jokin

Hey, Hicks can always make a good 4th OF...

The decision to send Lannan down by the Nats was a controversial one, and a close call made at the close of spring training. It was largely a function of the Nats SP numbers game as they continued to improve their rotation depth with young arms- not a reflection of a sudden drop-off in Lannan. The Twins didn't want him, that is a given- as they had already "moved on" to being shrewd and "thrifty" with their dumpster diving methodology and rather peculiarly signing a starter just 8 months off of TJ surgery. So you and I can look at what the Twins are trotting out in the rotation now---- and the numbers that are the worst in baseball for starting pitchers--- and one can't possibly come to the conclusion that there "was no reason to include him in the trade." To the contrary, other than Deduno, Lannan would have been the best option coming out of spring training- better, and a more durable and reliable track record than Worley and Correia, at a cost of just one year's worth of Correia.

You are factually wrong on Lannan. Injuries to his leg, first significant time off in his career. Please check back on his career stats for his proven qualifications. Lannan's career ERA through 2012 is 4.01. The NL average ERA for SPs over Lannan's career time-frame (2007-12) is 4.23. His IP over that time ranks 27 overall, and counting his minor league innings over the last 5 years, he's averaged 188 IP/YR. with 32 games started per year. Regarding Meyer, why aren't you asking this of the OP and the Twins FO, as well? The MRI was negative, but the Twins are publicly expressing concern about the lack of improvement in his condition since the shutdown, and now the special trip to Minneapolis. That is certainly not the type of news developments that lead to positive thoughts. My comment was in regards to Meyer possibly facing surgery at some point if this is leading to something that hasn't yet shown on the MRI- It has been shown that shoulder injuries requiring surgery generally don't lead to more good outcomes over bad ones.

