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LaMonte Wade Jr.'s Giants Performance


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LaMonte is such a great person. I am really, really happy for him. He's earned this opportunity. 

As pointed out above, people understood the deal at the time. The Twins traded from a position of depth for a position of need. Yes, I would have picked Wade over Cave, but Cave was a terrific fourth outfielder in 2018 and 2019. Struggled in the strange 2020 season. And played this year with a fractured back, while playing every day against left-handed pitching. 

I'm not surprised Wade is doing well, now that he's getting the opportunity to play nearly every day. 

 

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1 hour ago, gunnarthor said:

The trade made sense but obviously the Twins misjudged Shaun Anderson. That's problematic.

Even misjudging him can be explained away but yes, it's problematic at the very least.

But then the waiver wire loss so early into the season when the MLB club was flat-out pathetic... that's when the situation became inexcusable in my eyes.

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They dealt a 4th OF for a guy.....they chose the wrong guy. But man, people act like they gave up a great player.....I too preferred Wade over Cave, but the hope was NEITHER would play much this year.....

People* whine the farm system isn't good, then whine when they deal from depth and are wrong. People whine they have a 40 man crunch, deal a backup OF, and then get mad when he's good for another team. 

*not calling out the OP here, but this site.......and a HUGE swath of users who somehow want a great farm system, but to never trade a guy they like.

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10 minutes ago, Mike Sixel said:

They dealt a 4th OF for a guy.....they chose the wrong guy. But man, people act like they gave up a great player.....I too preferred Wade over Cave, but the hope was NEITHER would play much this year.....

People* whine the farm system isn't good, then whine when they deal from depth and are wrong. People whine they have a 40 man crunch, deal a backup OF, and then get mad when he's good for another team. 

*not calling out the OP here, but this site.......and a HUGE swath of users who somehow want a great farm system, but to never trade a guy they like.

I thought it was a fine trade at the time. And the front office is definitely going to miss from time to time... but...

Literally all they've done in the past 12 months is miss and it's usually not only a miss but a spectacular miss. That inspires no confidence in their future decisions.

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11 minutes ago, Brock Beauchamp said:

I thought it was a fine trade at the time. And the front office is definitely going to miss from time to time... but...

Literally all they've done in the past 12 months is miss and it's usually not only a miss but a spectacular miss. That inspires no confidence in their future decisions.

Fair.....this last 12 months look VERY different than the previous 24......It is interesting looking at the projections for the pitchers they signed, and how wrong everyone* was.

*not the naysayers.....of which I was one on signing BOTH Happ and Shoemaker....but many, many, who know way more about baseball than us.

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2 hours ago, Brock Beauchamp said:

But then the waiver wire loss so early into the season when the MLB club was flat-out pathetic... that's when the situation became inexcusable in my eyes.

I'm not sure about this -- I certainly don't want them to hold onto a guy like Shaun Anderson past his expiration date, in the vain hope they can somehow salvage the trade. He's currently pitching just as badly for Baltimore as he did for us.

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2 minutes ago, Otto von Ballpark said:

I'm not sure about this -- I certainly don't want them to hold onto a guy like Shaun Anderson past his expiration date, in the vain hope they can somehow salvage the trade. He's currently pitching just as badly for Baltimore as he did for us.

And if everything else wasn't crashing down on their heads at the same time, I probably would have shrugged it off.

But the losses (not the team, the organization) keep piling up. The front office is going to need a handful of wins back on the board before the trust comes back.

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I'll add that they need like 20 pitchers in a season....and in MOST only 2 backup OFers (who you don't want to play much anyway). MOST of the time, a team should protect more pitchers and let what appears to be an excess OFer go. 

I feel like a shill for the FO the past few weeks*....it seems like everyone has forgotten how far they came how fast. That said, I'm not yet in love with ANY long term decisions they've made, and really hate the lack of pitching from the minors. Hence, next year, I will start making real judgements. 

*those that know me know that shilling for mgmt isn't exactly my style......

