DaveW

My thoughts exactly. DeDuno is old enough where he already lapped up everything Butera needed to teach him anyways.

My thoughts as well, plus there really wasn't/isn't some huge rush with Whimmers, its not like he is currently accomulating Major League Service time or anything. It sucks, but I agree, you don't want to just start cutting people open at the first sign of trouble.

Who knows if that was option was even on the table though, and with Hernandez perhaps he does have an upside if the Twins can work with him on his curve ball and change up. I mean they have pulled it off before, and don't you dare forget about Butera and his bilingual ways!

Whoa its been awhile!

To be honest I would be very dissapointed if both Gibson and Hendriks aren't big parts of the rotation next year (maybe not right out of ST, but by May/June) Diamond, Gibson, Hendriks, FA/Trade, FA/Trade. DeDuno, Hernandez, DeVries, Walters, Blackburn, Baker? (cheap contract when he recovers) waiting in the wings.

Right color, wrong flavor. It's actually the "coolant" flavored kool-aid.

Yes, I am drinking the "Sanchez is a better pitcher then Liriano because he has outperformed him in every meaningful statistical measure" kool-aid.

Royals have had 6 pitchers get TJ surgery thus far this year. I hate how long they waited on this one, but surgery should always be the last option. Let's hope Wimmers doesn't need TJ but if he does he gets it done sooner rather than later.

I wouldn't mind two of Colby Lewis, Sanchez, McCarthy and Harden. Also throw Baker an incentive laden deal and plan on having Gibson, Hendriks, DeDundo, Walters, etc fight it out for the last couple spots. (Diamond is a lock at this point)

Any of you guys need some last minute help before the playoffs? Guys like Ross, Bay, Venters, Romo, Burton, etc can be had for next to nothing. (see:Swap 2nd round MLB pick for 3rd round MLB pick) Guys like Laroche and Morneau are avail as well but will take a keeper in return. Also, holy hell my team tore it up this week! I have some holes going into 2013 but I think I am looking at a .500 team with the potential to sneak into the playoffs next year.

40 man roster issues are the least of this clubs problems moving forward, they will easily find spots for these two guys and there could even be more openings in the next couple days if additional trades are made.

Your using Pavano as an example?? Really? The guy that had like 100 ip in his first 4 years in the AL? Can't argue with that logic.

Who needs facts when you can just continue to make things up as you see fit?

Sanchez is a significantly better pitcher then Liriano and infante is one of the better hitting MI in baseball this year. Also the Tigers are apparently planning on extending Sanchez long term and were desperate for MI help. Liriano is a guy who has a 5.25 ERA over his last 220 IP

Encouraging to see Benson hitting well again.

Yeah, but I'm not the one claiming that Ryan has screwed up by not trading Span thus far (which is what you have been doing). People are screaming that Ryan has dropped the ball by not trading Span already, yet haven't produced one report of an offer. Seriously, its just bitching for the sake of bitching.

Did not see that, either way like I mentioned in another post if the Twins had no desire to keep Liriano around, why not trade him for what you can get instead of letting him walk for nothing? Hell, I wanted the Twins to bring Liriano back for 2013+, but there were several posters here who didn't want him back (50/50 split).

I said who knows if the Twins tried to resign Liriano at any point in this season. We didn't hear anything that indicated anything either way, other than a few reports last week that the Twins were closet to 100% trading Liriano. What past few trades do you speak of? What do you mean "how he handled his past few trades"? You realize he wasn't the GM for the Young and Santana trades, right?

Yeah, it was just a gut reaction because of a few things:1. As fans we ALWAYS want stud players in return. 2. As Twins fans we know that Liriano still possess the nice ability to blow away batters. 3. Many of us were guilty (me!) of thinking that Liriano would bring back a nice prospect package. 4. I had never heard of either of the two prospects we got back. But after reading up on these guys it appears one or both could eventually help out our big league club, and at the end of the day we were trading a guy who has posted a 5.31 and 5.09 ERA in the past two seasons, projection is great and all but at the end of the day results matter. I still at this moment wish the Twins would have signed Liriano to a 2-3 year deal and I wish they could have fleeced some dumb GM out of some high upside 19 year old. Just because that didn't happen doesn't mean I'm ready to crap all over the orginzation and run Ryan out of town. These past two years have been frustrating but I have hope that Ryan can rebuild this club, its not going to come over night but once we hit the free angency we should have a better idea of his long term plan. Not to mention he still might be able to trade Pavano and Capps before August 31st (plus Span could be traded any minute now as well) It's one thing to be dissapointed to lose Liriano for so little at the end of the day, its another thing to use it as some bizzarre justification to fire everyone in the org, but the majority of the people who are saying that have been crying about Ryan's leadership the whole year anyways, even going as so far as to making up reports/sources of him turning down trades that were never offered. Obviously I will sound like a ridiculous homer compared to that garbage, and frankly I am glad I do.

I'm not praising Ryan for this trade, I'm just pointing out that it isn't the abortion many are thinking it is. The market sucked, and at the end of the day Liriano was a 5.3 ERA pitcher (5.09 last year), those guys aren't going to bring you back top 100 guys no matter how much you hope they do. Until we hear of a specific trade package that Ryan turned down for Span/Willingham etc it's really stupid to bitch about him not trading them at this point. For all we know the teams have been offering C+ prospects for Span thus far. If you show me a report where the Twins turned down Cingrani or Hamilton for Span then I will agree that Ryan blew it. I agree that Span needs to be traded at some point, but there is no reason to rush it as he will have plenty of value this off-season and on into next season.

How does Sanchez solve anything moving forward though?

Which players sans David Ortiz has gone onto some better career after they left the Twins? Garza? Not really as he was already effective on the Twins, even though that trade certainly sucked.

Yeah, he'd have to improve that third pitch, which the Twins have had some success with in the past. Even if his k rate drops you can sometimes live with a 6 k/9 rate. It's when you start dropping below that when you begin to approach Blackburn/Pavanoness territory.

Yeah, this is just bull****. What "past" examples are you talking about? Do you and Thrylos share sources that share these imaginary "the Twins wouldn't trade Willingham for Bundy straight up" scenarios? I have yet to see one reported offer for Span or any other Twin player yet.

Also looking at Hernandez we are forgetting two things: 1. we have the latino pitcher whisperer still on the roster. 2. His strike out rate isn't amazing, but it isn't as awful as many are making it out to be. Last year he had 9.4 k/9 in AA and 7.3 k/9 total for 2011. This year his k rate dipped quite a bit in AA but his ERA also was respectable 2.75, and I know this is short sample size to the max, but he does have 17 strike outs in 18 innings at AAA this year. He is still relatively young at 23 and apparently is trying to figure out his curve ball, if the Twins can help him with his third pitch is it unreasonable to think he couldn't at post a 7 k/9 rate in the majors? He isn't a strike out machine, but he isn't exactly Pavano/Blackburn at this point either.