jokin

Let's see how desperate they are. How about their top 2 MI prospects (who are clearly better, now as minor league prospects, than what the Twins plan on playing in 2013), Salty and Lester?

I think the Sox already are projecting Napoli for some 1B duties. And they have talked about moving Salty. He would be a good get in a package deal, along with their top MI prospect and two SPs, a vet and prospect. Hey, after this last trade and the Red Sox's desperate need for relevancy again, anything's possible.

I think they would be laughing at how excited we are about a #4 starter and a prospect with some big mechanical issues to work out. Still it's a great trade for the Twins because Revere is replaceable. Likewise in philly both of these guys are replaceable. i just remembered that a fantasy forum was calling him Vance, Vance Revolution. I get that side of the trade. I was referring to their level of anticipation about making Revere their CF.

It's really strange... I can't describe it... I'm pumped about two decent arms coming to us... And floored at.the reality of the loss of my favorite Twin. Like I said previously, no pain, no gain. On the bright side, I think you'll get a 2.5 month Maestro bandwagon to get onboard with, followed by Hicks. 2 exciting guys to rally around.

Or the "do the Phillies have a competent Front Office?" question can be put to rest.... Just because Barry Zito got 100 million several years ago doesn't mean that was his "value" 2006-2012 Team W-L Results Twins 570-563 .503 winning % Phillies 638-495 .563 winning % Phillies had 5 straight Division Championships during this run The Twins had 2. The Phillies had 2 World Series appearances, 1 win The Twins? Don't ask. I'd take a little more of that Phillies level of "incompetence" around these parts.

No, I think Gibson's chance of being in the Opening Day rotation is very much in the air. But now that the Twins have at least $25m to spend (based on current payroll and last year's number), they're going to have to go get somebody (or, more likely, multiple cheaper somebodies). I think the chances of going after some middle infield help has risen dramatically in the past hour. Boston and Baltimore have MI depth if the Twins are willing to pull the trigger again.

And I'd still consider it a mistake but I think Revere will do better in the NL and that ballpark than he ever would in Target Field. I fully agree, he's made for the NL and that park and a classy organization. I wish him the best. I just don't like the supposed Twins fans on a Twins blog who still want to get one more kick at a guy- who's done nothing wrong- as he's going out the door. Generally, I only kick the player, not the person. I like Revere. He's a blast to watch. He seems like a great guy who just wants to play baseball. But as a player, I don't think he's very good. That doesn't mean I wish him ill or anything, I just don't see his skillset playing out over the longterm. A valid opinion, his numbers and arm illustrate his strengths and weaknesses. The Phillies, who in recent history have been a very successful franchise, must have looked past those numbers and come to a different definition of "good". I wonder if anyone is tracking the Phillies fan response to the trade?

No pain, no gain. I'm planning on enjoying following the minor league teams a lot more next year.

But right this very minute, Hicks is ahead of Benson. Benson had a horrible year last year, getting demoted twice. I know some of that was due to the hamate bone and resulting surgery. But he started slow and never got going. Hicks got going and continued through the fall land Winter leagues. Hicks is my favorite to win the job out of spring training. Do you think the Twins don't routinely promote the inferior guy, if in their mind it's a better business decision?

And I'd still consider it a mistake but I think Revere will do better in the NL and that ballpark than he ever would in Target Field. I fully agree, he's made for the NL and that park and a classy organization. I wish him the best. I just don't like the supposed Twins fans on a Twins blog who still want to get one more kick at a guy- who's done nothing wrong- as he's going out the door.

Now the question is.....WHO?! I'm hoping Marcum. Marcum, Worley, Diamond and Gibson in the front 4. Not great, but it's a start... If you told me that'd be the 2013 rotation a month ago and the loss from the deal was virtually nothing (considering the Twins ALSO got May for Revere), I would have been pleased as punch. Concur. However, is it more than 50% certain that Gibson breaks with the team in April in the rotation? I'd say it's still highly doubtful, especially if they decide on a specific inning limitation. I also am not holding my breath that they get Marcum unless they move Willingham or Morneau.

