball are overrated. They don't have systems which their front office acquires players for, and they don't really have too many schemes which create a competitive advantage. That being said, Maddon is good with younger players which is what I like the most about him in this spot. That is the main reason I would pursue him if I was the Twins.

First off - The royals grasped the most basic concept behind winning a World Series...you have to make the playoffs. This is where I believe Ryan has failed, but could make quick process if he was willing to take a gamble. Secondly - Getting hot, and winning big games is about having something you can hang your hat on as a team. Something you can go out and do, control, execute. In baseball, the easiest of these is defense. After defense, putting together a shut down bullpen is next. Hitting and starting pitching comes with a ton of variables. Building a team which can say, every game, we are going to play top notch defense, and shut down games from the 6th or 7th inning is an easy way to a contender which is what the Royals have found out. If I am the Twins, this is what I emulate. I trade Sano/Arcia for a plus outfielder who can hit, or a legit #1 SP (Mat Latos would be fine). If Buxton can be a plus outfielder right away, I bring him up. I bring Meyer up from day one to pitch in a bull pen role. Same with Reed and Burndi. I sign a legit infield and outfield utility player, Hicks could be that guy. I bring in a manager who understands the need for defense, and can get the team motivated to this thinking. Latos Hughes Gibson Nolasco May Meyer Reed Burdi Perkins Honestly, with that pitching staff and a good defense, we can get to the playoffs.

Meh, MLB managers are overrated. All they really need to do is get the players all going in the same direction. The defensive shifts, bullpen management, and lineup setting are all kinda overblown. You obviously have to have a high baseball accumen, but in terms of affecting the game, baseball managers do very little. It is an execution based sport which does not allow for many unique systems or schemes which result in a competitive advantage. Make sure you interview all the candidates, and pick the one who you believe can best motivate your team thru the grind that is the baseball season.

This was I had read, and thought as well. It may be different, but I have never read any publication or article by the Twins to make me believe they thought they were trading for a #3 SP at best at that time. If the Twins thought they were trading for an elite RP who had the potential to be a SP, then was a bad trade. Why trade a valuable asset like Span for that type of player when you don't even have to?

So, what is your point? Meyer wasn't a draft pick at the time. I believe he was already in AA. If you can't figure out close to what a player is going to be at that point, you have some issues. Again, if you thought he was a #2 SP and he turned out to be a #5 SP, it happens. But if you are mistaking a guy in AA for a #2 SP when he ends up being a RP...you need to go.

A couple thoughts. The first thing that struck me is that when discussing a lack of leadership, and any potential leaders, Joe Mauer's name is not even brought up. While I don't believe every top player needs to be a leader on the team, but it sure would be nice if our highest paid player was one. Not shocking, but still a pretty glaring omission. The 2nd thing is Ryan even discussing punting 2015. Come one man. At least pretend your are interested in trying to contend. 3rd...that is a lot of money spent on a guy you need to fix in terms of Nolasco. Just saying. Other's have called out the "Twins Way" nonsense. Payroll talk is always a joke. I don't know what Pelfrey has on this staff, but the fact that he is being mentioned in future plans is funny to me.

PLayers getting close to contract years can be available, even if they aren't advertised. The Marlins prefer to avoid large, long term financial commitments. that is known. That Nats have starting pitching, Gonzalez may be available due to positional depth and overall budget. Teams won't "shop" these players, but most guys can be had in certain situations. These players have been named because their situations dictate that they may be available even if they aren't being shopped. No one is saying "trade for Strasburg" because their isn't a reason for the Nats to get off of him.

Look up awful scouting. Folks act like like their isn't a group of professional people who are paid to scout and identify talent for the Twins. Mistaking a #5 SP for a #2 SP is acceptable and understandable. When your scouting department can't identify the differences between SP and RP at the AA level, that is being bad at your job. Your investor losing money investing in Apple is understandable. Your investor losing the same amount of money investing in penny stocks is not. It is him being bad at his job.

I said I liked the move, reread my post. I also said that results in trades matter. Trading Span for top of the rotation SP prospect was the right move. The Twins identified Meyer as that type of player. If he doesn't turn into a SP at all, then it is a problem. Either a scouting issue or a coaching issue depending on why he fails to be the player they traded for him to be.

You have been very clear in offering an alternative path of which the Twins could have followed rather than the wait and see approach of Ryan. IMO, the alternative viewpoint, which is the one which posted the question originally, is reaching at this point. I did not have an alternative plan of action, but I think yours is very good. Signing more international free agents would have been a much better plan, and would have given this team more assets to wrk with.

Quality, young players are generally not "available". You have to be proactive in searching for them, and make solid offers, comprised of good players to get them. If you prefer 30 year old guys entering the end of their prime, wait for free agency to start. I'm sure the next Nolasco will be available.

2009 Cardinals Chris Carpenter Kyle Lohse Joel Pinero Todd Wellmeyer Adam Wainwright...only one from their farm system Pujols Molina Schumaker Thurston Ryan Duncan Rasmus Ludwick (they traded for Matt Holliday) So their pitchiing staff was made up from players from outside the organization, and their hitting was made up of guys from inside.) 2010 pitching staff had some changes Jaime Garcia was brought up Cards acquired Jake Westbrook, Brad Penny, Jeff Suppan) Holliday took on full time role felipe Lopez was brought in John Jay and David Freese moved into more of a full time role) 2011 Kyle McClellan took on a more prominent role Acquired Edwin Jackson Cards brought in Lance Berkman Ryan Theriot added Furcal mid season 2012 Lance Lynn takes on a more prominent role in the staff Lohse & Westbrook still starters from outside the organization Joe Kelly gets some starts Added Beltran so 3 of the top 5 Cardinals in At Bats are from outside of the organization (Holliday, Beltran, Furcal) 2013 Cardinals replace Lohse with Shelby Miller Kelly takes a larger role Matt Carpenter takes a starting role as does Allen Craig Matt Adams and Pete Kozma get some at bats 2014 Justin Masterson & John Lackey brought in from outside Michael Wacha takes on a larger role, gets hurt, comes back Jhonny Peralta brought in Kolton Wong takes a larger role Oscar Tavares gets some at bats So, for the past several years the Cardinals have used free agency to bring in veteran pieces to take on prominent roles for their team. Prospects have been brought up in supplemental roles initially, but then are rewarded with expanded roles in following seasons. Matt Carpenter, Matt Adams, Lance Lynn, Michael Wacha, Shelby Miller, Jon Jay and Kolton Wong have all followed this path. So yeah, if you just want to cherry pick where the Cardinals current roster is at, yes, most players are from their system. But what you fail to mention is how those players were added in over time, and in smaller roles initially. The Cards were a veteran team, and have implemented their farm system as the years have progressed. Nice try though.

Like the Cardinals re-signing Matt Holliday? The Cardinals do a very good job of keeping a mix of veteran players and young players. They don't put themselves in positions where their young players come up, and are depended upon to carry the team. We should take note of that.

So, the best way to emulate the Cardinals is by building a competitive, veteran MLB team, and then incorporating your farm system as players prove they are ready, carving out roles for them, and not depending on them to succeed right away.