Farmer update and safety measures

[glunn]

This is beyond depressing -- https://www.cnn.com/2023/04/12/sport/mlb-twins-kyle-farmer-surgery-spt-intl/index.html

I am wondering if a better batting helmet would have prevented this injury or reduced the impact.

 

[Squirrel]

 

[Brock Beauchamp]

Damned scary.

[glunn]

Here is a link to the video -- not for the faint of heart -- https://www.cbssports.com/mlb/news/kyle-farmer-injury-twins-infielder-leaves-game-after-getting-hit-in-the-face-by-a-lucas-giolito-pitch/

[Mike Sixel]

Good luck to him. Unreal a moderator made a joke about this. 

[Squirrel]

4 minutes ago, Mike Sixel said:

Good luck to him. Unreal a moderator made a joke about this. 

Report the post, then, but don't keep bringing it up in multiple threads

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

We have this conversation every 2-3 years. I don't know why pitchers and hitters at all levels are not wearing face guards and just better equipment in general. I'm not blaming Farmer. What happened to Farmer will happen again, and the next guy probably won't be so lucky, or unlucky.

[glunn]

2 minutes ago, Hosken Bombo Disco said:

We have this conversation every 2-3 years. I don't know why pitchers and hitters at all levels are not wearing face guards and just better equipment in general. I'm not blaming Farmer. What happened to Farmer will happen again, and the next guy probably won't be so lucky, or unlucky.

I wish that every player would use something like this -- https://www.si.com/review/best-baseball-helmet/

[RaoulDuke]

I can't imagine standing in vs a major league pitcher period let alone after having taken one to the face.

In little league on my first day in the oldest league I had to face the best pitcher we had in batting practice.  He was a year or two older than me and already throwing in the 80s.  The first 3 pitches made me look rather silly as I was no where close to them, then the next pitch hit me in the side of the helmet and knocked me down.  I was never a good hitter but after that I was bailing of out the box every time. 

He went on to be dominate in high school play then get drafted by the Red Sox in the 4th round, eventually blowing his arm out a year or two into the minors.  I went on to play varsity golf in high school where no one was throwing the ball at me.

[Richie the Rally Goat]

I hope Kyle recovers well and quickly. How awful!

[ashbury]

I don't care who you are, you did not have a worse day today than Kyle Farmer did.  Here's to as speedy a recovery as is possible under these circumstances.

[Brock Beauchamp]

36 minutes ago, RaoulDuke said:

I can't imagine standing in vs a major league pitcher period let alone after having taken one to the face.

Now that we're past the point of serious concern about his health, this is my biggest concern. Baseball history is littered with guys who could not get back to normal after a shot to the head for a long time. And given the current Twins roster, this could be a real problem.

[mnfireman]

Giolito - Same guy that ran a pitch inside on Miranda last year, hit his hand/wrist then his face. 

https://www.mlb.com/video/jose-miranda-hbp-exits-the-game

Pitchers have a hard time pitching inside anymore. Some can't do it at all. Somebody is going to be the next Tony Conigliaro with as hard as some of these guys throw.

[glunn]

1 hour ago, mnfireman said:

Giolito - Same guy that ran a pitch inside on Miranda last year, hit his hand/wrist then his face. 

https://www.mlb.com/video/jose-miranda-hbp-exits-the-game

Pitchers have a hard time pitching inside anymore. Some can't do it at all. Somebody is going to be the next Tony Conigliaro with as hard as some of these guys throw.

I believe that you are correct, and still remember Conigliaro's horrible injury. That was a tragedy and resulted in greater player safety.

I wish that someone would explain why a player would prefer a helmet that does not have a chin guard. Does the chin guard make it more difficult to see low pitches? Does it impact a player's swing.? Is there an engineering fix that could solve/reduce the problem, if there is one?

Also, no one has ever been able to explain to me why the Twins won't enhance the padding in the outfield at Target field, and I believe that the Royce Lewis collision with the wall would have not resulted in injury if the wall padding had been thicker and more high tech. I wrote a blog about that and there were no dissenters.

Considering what the Twins pay the players, it seems foolish to me that there seems to be little focus on preventing avoidable injuries. 

 

 

 

 

[Doctor Gast]

9 hours ago, glunn said:

This is beyond depressing -- https://www.cnn.com/2023/04/12/sport/mlb-twins-kyle-farmer-surgery-spt-intl/index.html

I am wondering if a better batting helmet would have prevented this injury or reduced the impact.

