twinsnorth49

Shark metaphor where the shark is the trunk and the conquistador is the killer or the Shark is the killer and the conquistador is Laporte......or it means absolutely nothing, except that sharks eat a lot of junk and because they go through a tonne of teeth, it's very hard to tell how old they are. Not sure what that has to do with the FLQ. When the hell are those Winter meetings again?

Kill has things going in the right direction but after getting 7 of the top 9 last year, he only has one in-state commit for this year, the top four are all going out of state. Bit of a weak year though, no 4 stars, Brookins and maybe Onwualu would have had a shot as sophomores. Avoiding North Carolina by cancelling the 2 year series didn't make Kill look to good though, doesn't jive with his tough talk about being competitive and paying the price. Still like him though.

Cowgirl In The Sand (10 minute guitar intro, just to mess with you) Tell Me Why Cortez The Killer Helpless Walk On Comes a Time Actually just get Decade, that'll get you through the mid-seventies at least. Three Pistols Little Bones New Orleans is Sinking On The Verge 50 Mission Cap (songs about Bill Barilko, genius) Nautical Disaster This could go on for days. Adele? Dude, you're killing me

So then we agree. The Pohlads didn't put a dime of their own money towards the new stadium. Does everybody else think that payroll is magically going to shoot up once the Pohlads pay of their $150M bill they are footing, which like Chief said, is being paid off via revenues? Once it is paid off, our payroll SHOULD go up that amount to maintain the 50-52% into payroll. Does everything really think that will happen? I for one see where Chief is coming from. Let's review this again, if the Pohlads borrowed the money, they would pay down the loan with stadium revenue. If they paid all the money up front, they would pay back the expenditure each year with stadium revenue. You say potato, I say potato. Payroll has gone up with revenue, what's the issue? Investing $150M has a far higher rate of return than the debt service on borrowing it, it's pretty simple. Rich people

Try stupid girl, or, a man needs a maid. I'd try "Locked in the Trunk of a Car" or " She Didn't Know" by the Hip, solid.

So then we agree. The Pohlads didn't put a dime of their own money towards the new stadium. "Get your money for nothing, chicks for free".......sure why not. http://www.websmileys.com/sm/drink/trink39.gif

I tend to agree with you but there are enough megalomaniacs out there like Bielema for him to have a slight chance. What an idiot.

They actually paid for their share of the stadium up front, using their own money = they are able to use all current revenue (minus normal other expenses such as minor leagues, travel, etc) to support player payroll (minus other normal expenses, i.e. minor leagues, travel, etc.) They actually didn't pay a dime for the stadium up front, instead using other people's money = they first must extract loan payments from current revenues (and then take out normal other expenses) before using said revenue to support player payroll Why else do we still hear the "52% of revenues to payroll" line? None of their other expenses (with the probable exception of revenue sharing) changed dramatically when they moved to TF. The cost of running their minor leagues didn't change. The cost of travel for the team didn't change. The cost of their other employees didn't change dramatically. Why would payroll expenditures still be "around 50-52%" of revenue? Why would a business arbitrarily reduce it's margins just because they moved? Revenue has increased, so has payroll, I wouldn't expect them to increase the percentage they pay towards it. They do have one additional expense change that didn't exist at the Dome, a $150M loan payment. The fact is, it makes way more sense for the Pohlads to borrow the money at a favourable interest rate (probably payable to themselves from their own investment firm), than to shell out that kind of working capital that could be earning considerably more in the marketplace. You need to get over rich people knowing how to get richer, they can have their cake and eat it too.

From the Twins own site on MLB.com: $260 million comes from Hennepin County and $152 million comes from the Pohlad family and the Twins. Initially, ownership pledged $130 million for the ballpark but will pay an additional $22 million to cover costs associated with ballpark enhancements and fan amenities. Ownership has also pledged an additional $15 million to augment infrastructure upgrades outside and around the ballpark This is also from your link. Under the proposal, the Twins would contribute $125 million, including a $40 million payment up front, with the balance to be paid prior to completion of construction. Hennepin County would fund its share -- including $235 million in construction costs and approximately $84 million in site development

http://minnesota.twins.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20050425&content_id=1028207&vkey=news_min&fext=.jsp&c_id=min http://minnesota.twins.mlb.com/min/ballpark/new_faq.jsp So it's actually a $40M payment that was owed up front, that's pretty typical in order to show you can raise the capital, it's also from the Twins, not the Pohlads. So where is the part about it having to be their own money, from their own bank account?