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Something to keep in mind with Wade: where would he have played here? He's not a CF, and he's a left-handed bat who still struggles vs LHP (up to 0-for-29 for his MLB career).

We already have Kepler, Larnach, Kirilloff, and Arraez as left-handed bats in the outfield corners and at first base. There's been enough injuries that he probably would have seen some action but not a lot.

Even in San Francisco, Wade was mostly parked on the bench or on the AAA shuttle until 1B Brandon Belt got hurt, which opened up a temporary platoon opportunity with Darin Ruf. FWIW, Belt is expected back soon, at which point Wade's playing time may fall off sharply.

I echo the others in saying that the most frustrating thing here isn't Wade getting away, it's us failing to properly evaluate (pre-trade) or develop (post-trade) Shaun Anderson.

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57 minutes ago, Otto von Ballpark said:

We already have Kepler, Larnach, Kirilloff, and Arraez as left-handed bats in the outfield corners and at first base.

I hear you and agree with your take. Except for the highlighted part above: Kepler's batting .215, Larnach can't hit the broad side of a barn (.205 in July with a 50% strikeout rate and just 3xbh), Arraez is injured and Kirilloff is out for the year. Now, of course, nobody could have foreseen that and it's not the FO's fault that these guys are injured/unprepared. But their underperformance is something we have to be honest about and accept.

Now I can see why the front office traded Wade at the time - I'm not second-guessing. But to pretend the Twins couldn't use a guy batting .270 with 12 HRs and a good eye? That doesn't ring true to me.

Put it this way: if the Twins could undo what they did and put the guy back on the roster, they would, and he'd be starting in the OF tonight.

 

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4 minutes ago, bighat said:

I hear you and agree with your take. Except for the highlighted part above: Kepler's batting .215, Larnach can't hit the broad side of a barn (.205 in July with a 50% strikeout rate and just 3xbh), Arraez is injured and Kirilloff is out for the year. Now, of course, nobody could have foreseen that and it's not the FO's fault that these guys are injured/unprepared. But their underperformance is something we have to be honest about and accept.

Now I can see why the front office traded Wade at the time - I'm not second-guessing. But to pretend the Twins couldn't use a guy batting .270 with 12 HRs and a good eye? That doesn't ring true to me.

Put it this way: if the Twins could undo what they did and put the guy back on the roster, they would, and he'd be starting in the OF tonight.

 

Kepler is hitting better than the average MLB hitter this year, when you factor in power and walks and hits.......I don't think people realize how far BAs have dropped this year.....Like, you really need to look at more than BA. 

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1 hour ago, Mike Sixel said:

I'll add that they need like 20 pitchers in a season....and in MOST only 2 backup OFers (who you don't want to play much anyway). MOST of the time, a team should protect more pitchers and let what appears to be an excess OFer go.

Can't argue your points, IMO anybody that was watching the Twins minor league system seen, Baddoo, Wade, Kirilloff, and Laranch (with Cave, Rosario and Kepler in the bigs), that is 7 left handed outfielders coming to a point in the road. It seems like the FO could have been a bit more proactive in clearing up that log by packaging a couple of them up a few years ago to help in other areas. I get the reason they choose Cave, he was more of a sure thing while waiting for AK and Laranch on a team competing. I am not disappointed they traded Wade, just the timing of it.

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11 minutes ago, TwinsDr2021 said:

Can't argue your points, IMO anybody that was watching the Twins minor league system seen, Baddoo, Wade, Kirilloff, and Laranch (with Cave, Rosario and Kepler in the bigs), that is 7 left handed outfielders coming to a point in the road. It seems like the FO could have been a bit more proactive in clearing up that log by packaging a couple of them up a few years ago to help in other areas. I get the reason they choose Cave, he was more of a sure thing while waiting for AK and Laranch on a team competing. I am not disappointed they traded Wade, just the timing of it.

Good points! If teams traded prospect for prospect more, I think we'd have seen something happen.