 

There's more likely a modified helmet that can prevent this type accidents but it's up to the player.

[CRF]

I've been following baseball since the early 1960's, and that hbp that Farmer took was one of the worst I've ever seen. I don't know how it didn't do a lot more damage than it did. I hope to God that he's ok and makes a full recovery. I just want him to be ok...for himself, and his family. Forget about baseball. 

[Doctor Gast]

9 hours ago, glunn said:

Here is a link to the video -- not for the faint of heart -- https://www.cbssports.com/mlb/news/kyle-farmer-injury-twins-infielder-leaves-game-after-getting-hit-in-the-face-by-a-lucas-giolito-pitch/

It'd appeared to me to maybe hit the top edge of the helmit, prior to have hit his jaw

[wornsmooth]

7 hours ago, Brock Beauchamp said:

Now that we're past the point of serious concern about his health, this is my biggest concern. Baseball history is littered with guys who could not get back to normal after a shot to the head for a long time. And given the current Twins roster, this could be a real problem.

Remember Jimmy Hall after being beaten by Bo Belinsky?

He was never the same. 33 HRS as a rookie. He was definitely one of the guys you always wondered if that changed everything.

[Doctor Wu]

In regards to Farmer's playing status, I haven't read anything about placing him on the IL. Does that mean he may be back in the lineup in the next game or two? If so, I'll be pleasantly surprised. Can't be easy to bounce back from a HBP like that one.

[Fat Calvin]

7 hours ago, mnfireman said:

Giolito - Same guy that ran a pitch inside on Miranda last year, hit his hand/wrist then his face. 

https://www.mlb.com/video/jose-miranda-hbp-exits-the-game

Pitchers have a hard time pitching inside anymore. Some can't do it at all. Somebody is going to be the next Tony Conigliaro with as hard as some of these guys throw.

I can never forget that picture of Conigliaro's face on the cover of Sports Illustrated.  I haven't seen it in years.  I don't need to see it; it's still with me.

 

[Squirrel]

36 minutes ago, Doctor Wu said:

In regards to Farmer's playing status, I haven't read anything about placing him on the IL. Does that mean he may be back in the lineup in the next game or two? If so, I'll be pleasantly surprised. Can't be easy to bounce back from a HBP like that one.

He was placed on the IL, almost immediately, and Kyle Garlick has been added

[weitz41]

Man, that causes me to flinch every time I see it. He's been a big piece of this season success and hope he can return. Hoping for a speedy recovery and no long-term effects.

[jmlease1]

I'm really glad it wasn't worse. It looked and sounded horrible, and I think he's really lucky to have not broken his jaw/face. Bummer for him about the dental realignment; that's going to be painful and annoying for a while, but it's a good sign that they didn't need a lot of mechanical stuff in there to hold everything in place. He's still in for an unpleasant next week or two.

Felt bad for Giolito, who clearly just lost control of a fastball and wasn't trying to hit Farmer at all. He seemed pretty upset by it, which speaks well of him, IMHO.

I hope MLB and the MLBPA look at this and have some conversations about player safety and take action. With as hard as pitchers are throwing, it's getting more dangerous at the plate. While I've been frustrated by hitters wearing the equivalent of body armor on their entire arm (and subsequently not even trying to get out of the way on an inside pitch while crowding the plate; I've seen guys get an HPB that way on a pitch that could have been called a strike if the hitter didn't dip their armored elbow in there) but they need to do more to protect the head. It shouldn't just be "player choice" any longer when it comes to the head. I don't want to see someone get severely injured with an errant 98mph pitch to the head, or god forbid actually get killed. 

Get ahead of this MLB and MLBPA, please.

[cheeseheadgophfan]

The "chin guard" extension type helmet first started being used when I was finishing up playing amateur baseball.  I hated them.  I felt it was distracting and felt that it affected the way you could track some lower pitches. 

However, that was amateur baseball.  With guys averaging 93+ on fastballs nowadays.....I think we will see these becoming more and more common in the MLB.  Seeing guys throwing 100+ and not always having the best command is frightening.   There is literally near-zero reaction time.   

[TaterTot]

This is the worst part of baseball, absolutely horrific. I hope that Farmer has a speedy and comfortable recovery.