Insanely paying $150M up front? First off, they promised to pay $150M up front. If you can't see how it makes a difference whether they borrowed the money, or invested their own funds, then look no farther than their player payroll budget. That should help illuminate it for you. Secondly, the value of their franchise went up something on the order of $200M before the ink was dry on the stadium deal. I'm thinking any smart business person would invest $150 to make $200, or $150M to make $200M, and add in greater annual revenues to the pot in either case, by the way. Or...I guess even better...if they could get away with it...invest $0 to make $200M. Payroll has nothing to do with them shelling out $150M up front or borrowed, it's based on projected revenue.In fact, if they ever did decide to break the bank and throw a whole bunch more money at payroll, they would be in a better position to do it with $150M sitting in the bank than buried underneath a baseball stadium, that's what banks are for, borrowing money! They didn't make $200M just because they decided to borrow the money. And, they have to pay the money back, that's money they would otherwise have in their pocket, which they don't, which makes it out of pocket.

Not if the money you're using to pay back the loan comes from using the Ferrari itself. And I would have no problem with even that, except if the public paid for 70% of the Ferrari up front, and you promised to pay for the rest of the Ferrari up front, out of your pocket, which you then failed to do. Then I have a problem with it. What difference does it make if they paid up front or borrowed it? Either way they are either paying back the loan through stadium revenue or recouping the loss from insanely paying $150,000,000 up front to build something that will take years to pay for, from stadium revenue. Paying for something of that magnitude up front is pretty poor use of capital and a very bad business practice. One which no smart business person would do.

Completely clueless on the timing, what a whack job this guy is! Seriously why would he not just wait until after the MSU game to throw his entire team under the bus? Nice teammate, come out in the media as a whiny, self-centered jerk the week of your team's final game, one with the opportunity to improve their Bowl position, what an ass! Not to mention, he could have maybe done it in less than 4000 words and multiple p.s's. Go to English class A.J. He's done himself a real favour trying to get on with another BCS team next year, what coach would want to go near a guy like that? Maybe Bielema, although if he think's Kill is a maniacal sociopath, wait till he gets a load of Bielema!

Bringing it up again because they're so lauded in their development, but the Rays have not drafted a player that's made the major leagues since 2008, and they're the only team in baseball that can say that. See above, how would that help?

Sure is. Just look at how easy it was for the Pohlads to spend a half billion of other people's money on their new stadium. What's hard seems to be for them to spend their own money. $350 million is how much was bonded by the county. Unless you want to include the Pohlad's 125 million contribution as other people's money. Operating Target Field costs the Twins about 10 million a year and they pay 1 million in rent. No free stadium ride there. There is a hesitance on the Twins part to pay people outside the organization. They have been more than generous within for the players. As of yet we do not know Ryan's capability to gauge free market pitching value. Marquis was a fifth starter. That is what they were looking for. This time last year a starting rotation of Liriano, Pavano, Baker, and Blackburn looked solid. Ryan did ok with replacing position players lost due to free agency. I doubt the Pohlads put a penny of their own money into stadium construction costs. They borrowed the money, and are making payments on that loan from stadium receipts. Net out-of-pocket: zero. So if I borrow money to buy a Ferrari and pay it back with money I earn, it doesn't really cost me anything? http://www.websmileys.com/sm/crazy/114.gif

in fact the ownership group from baaaston , loria and the commish PUD selig were all charged with the rico act in 2002 but once again the good ole boy network slipped off thr hook , now pud is looking imnto the trade?? hahaha what a joke selig is just sticking his hand out for a little taste from loria , if you look at the contracts that all 3 signed they are backloaded , as loria intended to trade them all any way ..time for pud selig loria and the wilpons to be removed from baseball to keep the games intergraty johnnydakota>English language http://www.websmileys.com/sm/violent/sterb035.gif

Some have more talent than others, they're the ones at the top of the stat line. Where do you find the character stats? What are the metrics?

I posted this during a different discussion on Yunel, it 's a worthwhile read on cultural differences and being a product of your environment. It's also from a perspective entirely outside of baseball , which is why it's void of the usual rhetoric on such matters. http://www.theglobeandmail.com/commentary/yunel-escobars-slur-didnt-come-from-left-field/article4582951/

But it starts with talent.