Uhh, this is incorrect, twice: [TABLE=class: tablehead] [TR=class: colhead] [TD=align: left]RK[/TD] [TD=align: left]PLAYER[/TD] [TD=align: left]TEAM[/TD] AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI SB CS BB SO AVG OBP SLG OPS WAR[/TR] [TR=class: oddrow player-10-28567] [TD=align: left]1[/TD] [TD=align: left]Troy Tulowitzki[/TD] [TD=align: left]COL[/TD] [TD=align: right]222[/TD] [TD=align: right]41[/TD] [TD=align: right]77[/TD] [TD=align: right]16[/TD] [TD=align: right]0[/TD] [TD=align: right]16[/TD] [TD=align: right]51[/TD] [TD=align: right]0[/TD] [TD=align: right]0[/TD] [TD=align: right]23[/TD] [TD=align: right]36[/TD] [TD=align: right].347[/TD] [TD=align: right].413[/TD] [TD=align: right].635[/TD] [TD=class: sortcell, align: right]1.048 [/TD] [TD=align: right]3.7[/TD] [/TR] [TR=class: evenrow player-10-31037] [TD=align: left]2[/TD] [TD=align: left]Jean Segura[/TD] [TD=align: left]MIL[/TD] [TD=align: right]324[/TD] [TD=align: right]46[/TD] [TD=align: right]105[/TD] [TD=align: right]9[/TD] [TD=align: right]8[/TD] [TD=align: right]11[/TD] [TD=align: right]33[/TD] [TD=align: right]24[/TD] [TD=align: right]3[/TD] [TD=align: right]13[/TD] [TD=align: right]42[/TD] [TD=align: right].324[/TD] [TD=align: right].357[/TD] [TD=align: right].503[/TD] [TD=class: sortcell, align: right].860[/TD] [TD=align: right]3.4[/TD] [/TR] [TR=class: oddrow player-10-29646] [TD=align: left]3[/TD] [TD=align: left]Ian Desmond[/TD] [TD=align: left]WSH[/TD] [TD=align: right]303[/TD] [TD=align: right]36[/TD] [TD=align: right]84[/TD] [TD=align: right]22[/TD] [TD=align: right]2[/TD] [TD=align: right]15[/TD] [TD=align: right]49[/TD] [TD=align: right]8[/TD] [TD=align: right]2[/TD] [TD=align: right]17[/TD] [TD=align: right]75[/TD] [TD=align: right].277[/TD] [TD=align: right].316[/TD] [TD=align: right].512[/TD] [TD=class: sortcell, align: right].828[/TD] [TD=align: right]2.5[/TD] [/TR] [TR=class: evenrow player-10-5527] [TD=align: left]4[/TD] [TD=align: left]Jhonny Peralta[/TD] [TD=align: left]DET[/TD] [TD=align: right]287[/TD] [TD=align: right]35[/TD] [TD=align: right]89[/TD] [TD=align: right]21[/TD] [TD=align: right]0[/TD] [TD=align: right]7[/TD] [TD=align: right]36[/TD] [TD=align: right]2[/TD] [TD=align: right]2[/TD] [TD=align: right]27[/TD] [TD=align: right]69[/TD] [TD=align: right].310[/TD] [TD=align: right].369[/TD] [TD=align: right].456[/TD] [TD=class: sortcell, align: right].826[/TD] [TD=align: right]2.2[/TD] [/TR] [TR=class: oddrow player-10-29074] [TD=align: left]5[/TD] [TD=align: left]Jed Lowrie[/TD] [TD=align: left]OAK[/TD] [TD=align: right]298[/TD] [TD=align: right]37[/TD] [TD=align: right]92[/TD] [TD=align: right]22[/TD] [TD=align: right]0[/TD] [TD=align: right]5[/TD] [TD=align: right]34[/TD] [TD=align: right]1[/TD] [TD=align: right]0[/TD] [TD=align: right]34[/TD] [TD=align: right]42[/TD] [TD=align: right].309[/TD] [TD=align: right].381[/TD] [TD=align: right].433[/TD] [TD=class: sortcell, align: right].814[/TD] [TD=align: right]1.5[/TD] [/TR] [TR=class: evenrow player-10-30155] [TD=align: left]6[/TD] [TD=align: left]Everth Cabrera[/TD] [TD=align: left]SD[/TD] [TD=align: right]275[/TD] [TD=align: right]37[/TD] [TD=align: right]84[/TD] [TD=align: right]11[/TD] [TD=align: right]4[/TD] [TD=align: right]4[/TD] [TD=align: right]24[/TD] [TD=align: right]31[/TD] [TD=align: right]7[/TD] [TD=align: right]32[/TD] [TD=align: right]52[/TD] [TD=align: right].305[/TD] [TD=align: right].382[/TD] [TD=align: right].418[/TD] [TD=class: sortcell, align: right].800[/TD] [TD=align: right]3.2[/TD] [/TR] [TR=class: oddrow player-10-28671] [TD=align: left]7[/TD] [TD=align: left]Asdrubal Cabrera[/TD] [TD=align: left]CLE[/TD] [TD=align: right]224[/TD] [TD=align: right]35[/TD] [TD=align: right]60[/TD] [TD=align: right]19[/TD] [TD=align: right]2[/TD] [TD=align: right]6[/TD] [TD=align: right]26[/TD] [TD=align: right]5[/TD] [TD=align: right]1[/TD] [TD=align: right]14[/TD] [TD=align: right]58[/TD] [TD=align: right].268[/TD] [TD=align: right].322[/TD] [TD=align: right].451[/TD] [TD=class: sortcell, align: right].773[/TD] [TD=align: right]1.1[/TD] [/TR] [TR=class: evenrow player-10-31376] [TD=align: left]8[/TD] [TD=align: left]Didi Gregorius[/TD] [TD=align: left]ARI[/TD] [TD=align: right]208[/TD] [TD=align: right]31[/TD] [TD=align: right]60[/TD] [TD=align: right]11[/TD] [TD=align: right]2[/TD] [TD=align: right]4[/TD] [TD=align: right]17[/TD] [TD=align: right]0[/TD] [TD=align: right]1[/TD] [TD=align: right]16[/TD] [TD=align: right]36[/TD] [TD=align: right].288[/TD] [TD=align: right].349[/TD] [TD=align: right].418[/TD] [TD=class: sortcell, align: right].768[/TD] [TD=align: right]1.6[/TD] [/TR] [TR=class: oddrow player-10-5908] [TD=align: left]9[/TD] [TD=align: left]J.J. Hardy[/TD] [TD=align: left]BAL[/TD] [TD=align: right]316[/TD] [TD=align: right]32[/TD] [TD=align: right]84[/TD] [TD=align: right]15[/TD] [TD=align: right]0[/TD] [TD=align: right]15[/TD] [TD=align: right]46[/TD] [TD=align: right]1[/TD] [TD=align: right]1[/TD] [TD=align: right]18[/TD] [TD=align: right]40[/TD] [TD=align: right].266[/TD] [TD=align: right].304[/TD] [TD=align: right].456[/TD] [TD=class: sortcell, align: right].759[/TD] [TD=align: right]2.7[/TD] [/TR] [/TABLE] Florimon would certainly not rank in the top half. Currently ranking #18 among SS w/ greater than 215 PAs. Good for a waiver wire pickup, but not good enough. (Not saying it's you in particular, but...Funny how some of the same types of voices that said it was useless to pick up other people's garbage as a fools errand, are now defending Florimon over considering alternatives). [TABLE=class: tablehead] [TR=class: evenrow player-10-30310] [TD=align: left]18[/TD] [TD=align: left]Pedro Florimon[/TD] [TD=align: left]MIN[/TD] [TD=align: right]194[/TD] [TD=align: right]19[/TD] [TD=align: right]45[/TD] [TD=align: right]9[/TD] [TD=align: right]0[/TD] [TD=align: right]3[/TD] [TD=align: right]24[/TD] [TD=align: right]7[/TD] [TD=align: right]1[/TD] [TD=align: right]18[/TD] [TD=align: right]46[/TD] [TD=align: right].232[/TD] [TD=align: right].296[/TD] [TD=align: right].325[/TD] [TD=class: sortcell, align: right].621[/TD] [/TR] [/TABLE]

What method did you think the Twins used to acquire Florimon in the first place?

