Jump to content
Twins Daily
  • Create Account

Twins Make Multiple Vaccination-Related Roster Moves


Message added by Brock Beauchamp,

This is going to be a rough topic on both sides of the issue so please, do not ascribe either moral superiority or moral failing on any players spoken about in this thread. No matter whether you personally agree or disagree with them, their choice is their own and we expect everyone to be treated with respect on these forums.

Community Moderator
4 minutes ago, Brock Beauchamp said:

The fact that Chi-Chi Gonzalez is starting a game for a first place team in June makes me want to burn down Target Field.

To be fair, nine other starters have already started games, so it's fair to say that he was the organization's 10th option. 

I would have preferred him to be the 13th option after Canterino, Woods-Richardson and Balazovic, but there've been plenty of years where he'd have been the 6th or 7th option. Like maybe even last year.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, nicksaviking said:

To be fair, nine other starters have already started games, so it's fair to say that he was the organization's 10th option. 

I would have preferred him to be the 13th option after Canterino, Woods-Richardson and Balazovic, but there've been plenty of years where he'd have been the 6th or 7th option. Like maybe even last year.

Oh, I understand why it’s happening but it’s still frustrating as hell to see. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, TwinsDr2021 said:

agree, his comment was moronic. Unlike the Pagan's comment that seems well thought out and informational (if if you don't like or agree with it)

Agree, Pagan owned up to it. I disagree with his choice, but he at least didnt try to throw a pity party for himself. I havent heard anything from Thielbar or Megill, but Kepler's comment was tone deaf, and much of the reason I am annoyed with him. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Verified Member
4 minutes ago, BobAzar said:

When it comes to public health issues, choices of others have large ramifications. but my point was saying "its part of the game" is a poor reason. These are deliberate choices made by players that have an effect on the team. getting hit by a ball and breaking a bone is part of the game, needing TJ surgery is part of the game. a deliberate non-choice is part of life, but not that game. 

Thanks for clarifying. I do understand your point. I agree with most of it. Where I differ is when it comes to choice. If choice is allowed, you have to respect what one chooses for themselves. While I would agree it’s important to understand public health issues, the very same public health organizations have not made it mandatory.

There is still much to learn about COVID-19 and the various strands that keep popping up. There is still much to learn about the approved vaccinations, and I say that knowing so far, it has been quite good. Johnson & Johnson’s vaccine, based on the adenovirus technology, that technology has been used and successfully completed the rigorous approval process, even if their specific COVID-19 variant only received the emergency use designation.

The mRNA based vaccines all use a new technology that, while promising, had never been previously approved for mainstream medical use. At best, it has thusfar only been given emergency use approval. There is still much to learn about it. More accurately, it is at the vaccine stage where more needed to be learned about in order to successfully use the technology for it’s real money-making, world changing purpose - self healing therapies. In other words, the world is currently mRNA’s guinea pig, and it’s never been at this massive scale in history. While I’m not suggesting any conspiracies, I am stating that those who wish to choose caution, actually have a valid reason. Respect that.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I guess I can respect how important the decision is to each of these players. I don’t think they are getting paid. Megill is giving up major league pay. Kepler must be giving up around 125000.

This is not a decision I would have made but I can respect it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Verified Member
33 minutes ago, RLTW894 said:

If choice is allowed, you have to respect what one chooses for themselves.

No, I don't. I have to accept it, because I can't, and shouldn't be able to, force them to choose differently. But I in no way have to respect it, and I don't. In fact, I disrespect their decision.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Verified Member

The fact they are going with Contrares and not Kirolloff clearly shows the next time Alex makes the team is they plan to have him long time, or he is not vaxed either, but thinking they want to keep Alex down until he shows long term success in AAA. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 minutes ago, 4twinsJA said:

I have read and listened to arguments against getting vaccinated. They only argument that has any validity is "You are not going to tell me what to do, it is my choice." 

Excited to see how Hamilton does, wondered why he did not get the call last year.

