Dantes929

"all three are out of options" Are there options besides release, waiver wire or trade? Can the odd one or two simply agree to assignment to the minors even though they are "out of options". After all, they may still figure their best chances are to be patient and work their way on to the Twins staff rather than take their chances trying to break into a better rotation.

I also predict that Pelfrey will be better than Correia, Norasko and Hughes. I don't know about the battle for the 5 spot but will also predict that Meyer will be at the top of the rotation by season end. I am hoping Gibson isn't far behind.

Well said Seth. Last year we were dead last in strikeouts and it wasn't close. We were 7th best on the walks side but still very close to league average. Its not the pitch to contact philosophy that hurts us so bad. Its that we execute it so badly. Anywhere in the top 18 in strikeouts and giving up the fewest walks would satisfy me.

If Hicks makes the Twins I don't think it will be as backup. I would say he needs to put up similar ST numbers to the ones he posted last year and then just hope he gets off to a better start in regular season. I also think Willingham is much better suited for DH but if Sano makes the team I can easily see a Plouffe, Kubel platoon at DH. I have a hard time getting excited about Pressley but if he can hit .283 and get on base a third of the time it would be a big improvement over Hicks start a year ago.

I'm looking for more contact from all the players more than I am more pop. Closest category to league average the Twins had last year was homeruns. The strikeouts were the hardest thing to watch for me.

sorry ncgo but that is not true. Mauer has been ripped on all along even when he has had Thome, Morneau, Kubel, Cuddyer and yes even D Young putting up big RBI numbers. Though to be fair, if he had Buxton's speed fans might have been less critical. If Buxton wins batting titles and GGs and hits lots of doubles and triples I don't care how many home runs he has.

I don't have much confidence that they will use all the money saved in these few years but I do have confidence that they will up payroll to 52% and maybe a little beyond if all these guys really do pan out. If they do pan out 52% will likely be a larger amount also. Twins seem to be pretty good about buying free agent years early on guys they want.

"So I say let him do whatever is needed for him to be successful in his own way, instead of trying to make him something he may not be, like they did with Ortiz. " Of course that is true and of course if they told Ortiz to hit to the opposite field then that is wrong. If all they did was coach him to go with the pitch then that is another thing. Doing that a natural pull hitter will still pull the ball more often but if a hitter TRIES to pull every pitch it is not a recipe for success. If you look at the splits he had as a twin they actually skew more to him being a pull hitter with the Twins than he was with the Red Sox. He was actually a pretty good hitter with the Twins and I was sorry to see him go but he did seem to get stronger with the Sox..

"Don't try to change him like we tried to change Ortiz to "use the whole field". The great home run hitters don't need to use the whole field" Type in Dave Ortiz and spray chart and also try "new approach" and let me know what you think. Better yet, look at baseball reference splits. 1275 of his 2023 hits were opposite field or up the middle. 202 of his 431 home runs were opposite field or up the middle. I would much rather Sano drive the pitch according to where it is thrown rather than trying to pull everything. If he resembles Killebrew that would be fine but I would prefer he resemble Cabrerra.

"What if the Twins aren't within shouting dstance of being contenders in 2014, or then yet again, in 2015? Would you be willing to wait to call up a guy who "apprently has the stuff to be the staff ace" until 2016? " The original post I was responding to said if the Twins are contending then he was content if he stays in the minors. I disagreed with that sentiment. I have no problem with Meyer coming up right off the bat. I also have no problem in him working on what he has to work on at the minor league level and earn his way up and it is a bonus if we get an extra year under control. We all expect to see him in 2014. He did well in AA but only 70 innings. I am ok with him proving himself at AAA before the call up. No one is suggesting that if he is 1.5 ERA in AAA that we hold him back til 2016 or even 2015.

To paraphrase from Princess Bride. Vizzini: I can't compete with you physically, and you're no match for my brains. Man in Black: You're that smart? Vizzini: Let me put it this way. Have you ever heard of Mozart, Einstein, Da Vinci, and Neil Armstrong ? Man in Black: Yes. Vizzini: Morons.

"Most people around here around here assume (me included) that he'll go back to AAA to earn his way up." I said he should ideally do that but ideal would mean someone better than Pressley to hold the spot. I am generally in favor of everyone proving (or reproving themselves in the minors before the major league promotion). For your reasons I am in favor of just putting Hicks out there again.

Of course service time means a great deal. If he does come up he apparently has the stuff to be the staff ace. That's why if they are within shouting distance of contention that is when he should be brought up. If they are contending and Meyer is doing well then I would not be as content to let him stay in the minors.

When you have that kind of stuff it is hard not to be a thrower rather than a pitcher. It was often overlooked but Verlander used to throw harder but was only 7-7 against the "good" Twins. Like Koufax did way back when, Verlander discovered he can dial it back just a little and the gain in control more than offsets the decrease in velocity. He was great because of his stuff but is even better now because he uses it in a smarter way. He can still dial it up when he wants to. A well placed 95 mph trumps a 99mph down the middle. I understand all the reasons for holding him back but I suspect if Meyer was added to the rotation from the get go he would be the staff ace by end of season.

