jimmer
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Everything posted by jimmer
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I haven't heard that, but maybe? edit: http://www.nytimes.com/ref/sports/baseball/baseball-rule-change-eliminates-a-fake-pickoff-by-pitcher.html Gets ride of the fake to 3rd to throw to 1st move. So that little trick play, specifically, is gone. So when I wrote 'There's also the infamous fake throw to 3rd to throw to 1st base trick. In that case, if you first fake to 3B, not only do you not have to throw to 3B, when you turn to throw to 1B, you don't have to throw it then either.' That was wrong. But you can still fake to 3B or 2B.
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Has Schaefer or Robinson earned the CF job, or any job really? Why does Hicks have to earn it when the players playing there now didn't have to? Between those three, who has a chance to be part of the future? In any event, IMO, let's have this be his make or break season. Bring him up and just play him. If he can be good enough, maybe he's a 4th OF when Rosario and Buxton are up, if not, we know and move on.
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Nah, my bad. I should have been more clear I was messing around.
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yeah, I was just fooling around. Sorry.
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I was just playing, really.
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If he was set in the windup and then stepped back off the rubber and motioned towards 2nd or 3rd, he wouldn't even have to throw the ball. There's no rule that I know of that specifies how he'd have to throw there. There's also teh infamous fake throw to 3rd to throw to 1st base trick. In that case, if you first fake to 3B, not only do you not have to throw to 3B, when you turn to throw to 1B, you don't have to throw it then either.
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Does an almost 40 year old slow player have a 50-50 chance? -) 'If the runners advance, the 0.44 changes to somewhere between 0.58 and 0.61 depending on which chart you use, and your total expected runs becomes around 0.79' Yeah, but if they advance and Hunter is out #3, would the number really go up to .79 because they're just going to walk to the dugout at that point. :-)
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Does he have the disease called 'non-strikeoutis'?
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Yes, because once you start the windup, you can't throw to 1st, 2nd or 3rd. You can only throw home. The reason pitchers use the stretch with runners on is because they can deliver the ball faster to home plate to help get any potential base stealers and because pickoff attempts are easier made from that position. And if you throw over to a base from the stretch, it can be fast or slow, rushed or deliberate.
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that heck-bent thing wasn't addressed to you, so you know. And yeah, about the decision to attempt the steal goes, because we don't know if Vargas gets a hit there, I lean towards not taking the bat out of a slugger's hands when bases are loaded, myself. If Schaefer or Robinson is up there, maybe yes. I think if a younger player had tried it, like Plouffe or Escobar (or any person not considered a willy veteran), people would be calling it stupid not aggressive.
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Yeah, I've been umpiring on an off for 30 years from little league to low level college. I would never have called this a balk.
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I've read the rules, and I'm pretty sure I'm interpreting the alteration part right. You are certainly entitled to believe otherwise, but that's your opinion. I never said the rule specified what I put in quotes I just gave examples of what an alteration might be or what I thought an alteration would be interpreted as. But it did say .'He shall not raise either foot from the ground, except that in his actual delivery of the ball to the batter, he may take one step backward, and one step forward with his free foot.' Those sure SEEM like examples. And it continued from there in that paragraph on things that could and couldn't be done to be considered a windup. It wasn't called, so apparently the umpires also don't think he altered his delivery in the context of the rule either. Also, you seem heck-bent on saying it's a balk, so why start a thread to ask people their OPINIONS if all you want to do is shout down anyone saying other-wise? You're interpreting what they mean by alteration one way, others are doing it another, but those others are doing it wrong, apparently. The only way to interpret the rules correctly is to conclude it was a balk? It wasn't a balk, IMO.
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The way I read it: Once he starts moving after being set in the windup, he can't stop (interruption) of do anything else but deliver pitch (alteration: like step off, throw to a base, trip, etc). And it goes on to explain some alterations it's referring to like 'He shall not raise either foot from the ground, except that in his actual delivery of the ball to the batter, he may take one step backward, and one step forward with his free foot.' He didn't do anything of those things specifically mentioned. IMO, it's not referring to how the ball is actually delivered after going through all the required steps for doing a windup pitch. He did all those. If he had actually stopped, planted and thrown, that would be different. I've spent about 30 years interpreting baseball rules as an umpire. The rule is shaky though, for sure. Just my opinion.