The hole in this argument is, it can be used to justify drunk driving. same argument. "if people are scared about drunk drivers/COVID, they can stay off the road/stay home". "My liver/immune system is great, alcohol/COVID doesnt affect me the same". 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Verified Member
1 hour ago, nicksaviking said:

Joe Ryan pitched in the Olympics last year though so it's not him, they all had to be vaccinated.

Is that really the case, though?

I only did a quick Google search but it seems like vaccination was only a requirement for the Beijing Winter olympics, not the Tokyo Summer Olympics a few months earlier in which Ryan participated. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Community Moderator
2 minutes ago, Sielk said:

Is that really the case, though?

I only did a quick Google search but it seems like vaccination was only a requirement for the Beijing Winter olympics, not the Tokyo Summer Olympics a few months earlier in which Ryan participated. 

Well, that was a simple search, you're right. I guess I assumed it was both Olympics, but it was just Beijing. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Verified Member

It's disappointing to me that some players put themselves before the team's success because they don't want to take a vaccine that millions of people worldwide have taken largely without issues and that many people are actually required to take for their jobs.

Kepler's rather tone-deaf statement doesn't make it better. If you aren't getting vaccinated, at least own it instead of making excuses and acting like a victim. 

On a positive note, I am happy for Ian Hamilton that he finally gets his chance after seemingly every other reliever in St. Paul got a call up before he did. Maybe he can do well enough to show that he can help the Twins this season.  He sure has the stuff to do it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Verified Member
36 minutes ago, 4twinsJA said:

I have read and listened to arguments against getting vaccinated. They only argument that has any validity is "You are not going to tell me what to do, it is my choice." 

Excited to see how Hamilton does, wondered why he did not get the call last year.

Hamilton has only pitched 12 innings so far. That he has stayed with the Twins system into his third season means no one wants him, or the Twins really like him. He ahs to watch the walks. Has improved on those a bit this season. The Twins are getting a lucky look. Maybe they can get him into two game situations over the weekend and really evaluate him for the future. 

He was originaly signed in the 2020 off-season and put on the 40-man roster back then.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Verified Member
37 minutes ago, 4twinsJA said:

I have read and listened to arguments against getting vaccinated. They only argument that has any validity is "You are not going to tell me what to do, it is my choice." 

 

Where? On here? Do some research and quit watching CNN, MSNBC and the View. 

Left and right are good on a baseball field, but you have think for yourself and take the time to research.

I respect each person's to make the decision they deem is best for them.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I got vaccinated as soon as I could because I'm older and wanted to take away any death possibility even though I'm in very good shape and have no morbidities.

Don't be upset with players making a health decision they feel is best.

Be upset with Canada who don't understand that vaccinated people can get Covid and spread Covid just as likely as unvaccinated people. Follow the science.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, nicksaviking said:

Athletes will go to all kinds of lengths to get a competitive advantage, yes, I'd think anyone who truly had winning as their top priority would get vaccinated.

But I understand that's not every athlete's top priority.

So you are fully in support of athletes potentially playing games with their long-term health, all for your entertainment?  Says a lot about you, tbh.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Community Moderator
2 minutes ago, Cap'n Piranha said:

So you are fully in support of athletes potentially playing games with their long-term health, all for your entertainment?  Says a lot about you, tbh.

Their long term health is not at risk. No reasonable person would believe otherwise.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, BobAzar said:

Agree, Pagan owned up to it. I disagree with his choice, but he at least didnt try to throw a pity party for himself. I havent heard anything from Thielbar or Megill, but Kepler's comment was tone deaf, and much of the reason I am annoyed with him. 

Thielbar actually made some excellent points (there is another post on this site that shows them).  He pointed out that everyone was allowed into Canada last year, so long as they tested negative, and players who hadn't received the shot stayed in their rooms when not engaged in baseball activities.

This year, Canada is completely unconcerned about whether or not people entering the country have Covid or not, as long as they have received a shot.  While Max did not frame his opinion very well, his point is valid, as Thielbar demonstrated in his comments.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

51 minutes ago, BobAzar said:

The hole in this argument is, it can be used to justify drunk driving. same argument. "if people are scared about drunk drivers/COVID, they can stay off the road/stay home". "My liver/immune system is great, alcohol/COVID doesnt affect me the same". 

