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Twins Trade Donaldson, Kiner-Falefa to Yankees for Sanchez, Urshela


1 hour ago, Major League Ready said:

This is not at all confusing if their goal is to add Story and given the uncertainty of their SS prospects that makes sense.  With Story, the net of all of this is a huge improvement at SS, plus a front line SP, plus a big defensive improvement at 3B.  Plus, when Miranda takes over we have a great utility player or trade asset.  I am a Donaldson fan but he had negative trade value and his defense at 3B was definitely fading.  He may or may not be more valuable than Urshela this year but getting him off the books for 23 and the $8M buyout in 2024 provides the opportunity for other additions.

Urshela has 5 years of control.  He had a bad year last year but he produced 3.1 WAR in 2019 and 1.6 WAR in 43 games during the covid year.  That equates to 5 WAR had he played 135 games.  I like this trade.
They will be worse a Catcher but much better at SS and starting pitching.  An infield of Kirilloff / Polanco / Story / Urshela looks pretty darn good to me.  Add Sonny Gray and this year looks waaay better then it did a week ago.

It's also noteworthy that this almost certainly takes the Yankees out of the free agent SS market.  

Urshela has 2 years of control and this does not take the Yankees out of the SS market.

agreed on your implication that Sanchez’s liability behind the plate is not much of an impact, he might catch once or twice a week.

agreed on your outlook of the infield if they sign Story

what if they don’t? How do you feel about:

Kiriloff, Polanco, Urshela, Martin?

 

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The convoluted nature of the last day illustrates how averse the FO is to big contacts for pitchers. Maeda and Gray both have very team friendly deals. They don't appear as averse to large deals for position players such as Donaldson. It follows then that they will add Story and trade for a pitcher who has a uniquely team friendly deal. Now if someone figures out who that pitcher is you could save us all much suspense.

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Generally an optimistic person but well I don't know what to think now - had the 24 hours of picturing Kiner-Falefa playing SS for us.   Hopefully we find a SS.  Also hoping Urshela performs but really would prefer not to see Sanchez play for the Twins but I guess we need someone to split catching duties with Jeffers.   

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10 hours ago, tony&rodney said:

"Donaldson's presence and salary both looked like odd fits with the Twins seemingly entering a transitional year. Shipping him to the Yankees makes sense in terms of their contention status and spending capabilities. Donaldson also feels like a proper personality fit in the Bronx." - Nick Nelson

What does this mean? Dis Donaldson do something wrong? Are the Twins going below $100 million for their roster budgets? Is their roster incapable of competing in the AL Central? JD competes, he is a winner. Are these qualities anathema in Minnesota? I'm very confused by this paragraph Nick and I like your writing.

I think at this stage of his career Donaldson has an expectation of full-on contention and I don't think he'd be very content on a team that's taking a step back and looking to the future. 

On a more subjective note, I think this brashness and ego are better fits in a place like New York than with the culture Rocco's trying to build here.

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5 minutes ago, Sconnie said:

Urshela has 2 years of control and this does not take the Yankees out of the SS market.

agreed on your implication that Sanchez’s liability behind the plate is not much of an impact, he might catch once or twice a week.

agreed on your outlook of the infield if they sign Story

what if they don’t? How do you feel about:

Kiriloff, Polanco, Urshela, Martin?

 

IDK what I was thinking on Urshela having 5 years control so that takes some of the shine off that swap.  However, I have always said I would trade Donaldson if they could get someone to take most of his salary.  Of course, there is no upside if they don't invest the money elsewhere.  I would bet we see some additional investment. 

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The Yankees were never in the SS market, they've been pretty clear they are saving that spot for a couple of their young prospects.  They wanted a placeholder and IKF fits that.  

I don't think this team is done reshaping this roster.  And when a team is as bad as the 2021 Twins were....why would anyone want to roll out with the same people?

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1 minute ago, Nick Nelson said:

I think at this stage of his career Donaldson has an expectation of full-on contention and I don't think he'd be very content on a team that's taking a step back and looking to the future. 

On a more subjective note, I think this brashness and ego are better fits in a place like New York than with the culture Rocco's trying to build here.