Oh, Ryan hosed the Phillies, without a doubt. And I was never that down on Revere's value. I thought he had a decent chance of maintaining his value through 2013, which is when I hoped he'd be traded (though I always said if an offer was there, take it and run like hell). But I never valued him very high. There's a difference between how I value a guy and how one of 29 other general managers might value that guy. I don't believe I ever said the Twins couldn't get value for Revere, I simply said that extending him was ludicrous because his ceiling was relatively low (and that I think no-hit speedsters are a mistake in general). I'll stand by my prediction that if he has a strong season in a ballpark favorable to what he does best, the Phillies consider extension talks in the offseason.

Let's just say more than just a few TD regulars are stunned at the haul the Twins got. I'm pleasantly and enthusiastically "surprised" that the Twins could pull this off--- as they have historically tended to undervalue their assets and overvalue their acquisition targets.

Bingo. The Phillies could have afforded a Bourn but got Revere on my "percentage of salary valuation" argument basis. No question though, Twins got a great trade. I'm excited that they have finally folded their cards and prepared for 2014/15. Philly very likely can't afford Bourn or Hamilton I've heard arguments both ways, but if you evaluate their cash flow, it probably only would have involved moving a vet or two to have made it happen.

MLBTR is reporting that a "good" prospect was also included. If true, that is ONE HELL of a haul for Revere. Care to reconsider your evaluation or did Ryan do a major hose job on the Phillies?

Bingo. Contrary to some who think otherwise, the Phillies could have afforded a Bourn but got Revere on my "percentage of salary valuation" argument basis. (FWIW- If he performs at all in CF, which he should in that small ballpark, he'll be the top Range OF guy in all of MLB and end up getting extended after 2013) No question though, Twins got a great trade. I'm excited that they have finally folded their cards and prepared for 2014/15.

Here is the thing about the 2012 Orioles...they weren't that good, they were extremely lucky. Was it a good baseball story to follow? Hell yes. But at the end of the day they are due for a huge regression in the W/L column. Not only were they the luckiest team in baseball last year, but I would venture to say one of the most lucky teams in the last 25 years or so. You need to look no further then then their pythagorean record and their results in one run and extra inning games. The Orioles would be very foolish to get all "win now mode" and sell away the future of the franchise (they have a good young core in the farm system. Finally. They won't dismantle that now) At this point, if I had to make predictions on the season the Orioles will probably be favored to finish in last place in the division, and that is no exaggeration. The Yankees are the Yankees, the Rays continue to be a solid ball club, the Blue Jays just brought in almost a whole new team! and the Red Sox won't be down for long. You're analyzing the Orioles like you're 2000 miles away from them (which you almost are, if you're from MN). Duqette doesn't strike me as a guy with the inferiority complex that you seem to think he should richly embrace. Yes, they were "lucky" last year, but their fans expectations for 2013 are a lot higher based on their 2012 luck, so there should be a penchant around the franchise to make the necessary moves to build on last season's W-L success, foolish or not, taking the slings and arrows for regressing from last season by taking no chances seems like a worse outcome for the Orioles FO. Actually I am about 200 miles away from Baltimore, and made a few trips down to Camden last year and have a quite a few friends who are O's fans. From talking to them, they all realize that last year was a fun ride, but largely due to luck. Orioles fans are excited moving forward, but they have their eye on 2014 and 2015, when guys like Bundy, Machado and Gausman will be making a huge impact (and the Yankees will be extremely old/The Rays will be getting in trouble etc) The O's aren't going to mortage their future for some misguided "win now" model in the best division in baseball. If the Orioles fall to last place, the FO will be viewed as misguided in their approach and jobs could very well be on the line. Davey Johnson aint getting any younger either. He'll be 70 next month and would probably rather strike while the iron is hot than wait to try for a title later. As you're from the neighborhood, you are aware that the Orioles have hit kind-of a long dry spell of late.

