The Athletic grades all 30 MLB teams through Memorial Day Weekend

[Brock Beauchamp]

Gleeman gave the Twins a C+.

I wouldn't go higher than a C and before I vote, I'm vacillating on whether a D is more appropriate. Yes, they're tracking right where projections had them to start the season but the way they've "achieved" that is both infuriating and promising depending on the angle you view it. It feels like the rotation has largely been wasted by poor bullpen and lineup performance... but I'm not sure how much of that to blame on the front office or Baldelli. They're putting quality players on the field, those players just aren't performing.

Anyway, give us your thoughts.

https://theathletic.com/4549233/2023/05/25/mlb-all-30-grades-memorial-day/

[Squirrel]

11 minutes ago, Brock Beauchamp said:

the way they've "achieved" that is both infuriating and promising depending on the angle you view it

This is why I gave them a C. They balance out to average. 

[Brock Beauchamp]

1 minute ago, Squirrel said:

This is why I gave them a C. They balance out to average. 

I also couldn't give them a D and ended up voting C. They're in first place and above .500. That doesn't warrant a D grade, it's not as if they're the Padres.

[Mike Sixel]

C

Underachievers on offense, over on defense. I'm not sure which will regress to the mean....

[Vanimal46]

Rotation - A - Everything we expected and more. 

Bullpen - C - Top 4 relievers are good to great, bottom 4 relievers need improvement. 

Lineup - D or F - Correa way under projections, Buxton way too streaky. Gallo has been one of the very few playing above projections. 

Overall - C, probably a C-

[Parfigliano]

4 minutes ago, Squirrel said:

This is why I gave them a C. They balance out to average. 

Same grade I voted for.  They can be better and they can be worse on O and D.  They just manage to glide along like an average middle of the MLB pack team.  Luck for them they are in a dumpster division.

[Squirrel]

6 minutes ago, Brock Beauchamp said:

I also couldn't give them a D and ended up voting C. They're in first place and above .500. That doesn't warrant a D grade, it's not as if they're the Padres.

Their hitting is atrocious but the starting pitching is really good … their RP has been good some days, bad others … I mean, yeah, first place, in a last place division … all that balances out to a C for me. And while the players take some responsibility for this, even the manager to a lesser degree, I put most of this at the feet of the FO. We need better players. Period. Get us there. I’ve expended enough patience given where we came from.

[LastOnePicked]

I gave them a D, but I can see where this may be seen as harsh. From my perspective, they have the talent. Ownership has boosted payroll. They haven't been blasted apart by injuries. They're simply failing to seize the moment and capitalize on opportunities. In this dismal division, they should be coasting into June with a 10+ game lead. Instead, they're keeping even the hapless White Sox within striking distance. Cleveland and Chicago just aren't this bad, and come June or July, the Twins are likely going to regret not closing the door when they had the chance.

[wsnydes]

They're a .500 team in a putrid division.  Can't possibly rate them higher.  They're average at best, C.

Edit:  Just wanted to add that they're pretty much where I figured they'd be.  Hovering around .500 with little offense, a good rotation and a questionable bullpen that can be streaky good or streaky bad at any given stretch.  

Edited Thursday at 05:40 PM by wsnydes

[Dman]

I too gave them a C.  The starting pitching has been what I had hoped for so far but everything else is so maddeningly inconsistent it boggles the mind.  They are in first place though so couldn't give them a D even though that is probably more how I feel about the team.  My emotions are probably clouding a more rational response so I voted C.

[Blyleven2011]

I'm going with last one picked  , 

D- ...

2/3rd's of the twins  are under performing  ( I see it the way I see it ) ,  BATTING and BULLPEN  ... 

No gripes with starting pitchers , they have done a tremendous job going 6 plus innings ...

We are in first place , Whoopi  , for how long if things don't change  , I agree that the team has the skills  to be 10 games ahead but just don't seize the opportunity with a killer instinct  ...

plus boring to watch , if the twins We're a movie how would you grade them ,  worse I'm sure ...

The way they  play the BAD NEWS BEARS  could  and should beat them ...

Sorry I'm harsh , I love my twins but still pissed at the extention for the manager  ...

[chpettit19]

I gave them a C because I think they're doing basically exactly what I thought they'd do. Bullpen would be incredibly hit or miss. Lineup would be lacking at least 1 major bat, and have a bunch of 6 to 9 hole hitters hitting in the top 5. Starting pitching would be fantastic. That's what I expected, and it's what I'm getting so I give them a C.