I guess I am way off on the Twins. The AL Central isn't that terrific and I believed that a budget of $120 million would bring the Twins to a position of contention. My figure is below what Twins Daily had suggested and well below what the market can bear, especially in light of the new CBA and emerging revenue streams.

JD is a professional player in my opinion. I don't know him personally. I am not aware of any issues he had either, but it is very difficult to see where the team is going when it chooses mediocrity. Urshela is a decent, albeit expensive, utility player and Sanchez is a DH only with mighty issues. Signings like Bundy, Happ, or Pineda are not helpful looking back or going forward. But maybe Bundy wins a Cy Young. The future is unpredictable.

I'm not down on Rocco in any way but he is among the most inexperienced managers in baseball and he had Cruz, JD, Adrianza, and Hill as well as some solid assistants now gone to pave the way in the past few years. Obviously, time will tell how the changes play out. I hope everything works out. 

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1 hour ago, Mike h said:

Inside this 66 year old body lives an 8 year old boy who doesn't give two hoots about contracts or economics. He loves his favorite players and is sad to see them go. He worries that we won't be as good without them.  Allhe wants is to have enough good players to win lots of games and be world champions. This boy will never grow up.

Same here at 69 and in my youth I could name the rosters of teams. Those days are sadly long gone.

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Does having picked up two Yankees who are familiar with NY improve our chances when we meet them in this years ALCS? Maybe all this is, is an attempt to overcome the "jinx"? 
 

On a more serious note we seem to have again went to the possibility of a bat first SS? And since I read somewhere that pitching has a lot to do with winning in baseball, who’s gonna do that. 
 

This seems like a move towards a rebuild year, unless they miraculously pick up two top flight SP. Frankly I would find that preferable to getting stuck in the middle. Which I define as pretending to be competitive, and not going wholesale into the rebuild. I really don’t care which way they go, just don’t do it half a^~ed!

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My initial reaction and my reaction many hours later: oh god, why?

The Twins had plenty of money without having to salary dump Donaldson. Urshela is a downgrade from him, but at least he’s not horrible like Sanchez. 
 

Catching got worse, which I thought was impossible. Need to trade Sanchez ASAP. Need a SS again. Now need a catcher and still need pitching. 

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1 hour ago, Mike h said:

Inside this 66 year old body lives an 8 year old boy who doesn't give two hoots about contracts or economics. He loves his favorite players and is sad to see them go. He worries that we won't be as good without them.  Allhe wants is to have enough good players to win lots of games and be world champions. This boy will never grow up.

Why do we allow youngsters on this site? 😃

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I'm not making any comment on this trade because I think there might be more activity yet to come.  I want to see what the roster looks like on April 1st.  However, I would like to mention that, by my count, there were only two mentions of Correa being a target.  The money is there to give him what he wants.  And he is a much better player than Story.

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1 hour ago, Nick Nelson said:

I think at this stage of his career Donaldson has an expectation of full-on contention and I don't think he'd be very content on a team that's taking a step back and looking to the future. 

On a more subjective note, I think this brashness and ego are better fits in a place like New York than with the culture Rocco's trying to build here.

So: your position is 1) the Twins can't contend this year, and 2) the Twins should have no expectation of contention?

 

What an awful take.

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The fact that this trade was done without a deal on the side already completed shows that the twins are fine not competing this year if they don’t get their guy, which at this point is very clearly Trevor Story. 
I don’t think Story makes this team much better but that’s a story for another time. 

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I wonder if this was the plan when we traded with Texas, or after that got done Yankees came knocking.  It seems like they could have done a three team trade, and maybe that was talked about but things just did not work out, so we had to go the path they did.  NO way is the FO done with this deal.  We get weaker at 3rd and catcher to just get a big contract out.  It makes no sense as we still have hole at SS and go with a lessor 3rd baseman or unproven guy.  I know Story is rumored, and read Twins have little plans to keep Sanchez, not sure if he will be released or they will try to trade him, but that leaves hole at backup catcher now too. 