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Yes, and how often do you hear anyone talk about the runner crossing home base to score? Or, there's a play at 4th or home base? Was a run 'plated' or was it 'based'? These rules in this section, when talking about bases, are not talking about home plate (specifically the ones the poster I was addressing used) regardless of whether or not the term everyone knows is home plate isn't specifically mentioned as such.
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I'm talking about the rules he quoted.
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Read the rules you quoted again. the first one was © At any time during the pitcher's preliminary movements and until his natural pitching motion commits him to the pitch, he may throw to any base provided he steps directly toward such base before making the throw. The pitcher shall step "ahead of the throw." A snap throw followed by the step directly toward the base is a balk. But he had already committed to the pitch to home plate. that's what starting hsi windup does. So it doesn't apply. The second one was, c) The pitcher, while touching his plate, fails to step directly toward a base before throwing to that base; Requires the pitcher, while touching his plate, to step directly toward a base before throwing to that base.' Again, I think the rule is talking about 1st, 2nd or 3rd base but even if they aren't, he step towards home before throwing it. So he broke neither rule, assuming it even applied when talking about throwing home.
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Not in the context of the rules we're discussing, IMO, but hey. I think people are looking and stretching the rule (and the spirit of the rule) to fit their opinion.
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-The pitcher delivers the pitch from Set Position without coming to a stop. -The pitcher, while giving an intentional base on balls, pitches when the catcher is not in the catcher's box -The pitcher delivers the ball to the batter while he is not facing the batter; The above aren't examples of illegal pitches? I understand these cause you to get a balk called, but one wouldn't describe them as illegal pitches? Where is the list of things specified as an illegal pitch besides the quick pitch?
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That's why they specify the difference between base and plate.
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Anyway, I enjoyed the debate, but I've covered everything I think is pertinent to my interpretation of the play in my posts on this thread. It wasn't called, he was out, and I doubt MLB comes back and says it was a balk (and they have been coming out and acknowledging mistakes recently).
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8.05 covers a plethora of illegal pitches in which the one that happen is not referenced. (e)-(m) are all examples of illegal pitches. 8.05 covers a plethora of illegal pitches in which the one that happen is not referenced. (e)-(m) are all examples of illegal pitches. As far as the rules of the windup, it tells what you can't and can't do in the rule. Him speeding up his delivery towards the ends isn't specified. His intent wasn't to deceive the batter either. I explained what I thought they were referring to when talking about altering in an earlier post.
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8.05 covers a plethora of illegal pitches in which the one that happen is not referenced. (e)-(m) are all examples of illegal pitches.
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Rule 8.05 'The pitcher makes an illegal pitch......' Here's the whole thing in regards to illegal pitch under 8.05: not just the start of the rule..because the whole thing explains what the rule is about. 8.05 If there is a runner, or runners, it is a balk when- (e)'The pitcher makes an illegal pitch; A quick pitch is an illegal pitch. Umpires will judge a quick pitch as one delivered before the batter is reasonably set in the batter's box. With runners on base the penalty is a balk; with no runners on base, it is a ball. The quick pitch is dangerous and should not be permitted.' Like I said earlier, it's about the quick pitch which is done before the batter is set. The batter was set.
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The way I read it: Once he starts moving after being set in the windup, he can't stop (interruption) of do anything else but deliver pitch (alteration: like step off, throw to a base or trip, or whatever). And it goes on to explain some alterations it's referring to like 'He shall not raise either foot from the ground, except that in his actual delivery of the ball to the batter, he may take one step backward, and one step forward with his free foot.' He didn't do anything of those things specifically mentioned. IMO, it's not referring to how the ball is actually delivered after going through all the required steps for doing a windup pitch. He did all those. If he had actually stopped, planted and thrown, that would be different. I've spent about 30 years interpreting baseball rules as an umpire. The rule is shaky though, for sure. Just my opinion.
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This pitching alteration thing was put in there mostly to avoid a pitcher getting the ball back from the catcher and immediately delivering a pitch before the batter was ready. Called a quick return.