My hope moving forward is that Correa and Miranda figure things out, Lewis and Polanco come off the IL as the players we know they can be, and they end the season as a B or A because the lineup put real hitters at the top instead of guys who belong in the bottom 3rd, or bench. If those 4 guys, or even 3 of them, do what they can for 100 games the rest of the way, and Rocco keeps messing with the lineup by putting platoon hitters in the top 3, and the run scoring struggles continue, I'll be the guy at Target Field holding the "Fire Rocco" sign. 

I see this as a top heavy team with players who aren't top of MLB good. The only way they can thrive is if their top guys play to near 100% of their ability. When any, let alone multiple, of them fail to live up to their potential, even for short streaks, the team falls apart because the rest of the guys simply aren't talented enough to pick up the slack. They need 5 of Buxton, Correa, Miranda, Kirilloff, Lewis, and Polanco to be good at all times or this offense simply can't succeed well enough.

[Craig Arko]

Does this mean they’ll need to take the GRE in order to be admitted into the playoffs?

[Mike Sixel]

How many games did the people giving them less than a C predict they'd win at the beginning of the year?

They are meeting expectations and are in the middle of the standings 

[notoriousgod71]

28 minutes ago, Mike Sixel said:

How many games did the people giving them less than a C predict they'd win at the beginning of the year?

They are meeting expectations and are in the middle of the standings 

Why should the expectations affect the grade? If I'm a math teacher and expect one student to fail and he does fail I'm not giving him a C because he met my expectations.

[bighat]

This team has two pitchers performing at Cy Young levels. As of May 25th, both Joe Ryan and Sonny Gray are absolutely legit contenders to be awarded best pitcher in baseball. Not only do the Twins have two of the best in the league, they also have Lopez and Ober who have been at least above average, and a shut down closer in Duran who's throwing 104 and is sporting a 1.47 ERA. A definite "A" for the pitching staff!

Yet with all that pitching dominance....this team is fighting to stay above .500? Huh? 

Offense gets an F minus, fundamentals, front office and management all have to be getting Ds or Fs as well. 

Overall grade: D

 

[Mike Sixel]

24 minutes ago, notoriousgod71 said:

Why should the expectations affect the grade? If I'm a math teacher and expect one student to fail and he does fail I'm not giving him a C because he met my expectations.

Ok. Fair. Middle of the standings.... And a D or worse?

[TwinsDr2021]

38 minutes ago, bighat said:

This team has two pitchers performing at Cy Young levels. As of May 25th, both Joe Ryan and Sonny Gray are absolutely legit contenders to be awarded best pitcher in baseball. Not only do the Twins have two of the best in the league, they also have Lopez and Ober who have been at least above average, and a shut down closer in Duran who's throwing 104 and is sporting a 1.47 ERA. A definite "A" for the pitching staff!

 

I will say the starting pitching has been really good, but I disagree Gray is pitching at a CY Young level, 6 of his 10 starts have been only 5 innings and one was 5.1 (he is 26th in the American league in innings), which is causing way too may not good relief pitchers to pitch. In the innings he does pitch he has been great.

So I say B+/A- for the starters, and D for the relief pitchers.

[Brock Beauchamp]

4 minutes ago, TwinsDr2021 said:

I will say the starting pitching has been really good, but I disagree Gray is pitching at a CY Young level, 6 of his 10 starts have been only 5 innings and one was 5.1 (he is 26th in the American league in innings), which is causing way too may not good relief pitchers to pitch. In the innings he does pitch he has been great.

So I say B+/A- for the starters, and D for the relief pitchers.

The starters can't receive anything lower than an A, in my opinion.

They have the second-best ERA in baseball and are sixth in innings pitched. Only 6.0 innings separate the Twins at sixth and the Cardinals in first.

The rotation has been outstanding, which makes the rest of it all the more infuriating.

[Mike Sixel]

14 minutes ago, TwinsDr2021 said:

I will say the starting pitching has been really good, but I disagree Gray is pitching at a CY Young level, 6 of his 10 starts have been only 5 innings and one was 5.1 (he is 26th in the American league in innings), which is causing way too may not good relief pitchers to pitch. In the innings he does pitch he has been great.

So I say B+/A- for the starters, and D for the relief pitchers.

B+? They are the first or second best starting staff in the game right now. WT* would they need to do to get an A?

D for relief pitchers? Have you compared the bullpen to the rest of baseball? 

[ashbury]

I gave them a C.

I expected them to be an A- at this point.