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"Clearing payroll"???!!!  Screw that!  The Twins needed a new stadium for revenues to "compete", a stadium that was taxpayer subsidized!  Now, they have a lower payroll, even before the strike, let alone adding to it!!!!  There is so much disparity between the "haves and have nots"!!!  Not fair!  Twins take on older, often injury prone retreads for pitchers, wait until their prospects qualify for medicare to bring them up (or trade them to the likes of the Yanks for future prospects, later to then be traded to the likes of the Yanks, essentially being a farm club for such teams)!!!!  What has been their highest payroll?  125 million, or so, and that would be in the middle of MLB payrolls at best!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Fans are ticked off!!!  Prices are waaaayyyy to high, from everything like concessions, parking, merchandise, and....wait for it.....tickets!!!!  A family needs to take out a loan just to go to a game, and that doesn't include driving there (if outstate) and hotel/food!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  Lastly, with all the rising t.v., cable, dish, streaming prices, which are also locking out the fan base!

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14 minutes ago, Dawgzilla said:

"Clearing payroll"???!!!  Screw that!  The Twins needed a new stadium for revenues to "compete", a stadium that was taxpayer subsidized!  Now, they have a lower payroll, even before the strike, let alone adding to it!!!!  There is so much disparity between the "haves and have nots"!!!  Not fair!  Twins take on older, often injury prone retreads for pitchers, wait until their prospects qualify for medicare to bring them up (or trade them to the likes of the Yanks for future prospects, later to then be traded to the likes of the Yanks, essentially being a farm club for such teams)!!!!  What has been their highest payroll?  125 million, or so, and that would be in the middle of MLB payrolls at best!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Fans are ticked off!!!  Prices are waaaayyyy to high, from everything like concessions, parking, merchandise, and....wait for it.....tickets!!!!  A family needs to take out a loan just to go to a game, and that doesn't include driving there (if outstate) and hotel/food!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  Lastly, with all the rising t.v., cable, dish, streaming prices, which are also locking out the fan base!

You can get a nosebleed or standing room ticket for like $20 dude, what are you on about? 

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3 minutes ago, Twins33 said:

Dude is jacked. I don’t know how he doesn’t “accidentally” hit 20 HRs a season but here we are…

Some of the biggest punchers in boxing have skinny arms. Being muscle bound doesn't necessarily translate to explosive power.

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2 minutes ago, wabene said:

Some of the biggest punchers in boxing have skinny arms. Being muscle bound doesn't necessarily translate to explosive power.

Yes, that was the point of what I said. 

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5 hours ago, Azviking101 said:

The fact that this trade was done without a deal on the side already completed shows that the twins are fine not competing this year if they don’t get their guy, which at this point is very clearly Trevor Story. 
I don’t think Story makes this team much better but that’s a story for another time. 

You mean not competing this year, next year, the next year, the next year... back to the seventies, only with a team that is not even 500 capable.

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1 minute ago, Twins33 said:

Yes, that was the point of what I said. 

In this case it did mean superior fielding skills to what the Twins had/have.

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One 63 year old mans opinion.

JD is a fine hitter but I cringed watching him run last year. Every routine double turned into a bang bang play because of his jogging to avoid a leg injury. His defense also suffered from the effort he put forth to avoid injury. He was overpaid in his current capacity. The Yankee trade appears to be a dump of JD for a dump of an over the hill catcher at less than 1/2 of JD's salary so the Twins had to add useful players to make it work. Nobody knows how he fit into the clubhouse but watching him showoff (sticky stuff) after he hit a homer with the Twins down 6 runs says enough for me. I wondered how he was going to fit in with the loosy goosy Bomba Squad after they signed him.  I remember him chastising Arraez for moving while on 2nd base and he was at the plate. 

This trade sure looks like a big win in 2022 and beyond for the Yankees. If it is it's because of the mistake made 2 years earlier by signing JD for too much money. If Rortvedt isn't involved, I say the trade was even. If the Twins got a lottery ticket in return, I'd say it was an even trade. But not to be.

Like the saying goes, beware what you wish for, you just might get it.

For months I was wishing the Twins would do something, but this seems like they're going backwards.

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It was not a mistake to sign JD to "too much money" before....they were contending and signed a legit big time great player. It isn't their fault the pandemic happened. He was actually healthy most of the last few years, if slow. 

Fans constantly want them to spend money...they did, when they should have. At a position they needed help at.

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