I don't see anyone on this thread who has posted anything close to "calling Meyer dead"- prematurely or otherwise. Legitimate concerns started with the OP and have followed through, from the Twins FO on all the way down to the other respondents in this thread. To assert anything like what you have inferred was said is, IMO, disingenuous.

Compared to what the Twins have now? The worst SP staff in all of baseball? Assuming Lannan doesn't hurt his leg in April, Lannan would have been a huge value, if he had just performed at his career numbers (and he had started the season strong before the injury). Either as a proven, but still young, back-end innings-eater for a Correia-type cost.... or as a future potential trading chip or throw-in, the Twins had more than enough payroll space to take on his cost----and it's been more than demonstrated in real-time-spades that the Twins rotation options were... and for the most part still are.... simply awful. Sorry, Lannan would have been very good value at whatever cost arbitration would have decided upon.

If it's a sticky shoulder surgery situation for Meyer, by the time they properly diagnose and schedule it, he probably would have little chance to be ready to pitch next spring. But it could be even worse than that. Recent studies have been done that show that while around 85% of elbow surgeries end up in pitchers equaling or exceeding previous performance levels......for shoulders, it's less than 50%. This is very, very disconcerting news and the Twins extreme caution is well-justified. If things don't take a turn back to the positive, it's now getting too uncomfortably near the area wherein it's less than a coin flip that Meyer still projects to being the potential Ace pitcher we once all hoped for. Now, more than ever, why didn't the Twins get John Lannan thrown into the deal, when the Nats were going to avoid arbitration and cut him anyway? At least they would have had a still-young (only 28) and proven innings-eater to show for the "blockbuster" trade.

Mauer was the key to missing out on a sweep. He's had a strange season, with stretches of hitting brilliance, followed by prolonged and inexplicable hitting futility. The Royals have some nice new faces on their roster.

I'm blaming you, then.....you and your conflicts of interest....

BTW, after being well below league averages all season, Twins pitchers are now worse than league averages in HR/FB and HR/9.

I think the Target Field concrete has fully settled.

There it is!

Hosmer's didn't do much for me, either.

Deduno appears to have turned the corner in Gardy's mind. Nothing but praise and now he calls him "Sammy".... He'll probably always be considered a ticking time bomb to some degree, but I think he sticks for 2014.

Pretty much spot on, with the exception of Deduno, I think the decision has been made on him. As of right now, anyway, he's their best SP. I gotta think that as of taday, he and Gibson are at the top of their 2014 SP chart.

I've been wishing for this outcome, and hoping that was the intention in the back of TR's mind, from day one of this signing. I just don't think Ryan sees it that way. If anything, he's probably wondering what KC would take in an extension.

You've got it right on the 4 candidates for second-half rotation nominees. I suspect that Albers stays down barring further injury or both Pelfrey and Correia being moved. Albers would likely take Gibson's spot in August. Regarding the 5th spot, so many suspects.....so little chance for future success....I'd like to see May and/or Darnell get a crack in the rotation at call-up time (or in May's specific case, even before if he continues to string some decent starts together).

Actually, I kinda wish some of these suspects would "resign", so that the Twins can "re-sign" the more worthy candidates, or better yet, "sign" even more legitimate candidates.

Or Kohl Stewart?

In checking the Red Wing rotation schedule, both Worley and Albers would fit into Walters start, with Albers exactly in synch with Walters- Worley the day before. DFAing Walters to bring up Albers seems like the only way they call up Albers for next Wednesday against the Yankees. Gotta think they would turn to the vet first, if they think he's ready for that start or the one right after.

That's pretty much how I see it, probably the Vanimal. Scott's body language, demeanor and post-game reflections after his last start pretty much said it all in where he's at right now.

From today's StarTribune: "Pelfrey on track Mike Pelfrey’s back pain has disappeared, and the righthander is eager to get back to work. He will get a chance this weekend. The Twins have put Pelfrey on the normal cycle of preparation, and they will send him to Class A Cedar Rapids on Monday for a rehab start. If all goes well, Gardenhire said, “he’ll eventually get activated and probably make his next [major league] start next Saturday,” at Toronto.'" If I read that correctly, bye-bye Scott Diamond.

SSS and everything, but Thomas leads the team in pitches per PA (Better even that Joe Mauer), has cut way back on K-rate, this plus his slash- line at leadoff show that he is currently the ONLY legit leadoff option currently on the roster (see below). Thomas batting leadoff slash: .289/.372/421/.793 Team batting leadoff slash: .189/.254/.259/.513

Twins pitching regressing to the HR/FB mean.