[ToddlerHarmon]

I haven't seen anyone defend a B grade yet, so here goes:

Performance-wise, they are in first place, and have a sizeable run differential, but are barely over .500, and trending down: B-

Talent-wise (also known as FO performance), they have a predictably top heavy bullpen and poor-OBP, therefore streaky, lineup. But you can't fault the rotation that this FO has put together, the lineup fixtures that are under team control, and the fact that they didn't sell the future of either to get there: B+

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

Gray and Ryan each deserve an A individually, but I wouldn’t give any of the other 5-6 starters an A. Maybe a solid B for a couple others. 

[LastOnePicked]

2 hours ago, Craig Arko said:

Does this mean they’ll need to take the GRE in order to be admitted into the playoffs?

The Get Rid of Emilio test? Yes it does. (Note: bless the man's heart. Sounds like a truly decent dude. But let's move on.)

[LastOnePicked]

25 minutes ago, ashbury said:

I expected them to be an A- at this point.

It's too bad we couldn't have submitted grades after the Yankees series. I would have been much more charitable.

[TwinsDr2021]

39 minutes ago, Mike Sixel said:

B+? They are the first or second best starting staff in the game right now. WT* would they need to do to get an A?

D for relief pitchers? Have you compared the bullpen to the rest of baseball? 

Oh didn't know I was required to give me grade based on a curve?

Ryan gets an A

Gray B+/A-

Lopez B/B+

Ober B+

Varland B-

Mahle - B-

Maeda - D

That seems like a B+/A- just like my initial post.

Bullpen

Winder - F

Rodriguez - F

SWR - F

Alcala - F

De Leon - D

Jax - C-

Pagan - C-

Moran - B-

Headrick - B

Lopez - B

Thielbar - A when he pitches but only has 10 innings so B-

Duran - A

Sands - A

Stewart - A

Castro - A

So maybe D was a bit harsh, I will up that to D+/C-.

 

[bighat]

57 minutes ago, Brock Beauchamp said:

The starters can't receive anything lower than an A, in my opinion.

They have the second-best ERA in baseball and are sixth in innings pitched. Only 6.0 innings separate the Twins at sixth and the Cardinals in first.

The rotation has been outstanding, which makes the rest of it all the more infuriating.

That's what I'm saying and that's why they get a "D". 

I know you have to factor in pitching as part of the grade here, but as a TEAM it's incredibly disappointing to see how they're frittering away such solid efforts. 

If the team were first in runs scored, homers, and OPS, but the pitching was last in ERA and led the league in blown saves, I'd give them a "C". 

Because at least the losses would be entertaining. The current product is mind-numbingly boring. 

[Mike Sixel]

5 minutes ago, TwinsDr2021 said:

Oh didn't know I was required to give me grade based on a curve?

Ryan gets an A

Gray B+/A-

Lopez B/B+

Ober B+

Varland B-

Mahle - B-

Maeda - D

That seems like a B+/A- just like my initial post.

Bullpen

Winder - F

Rodriguez - F

SWR - F

Alcala - F

De Leon - D

Jax - C-

Pagan - C-

Moran - B-

Headrick - B

Lopez - B

Thielbar - A when he pitches but only has 10 innings so B-

Duran - A

Sands - A

Stewart - A

Castro - A

So maybe D was a bit harsh, I will up that to D+/C-.

 

If you aren't comparing them to all of baseball, how are you coming up with the grades? 

[TwinsDr2021]

Just now, Mike Sixel said:

If you aren't comparing them to all of baseball, how are you coming up with the grades? 

umm, based on their performance, the only Twins starter that truly one of the best starters in the American league is Ryan (and he has been amazing), Gray has been great for his limited innings pitched. Lopez has been really good and has pitched more innings but has he been great? Varland and Ober have came up and saved the rotation after the Maeda was terrible and Mahle was average to decent. Both Varland and Ober have been very good but not great. So IMO B+/A- minus is more than fair grade, giving them an A would mean this is the best they can do? is that what you believe that they only way forward is being worse then right now?

[Mike Sixel]

23 minutes ago, TwinsDr2021 said:

umm, based on their performance, the only Twins starter that truly one of the best starters in the American league is Ryan (and he has been amazing), Gray has been great for his limited innings pitched. Lopez has been really good and has pitched more innings but has he been great? Varland and Ober have came up and saved the rotation after the Maeda was terrible and Mahle was average to decent. Both Varland and Ober have been very good but not great. So IMO B+/A- minus is more than fair grade, giving them an A would mean this is the best they can do? is that what you believe that they only way forward is being worse then right now?

Performance compared to what? The past years of pitchers, how other pitchers pitch? 

An A isn't "the best you can do". You can always do more of an A....but if A means the best (like 5 Cy Young winners, I guess), then I see how they don't get an A. Thanks for the polite conversation, even if we disagree.