See above. The Twins should strongly consider him if available.

Zing. Hey, I am probably going to need the Orioles as my alternate team for yet another year, so why not?

That + what I said.

Here is the thing about the 2012 Orioles...they weren't that good, they were extremely lucky. Was it a good baseball story to follow? Hell yes. But at the end of the day they are due for a huge regression in the W/L column. Not only were they the luckiest team in baseball last year, but I would venture to say one of the most lucky teams in the last 25 years or so. You need to look no further then then their pythagorean record and their results in one run and extra inning games. The Orioles would be very foolish to get all "win now mode" and sell away the future of the franchise (they have a good young core in the farm system. Finally. They won't dismantle that now) At this point, if I had to make predictions on the season the Orioles will probably be favored to finish in last place in the division, and that is no exaggeration. The Yankees are the Yankees, the Rays continue to be a solid ball club, the Blue Jays just brought in almost a whole new team! and the Red Sox won't be down for long. You're analyzing the Orioles like you're 2000 miles away from them (which you almost are, if you're from MN). Duqette doesn't strike me as a guy with the inferiority complex that you seem to think he should richly embrace. Yes, they were "lucky" last year, but their fans expectations for 2013 are a lot higher based on their 2012 luck, so there should be a penchant around the franchise to make the necessary moves to build on last season's W-L success, foolish or not, taking the slings and arrows for regressing from last season by taking no chances seems like a worse outcome for the Orioles FO.

I dunno man, Hammel doesn't do a whole lot for me. He was pretty mediorce prior to last season and couple that with the injury thing I don't think he is worth targeting at this point. If he had a couple more years of team control, or if the Twins were looking for "one more piece" then I could see it happening, I just fail to see the upside here, especially if you are trading a guy who could have a lot of value in a trade later in the season (Morneau) Would the ante be upped if the Orioles would consider Willingham and Parmelee in the same package- ie, two birds killed with one stone? What about their willingness to part with Roberts as part of the deal (who could later be flipped by the Twins?) Roberts has been absolutely dreadful the last 2 seasons and is owed a lot of money for 2013. Who are you saying they should trade for by packaging Willingham and Parmelee together? Bundy? Machado? It ain't going to happen. You would probaly have to pick up some of the Bird's "weak sauce" (the thrify Orioles would likely want some dilution on the payroll inequity of the deal) to get what you really want. I know they won't trade Bundy, but they do have other decent pitchers, Gausman in effect, becomes superfluous, for a team, like MWW says, can "taste it" in 2013. And if they can taste it without Machado in the mix and can be induced by a throw-in prospect or two, I think you can make a win-win deal

I dunno man, Hammel doesn't do a whole lot for me. He was pretty mediorce prior to last season and couple that with the injury thing I don't think he is worth targeting at this point. If he had a couple more years of team control, or if the Twins were looking for "one more piece" then I could see it happening, I just fail to see the upside here, especially if you are trading a guy who could have a lot of value in a trade later in the season (Morneau) Would the ante be upped if the Orioles would consider Willingham and Parmelee in the same package- ie, two birds killed with one stone? What about their willingness to part with Roberts as part of the deal (who could later be flipped by the Twins?)

You haven't read the official TD handbook, I posted as much as you have proffered, recently. The apparent official rule on Free Agents at Twins Daily is 95% of the time or better, the FA ALWAYS chooses the biggest contract; unfortuanately, based on statements and actions in the offseason, I'm not holding my breath that Ryan is willing to overpay enough to make it worth it to any top tier or top-of-the-mid-tier SPs to come to the Twins, especially now with the downgrade on defense.

Promises, promises. With the names currently being bandied about as his FA pitching targets, he's already proven ridiculous and broken your heart and you don't even know it yet.