And of course taking away individual choice has never led to anything bad in all of human history.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Verified Member
3 minutes ago, nicksaviking said:

Their long term health is not at risk. No reasonable person would believe otherwise.

You don't know that for sure. The "vaccines" are new, were rushed into production and there have been several reported cases of cardiac arrests and other heart/health problems in athletes. 

The long-term effects won't be known for another 5-10 years.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It's funny to see all of these comments in here about "freedom of choice" and "personal decisions" and etc etc etc.  And as for a Starting Pitcher being listed as the 5th unvaccinated player it's obvious that this is someone injured or who wasn't going to pitch in the next three games.  

But I can't wait to see how all of the anti-vax sentiment changes dramatically if we have to play Toronto in the playoffs and we don't have our starting RF, a SP, and our Closer in either 2, 3, or 4 games.  Me thinks thee Twins fans will be singin' a much different tune if we get to that point.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 minutes ago, nicksaviking said:

Their long term health is not at risk. No reasonable person would believe otherwise.

How can you possibly claim to know what the impacts of 2 year old medicines are 10, 20, or 30 years down the road.  The hubristic arrogance here is simply astounding.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Verified Member
10 minutes ago, nicksaviking said:

Their long term health is not at risk. No reasonable person would believe otherwise.

You might want to do a search on ‘long Covid’ prior to making that claim. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Verified Member

Not really shocked by any of these names. I supposed I wouldn't have been totally surprised by any name, there are vaccination stances that cut across politics even if it has gotten more polarized recently. Kepler seems to keep quiet about his personal politics but I kind of had a feeling.

I hope both the Twins and Jays are in the playoffs and at least one or two change their minds before then.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

30 minutes ago, Sielk said:

It's disappointing to me that some players put themselves before the team's success because they don't want to take a vaccine that millions of people worldwide have taken largely without issues and that many people are actually required to take for their jobs.

Kepler's rather tone-deaf statement doesn't make it better. If you aren't getting vaccinated, at least own it instead of making excuses and acting like a victim. 

On a positive note, I am happy for Ian Hamilton that he finally gets his chance after seemingly every other reliever in St. Paul got a call up before he did. Maybe he can do well enough to show that he can help the Twins this season.  He sure has the stuff to do it.

Anyone who wants the Covid shot should get it.  It is certainly helpful in improving potential outcomes, particularly for the elderly, those with comorbidities, or the immune compromised.

But the argument that everyone should get it in the name of public health essentially boils down to "I got the shot so I'm protected from Covid, but you also must get the shot to protect me from getting Covid from you, even though I'm totally protected from Covid, because I got the shot".

Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 minutes ago, Cap'n Piranha said:

Thielbar actually made some excellent points (there is another post on this site that shows them).  He pointed out that everyone was allowed into Canada last year, so long as they tested negative, and players who hadn't received the shot stayed in their rooms when not engaged in baseball activities.

This year, Canada is completely unconcerned about whether or not people entering the country have Covid or not, as long as they have received a shot.  While Max did not frame his opinion very well, his point is valid, as Thielbar demonstrated in his comments.

This year, those entering Canada are subject to random testing as well as a vaccine requirement. Many countries, not just Canada, have vaccine requirements. Some are lifting them. Last year the vaccines were just rolling out so they didn't have a requirement at the border. They do as of January. It's another country. They get to do what they want no matter how unfair it seems to some.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Verified Member
1 hour ago, RLTW894 said:

The mRNA based vaccines all use a new technology that, while promising, had never been previously approved for mainstream medical use. At best, it has thusfar only been given emergency use approval. 

Both the Moderna and Pfizer vaccines have had full FDA approval for adults since January and August, respectively. You can't say that for any other COVID treatments.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
 Share

The Twins Daily Caretaker Fund
The Twins Daily Caretaker Fund

You all care about this site. The next step is caring for it. We’re asking you to caretake this site so it can remain the premiere Twins community on the internet.

×
×
  • Create New...