I'm getting pummelled over this by my Blue Jay "friends", c'mon TR, throw me a bone. http://www.websmileys.com/sm/sport/sport25.gif

If another company owned the Blue Jays that figure would be substantially higher. The Jays are owned by a cable company which owns sports networks in Canada. The 36M is a figure they made up to pay themselves and doesn't reflect the reality of the situation. This is from Forbes magazine. But Toronto is owned by $14 billion-in-sales Rogers Communications, which also owns sports channels that pump through Blue Jays games as well as those of its other two teams, the NBA’s Raptors and NHL’s Maple Leafs. The company’s strategy of using sports programming to boost profits has been paying off and shares of Rogers have been outperforming the market recently. On top of the increase in carrier fees Rogers can command from its sports programming, last year Rogers Sportsnet paid the Blue Jays a rights fee of $36 million. So Rogers gets a doubleheader from its sports programming. The Blue Jays have a much larger cable television audience than the Marlins and thus star power on the diamond can translate into much more money from advertisers. It does dwarf the twins revenue, the 36 million is a fee they basically pay to themselves and really doesn't represent anything. Rogers Tv network paid Rogers sports team. They could have made the figure higher for example 180 million if they were selling the team to show how much revenue it brings in. So where they make their money is in advertising, cable company carrier fees (from competing cable companies for example Shaw in canada) and shares in the Rogers company. It's a different model. You're just talking about Rogers, not the Blue Jays. The Pohlads also make a tonne more money from avenues other than the Twins, it doesn't all funnel back to the team, unless they want it to. Rogers is a massive communications corporation, it's wireless communications division is the reason for it's increased share price, which brings in over 3 times the amount of it's cable operations. They are not the major shareholder in the MLSE, they own 37.5% of it, so does Bell Canada while Kilmer Sports own 25%, none of which has anything to do with the Blue Jays anyway, it's just one of their many assets. Do they undervalue broadcast rights? Sure they do, so they can increase profit from ad revenue, again nothing to do with the Jays. In fact, part of this spending spree has more to do with the 25 million they are getting from MLB than anything. As opposed to the Twins, the Jays are blowing the wad on payroll, it's free money for them. Sorry, if someone was to buy the Blue Jays and Rogers told them the broadcast rights were worth 180 million, I want to meet that guy, I have a Ford Focus he can buy for 3 million. Finally and most importantly, Rogers is a publicly traded company, they can't simply put whatever they want into a baseball team just because they want to, not without their shareholders revolting on them anyway. They are committing more money to the team, I'll concede that but at great risk if it does not work out, if this team does not perform to expectation and bring in the expected increase in revenue through a more attractive product, there is going to be some pretty unhappy wireless investors.

The Jays television contract with Sportsnet (also owned by Rogers), essentially makes all of Canada the Jays region.As lucrative as that may sound, it's not, according to the Globe and Mail it netted them $36M last season. Part of the reason for that is that the Jays actually fight for market share with a number of teams outside of Toronto, Manitoba easily has as many Twins fans as Jays fans and the Red Sox are very popular in the Maritimes. That and fans being forced to listen to Buck Martinez and Pat Tabler 162 times. One other downside of the national agreement is that is makes every Blue Jays game a blackout throughout Canada on MLB.TV.

I never said close the door on getting anyone. I said close the door on thinking 20M was going to land you 3 pitchers. 5M for Baker isn't that awful and shouldn't have been that shocking. He's a pitcher who has been successful. Quite a bit more successful than most of this fanbase has appreciated. Injury or not that has value. You don't have to take the remark personally, not sure why you feel the need to do so, but the fact is people seem to think that the payroll flexibility the Twins have (if they were to spend all that they are assumed to have) would somehow land them as many as 2 of the top 5-7 pitchers on the market. That was ridiculous then and it should be glaringly obvious how ridiculous it was now. I understand your points and I agree with you, I just think that most people here were realistic about which free agents we could afford, sure a few out there posters were claiming 2 of the top 7 was realistic but they were the minority. I think the surprise with Baker is just based in his injury history , not that mediocre pitchers don't get that kind of dough. I don't take anything in this board personally, sorry if I sound that way.

This forum is littered with predictions of bringing in Marcum and Jackson. Or signing Dempster "cheap". Nothing comes cheap in FA. Baker got about what you'd expect - 20-30% more than was sane and deserved. Again, welcome to FA. I didn't say it wasn't littered with those type of predictions and I didn't say anything came cheap. Again, it's not the only avenue any rational person expects to take to solve the pitching woes and there have been many discussions on this forum along those lines. I don't expect the Twins to spend big all of a sudden either but I don't see how not paying Baker 5+ is reason to hang the closed sign on the door just yet.

What I'm saying is that, given the same resources (and blind eye to PEDs), I think Ryan would have done just as well in Boston. ..................http://www.websmileys.com/sm/cool/049.gif