[ChermesZ]

1 hour ago, jmlease1 said:

I'm really glad it wasn't worse. It looked and sounded horrible, and I think he's really lucky to have not broken his jaw/face. Bummer for him about the dental realignment; that's going to be painful and annoying for a while, but it's a good sign that they didn't need a lot of mechanical stuff in there to hold everything in place. He's still in for an unpleasant next week or two.

Felt bad for Giolito, who clearly just lost control of a fastball and wasn't trying to hit Farmer at all. He seemed pretty upset by it, which speaks well of him, IMHO.

I hope MLB and the MLBPA look at this and have some conversations about player safety and take action. With as hard as pitchers are throwing, it's getting more dangerous at the plate. While I've been frustrated by hitters wearing the equivalent of body armor on their entire arm (and subsequently not even trying to get out of the way on an inside pitch while crowding the plate; I've seen guys get an HPB that way on a pitch that could have been called a strike if the hitter didn't dip their armored elbow in there) but they need to do more to protect the head. It shouldn't just be "player choice" any longer when it comes to the head. I don't want to see someone get severely injured with an errant 98mph pitch to the head, or god forbid actually get killed. 

Get ahead of this MLB and MLBPA, please.

I remember when Carlos Quentin used his armor to rush greinke and break his collarbone.  Protection is good, but they should have to wear the armor on the base paths - especially when they stick it into the strike zone.

[Fire Dan Gladden]

Regarding the helmets and protection, there is still a lot of ego and machismo rampant in things like this.  This is why most pitchers will not wear the padded hat on the mound.  Technology being what it is today, they could easily design a faceguard that would be unobtrusive.

I am not a big fan of the body armor.  I still remember Barry Bonds standing at the plate in a suit of armor with zero fear of getting plunked.

Baseball could legislate certain things that would help:  Automatic ejections/suspensions for HBPs above the shoulder, regardless of intent.  They could also treat HBPs like Technical fouls in basketball.  Fines for each one, suspensions after a certain number on the year.  Changing the batters box to force batters off the plate.  Requiring safer helmets.  But they won't.  Too many baseball purists saying it will ruin the game and too many players unwilling to change.

[Doctor Gast]

1 hour ago, cheeseheadgophfan said:

The "chin guard" extension type helmet first started being used when I was finishing up playing amateur baseball.  I hated them.  I felt it was distracting and felt that it affected the way you could track some lower pitches. 

However, that was amateur baseball.  With guys averaging 93+ on fastballs nowadays.....I think we will see these becoming more and more common in the MLB.  Seeing guys throwing 100+ and not always having the best command is frightening.   There is literally near-zero reaction time.   

Back when Nolan Ryan started throw that heat & didn't have the control. Players hated to step up to the plate. They should have started to become serious then about special jaw protection. But praise God it wasn't more serious with Farmer.

[goulik]

1 hour ago, cheeseheadgophfan said:

The "chin guard" extension type helmet first started being used when I was finishing up playing amateur baseball.  I hated them.  I felt it was distracting and felt that it affected the way you could track some lower pitches. 

However, that was amateur baseball.  With guys averaging 93+ on fastballs nowadays.....I think we will see these becoming more and more common in the MLB.  Seeing guys throwing 100+ and not always having the best command is frightening.   There is literally near-zero reaction time.   

I had some questions/thoughts before your comment so I will ask you. I would like your honest opinion as you would know a lot better than I would... Is it possibly because of what you are used to or is it truly interfering? If these types of safer helmets were used from an early age, would we be more likely to see them used throughout HS, College, Minors and MLB or is the decreased visibility that significant? 

[cheeseheadgophfan]

7 minutes ago, goulik said:

I had some questions/thoughts before your comment so I will ask you. I would like your honest opinion as you would know a lot better than I would... Is it possibly because of what you are used to or is it truly interfering? If these types of safer helmets were used from an early age, would we be more likely to see them used throughout HS, College, Minors and MLB or is the decreased visibility that significant? 

Every kid growing up now (at least where my kids play) uses the extended flap and I've never heard them complaining (can't tell you if that's because they don't know any different).  As for me, I had been playing fairly high-level ball for 10-15 years when I first tried it.  I think it was probably the change that bothered me most....hard to tell.  I probably blamed it for my trouble with a low slider....LOL.

The players coming up have been used to using it (at least as an option) while growing up.  But, like I said, I think it will be more and more customary (if not mandatory) in the near future.  

I've seen plenty of 90 mph fastballs in my day.....scary enough.  Add in 10 mph and it boggles my mind.  You have literally no chance to get out of the way if you're actually committed to staying on the ball.