Given recent history, I can't help but wonder if he should just get TJ surgery now and be done with it. JK

You are right of course. His OBP was only slightly better from the right side. Being more of an OBP guy you would think I would have noticed that. I wonder why his walk rate was so much better from the left side but his average was so much better from the other side. Very odd stats as I read them. His strikeout splits were almost identical to his walk splits. You would think with the average being so heavily in favor of his right side that lefties would have been more afraid of him leading to more walks than the righties, especially since his slugging % was a little better from the right side also. Are right handers really that much smarter than lefties?

Great response. I am not cherry picking stats here. Just checked out the splits of 4 guys. Mickey Mantle hit .330 from the right side and .281 from the left. Eddie Murray hit .283 from the left and .276 from the right. Kirby Pucket hit .337 against lefties and .311 against righties. Joe Mauer hit .336 against righties and .297 against lefties. Couple observations. Mantle is probably considered the greatest switch hitter of all time but one has to wonder about that 49 point difference in batting average in his splits. By contract Puckett had only a 26 point split difference. Maybe Mantle should have just stuck with the right side. Hard to believe he would have done worse than .281 and maybe he does better against righties and lefties by always seeing and practicing from the right side. Judging by Mauer splits it reinforces the idea that righties do better against righties than lefties do against lefties. Morneau also had a large difference. My point is that Hicks has worked so hard to hit from the left side against righties but it is hard to believe he couldn't have done just as well or possibly much better hitting solely right handed. I agree it is late in the game to switch but is it really so ridiculous to think he can do it. I think most will agree that he has a major league right handed swing. Is his pitch recognition really going to suffer that much if he sees righties pitching while he is a rightie? Will it really be worse than what we have seen from him as a lefty? I suspect that if they made him just a righty from the get go he would already have two major league years under his belt by now.

"Hicks's experience should serve to sober the enthusiasts of Twins' prospect's MiL statistics--"it's a whole new game" as they say." I see no reason for it to sober my view. First off the Hicks experience is quite possibly still in the very early stages. Secondly, Hicks was never ranked as high as these other guys. I accept that some may not make it in the majors but expect that some ranked below Hicks will make it. Purely my own opinion but I think he would have been better off focusing just hitting right handed rather than pushing the switch hitting. Of course we will never know if my position is right or wrong ( I suppose the same could be said about Mantle and Murray.) I also am looking forward to an outfield of Hicks, Rosario and Buxton. I've seen enough of Willingham, Young and Arcia. The difference between getting to balls no one expects you to get, and not getting to balls that should be fairly routine, is pretty huge.

Of course you don't give up on the guy. Ideally, he would have to earn his way back to the majors by succeeding in the minors but Pressley doesn't excite me at all. We know hicks still plays good D and we know he has good power. I suspect he will start in the minors but even a month of hitting .270 or better will get him back up.

Of course he was ranked #4 in the upcoming draft. They say this draft is really deep though so we should get someone good anyway. When Sano was ranked the #2 prospect there were two shortstops in the top 5 I would have been happy to trade him for though we have had as many issues at 3rd as we have at short in the recent memory.

I agree completely. Average corner offensively and above average defensively makes him an above average corner outfielder. I also agree that his future may be tied to the performance of Hicks and Dozier but I agree with your trade parameters. Last year we did not have a single outfielder that was even close to "average". Arcia was closest and as mentioned above he is probably best suited to DH.

Yeah, I see where you both are coming from and with good arguments on both sides. Of course experts are right 50% of the time which is much better than the amateur posters who are only right half the time.

"It wouldn't be the first time my height was exaggerated. The game program for the JuCo basketball team I was a member of once listed me at 6' 11". " Did you have an afro? (Sorry, just figured since we are already referencing 80's culture I would throw a Fletch in there.)

"I know this was a Boss reference, but your reaction is more Barney" Great theme song for Seth and the other Twins optimists (includes me). I really hope you have young kids.

Jimcrikket, I understand and have often argued the exact same thing in terms of wanting team control. They should be polished when they get up so we have them at their best for the longest period possible. The flip side to your theory that hitters are better than they used to be is my theory that with conditioning and training methods pitchers throw harder than they used to. I remember when 90 mph used to be considered good. Now even guys like Nick Blackburn can touch mid 90's. The result is what seems to me to be a lot more TJ and elbow surgery. Therefore, if a guy like Thorpe can earn his way to the majors and be successful earlier it makes more sense to promote him while his arm is still healthy. I will take effective and a little on the job learning now over loss of a year or two in prime because it seems so few guys stay healthy. Just look at the guys on the Twins who have lost significant time in the last decade. Joe Mays, Milton, Radke, Liriano, Blackburn, Baker, Slowey, Nathan, Pavano, Gibson. I am probably forgetting quite a few. There is something to a bird in hand. Which gets me back to my original question though honestly it was meant more to be rhetorical. How long especially with the Twins would it take to get Koufax to the majors if he started out in the organization at his peak?