Brock Beauchamp
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Everything posted by Brock Beauchamp
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Interesting. Spotrac.com has it worded very differently. "Option Vests with 200 IP in 2018 or 400 IP from 2017+2018"
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Question about MLB vesting options. Does postseason play count for things like IP on vesting options? I assume it does not but now that I think about it, I'm not sure. Also, he's going to cross 200 IP pretty easily this season, which means he could need as few as 180 IP next year for the option to vest (or even fewer if postseason innings count). Unless he gets injured next season and misses five or more starts, we should probably count on him being in a Twins uniform in 2019.
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Yeah, the third year is a non-issue. If he's still that good in 2019, you want to keep the guy anyway. The real concern is before that, in my opinion.
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I agree with most of this, actually. But I also believe there's a difference between "do nothing" and "do something". A small move or two that improves the 2017 squad was in order, in my opinion. Unless the front office believes they won't be able to get a Vargas or Darvish this offseason. Then it makes more sense to be aggressive and have pursued someone like Verlander. Lots of options depending on perspective. I just want the team to be better at the end of the day.
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When there are teams pulling in literally 20%+ less revenue per season, the Twins cannot be a small market team. And the Astros were 15% higher than the Twins in 2015.
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I notice you edited out the part of my post that shows how truly small "small market" teams are by comparison. And revenue is fluid. The Twins have a newer stadium and were equally terrible to the Astros at the time (both coming off long bad streaks and saw middling success in 2015). The numbers do you back you up on this. At all.
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Either way, Houston's revenue puts them smack-dab in the middle of baseball in 2015. And that number is higher now, as they've enjoyed recent success and their attendance is climbing steadily.
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1. Detroit is an outlier because they spend silly money. 2. That's why we should use revenue, not market size. Under those numbers, Houston is an upper mid-market team.
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Again, the Astros pulled in $270m in revenue in 2015 (the last year I can find actual revenue numbers). That number is considerably higher today. The Orioles pulled in $240m. Are they a tiny market team at that point? What about the Rays? They pulled in $191m that season. Do they even qualify as an MLB team at that point? The Twins also pulled in $240m, for the record.
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True, I guess those four are having good enough seasons to reject a QO (I thought Hosmer and Vargas were having worse seasons than they are). It will be interesting to see how they handle the offseason.
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All of this is anecdotal. I gave you hard numbers. The Astros were a mid-market team when they were terrible and are now inching their way up the baseball ladder. They'll probably be valued somewhere between 11-12 in baseball after the season. The Twins aren't even a "small market" team, as they've been horrible and still come in around 22-25 in revenue. The moment they become good again, they should nudge their way into the top 20. I don't really care how people refer to the team. The actual numbers show Houston is decidedly mid-market, probably on the upper end of that term. "Small market" should be designated for the teams that actually play in a legitimately small market: Milwaukee, Oakland (primarily because of their stadium and the area's preference for the Giants), Tampa, Kansas City, et al.
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If Cain is getting the QO, then offer up Moustakas or one of the other nearly half dozen players the Royals are going to lose this offseason. That was my point, really. The Royals can't offer QOs or resign all the players they're losing this season. And if you're in that situation in a market as small as Kansas City, you get what you can for the guys walking out the door. Choose and keep those you plan to give a QO and those you plan to resign. Get something for the rest. On July 31st, the Royals were in the race so keeping those guys made some sense. But now? There are so many teams in front of them that selling should have been obvious. Then again, I've never thought the KC front office was particularly smart.
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That's not true at all. According to Forbes, in 2016 (based on 2015 revenue), the Astros valuation was #15 in baseball. That was the Astros' return to relevance year and their attendance is +4,000 per game this season and surely set to rise next season again. When the Astros made their last run in the early to mid 2000s, they had payrolls in the top half of baseball, sometimes top 10 IIRC. Houston is a freakin' huge market, which should be in our consciousness right now considering all that is happening down there. edit: Found Forbes' 2017 numbers (based on 2016 revenue) and the Astros jumped two spots up to #13.
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No, we're definitely not sure about that.
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Boy, I don't see it that way. In Houston, Verlander is joining the best team in the AL and a market much larger than Minnesota. I don't see him viewing Minnesota in the same light. But you're right that the Twins should have been asking about it at the very least.
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Dunno, if I'm the Twins, I'd offer up an A ball flyer for Lorenzo Cain. It's not a lot but it's more than the Royals will get a month from now.
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That's kinda my point. If no acceptable arms were available, go get a RH bat. I wasn't picky, I just wanted to see the team improve somewhere.
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For all intents and purposes, their postseason chances are zero. Literally 1/3rd of the American League stands between them and the postseason. It was time to punt and get what you can. Figure out which guys you're not considering for a QO and get what you can for them, just as the Tigers did with Upton. The Royals don't have the resources to hold on to players and hope for the best when their actual chances are so low.
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Given how the team has played, I can't say they screwed up big time. They read the tea leaves the best they could and came up with an incorrect answer (the identical answer I came up with, for the record). There's nothing wrong with making a mistake now and again (especially considering how I liked both returns the Twins received, mitigating the mistake). But I'm disappointed they didn't pivot again and pick up one or two players. I don't even really care who or where so much as making the attempt in the first place.
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On a somewhat related topic, does anyone else find it interesting the Royals didn't move anyone? I mean, it's great for the rest of the ALC but they're 4.5 games out of the second Wild Card spot. I'd be kinda pissed if I was a KCR fan right now. They wouldn't get much for any single player but moving a few guys might help speed up their inevitable rebuild.
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I didn't expect them to get either Upton or Verlander but I don't think that's Mike's point. The Twins got no one, which is kind of disappointing. Though I agree re: hard pass on Leake. The guy is owed $50m guaranteed. I wavered on Verlander but I'd pursue Verlander 11 times out of 10 before I went after Leake.
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I wasn't arguing with you, just pointing out the Astros could barely pull off the trade. I'm a little baffled the Twins didn't do anything. I don't like it. I didn't expect or want much but a bullpen arm sure wouldn't have hurt.
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If Verlander wouldn't initially accept a trade to the best team in the AL in a market much larger than Minnesota or Detroit, it's doubtful he'd ever consider a trade to the Twins. Not impossible but highly unlikely. In any case, an interesting trade. Two 50-100 prospects, a random guy, and Detroit takes on salary (which should have surprised none of us).
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The team positioned for the home field in the WC game usually has some flexibility to plan their rotation for the WC game. -
Garver should not return to the minors. If he needs work catching, there's an entire offseason to work on that.