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11 minutes ago, bighat said:

I hear you and agree with your take. Except for the highlighted part above: Kepler's batting .215, Larnach can't hit the broad side of a barn (.205 in July with a 50% strikeout rate and just 3xbh), Arraez is injured and Kirilloff is out for the year. Now, of course, nobody could have foreseen that and it's not the FO's fault that these guys are injured/unprepared. But their underperformance is something we have to be honest about and accept.

Now I can see why the front office traded Wade at the time - I'm not second-guessing. But to pretend the Twins couldn't use a guy batting .270 with 12 HRs and a good eye? That doesn't ring true to me.

Put it this way: if the Twins could undo what they did and put the guy back on the roster, they would, and he'd be starting in the OF tonight.

FWIW, we're facing a LH starter, so maybe not tonight. :)

Obviously, with hindsight the front office would 100% undo this trade. I certainly didn't mean to imply otherwise!

I was just responding to the OP who focused on Wade's performance, and I just meant that if our trade return still held any hope of contributing someday, I don't think we'd be complaining much about the deal right now. Wade was too far down the depth chart to make a big impact on our 2021 season, and I don't know that his hot streak thus far would have changed our long-term outlook either -- we'd probably still be talking about how to flip him for a reliever next offseason, rather than disrupting our future depth chart.

But the reliever we got for him last offseason was so bad, and so swiftly shown the door, that it puts the disappointment -- and the FO/coaching culpability -- into stark relief.

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2 hours ago, Brock Beauchamp said:

Literally all they've done in the past 12 months is miss and it's usually not only a miss but a spectacular miss. That inspires no confidence in their future decisions.

They've even managed to turn hits into misses. Waiver acquisition Matt Wisler giving them a magical unicorn season, and them saying "nah, he's not that good" and releasing him, stands out for me - I think we could have found a use for a guy with an OPS-against of .706 in 2021 even if he isn't magical this time around.

The evaluation process is looking pretty iffy to me.

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It is tough to be too hard on the Twins for making the move, but as Brock notes, this front office appears to be virtually inept right now. Can't be happier for him personally, but Wade's breakout is very, very tough to accept when he would have been such a huge asset putting those numbers up for the Twins this year.

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8 hours ago, Brock Beauchamp said:

For anyone who wants a glance at his soul-crushing numbers with the Giants this season...

Standard Batting
Year Age Tm Lg G PA AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI SB CS BB SO BA OBP SLG OPS OPS+ TB GDP HBP SH SF IBB Pos Awards
3 Yrs 91 284 243 38 59 12 3 14 33 4 2 32 55 .243 .344 .490 .834 124 119 2 6 2 1 0    
162 Game Avg. 162 506 433 68 105 21 5 25 59 7 4 57 98 .243 .344 .490 .834 124 212 4 11 4 2 0    
                                                     
MIN (2 yrs) 42 113 95 13 20 5 1 2 6 1 2 15 18 .211 .336 .347 .684 87 33 0 3 0 0 0    
SFG (1 yr) 49 171 148 25 39 7 2 12 27 3 0 17 37 .264 .349 .581 .930 148 86 2 3 2 1 0    
                                                     
AL (2 yrs) 42 113 95 13 20 5 1 2 6 1 2 15 18 .211 .336 .347 .684 87 33 0 3 0 0 0    
NL (1 yr) 49 171 148 25 39 7 2 12 27 3 0 17 37 .264 .349 .581 .930 148 86 2 3 2 1 0    
2021 27 SFG NL 49 171 148 25 39 7 2 12 27 3 0 17 37 .264 .349 .581 .930 148 86 2 3 2 1 0 37H/98  
Provided by Baseball-Reference.com: View Original Table
Generated 7/27/2021.

I both like and hate this post.

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33 minutes ago, Otto von Ballpark said:

FWIW, we're facing a LH starter, so maybe not tonight. :)

Obviously, with hindsight the front office would 100% undo this trade. I certainly didn't mean to imply otherwise!

I was just responding to the OP who focused on Wade's performance, and I just meant that if our trade return still held any hope of contributing someday, I don't think we'd be complaining much about the deal right now. Wade was too far down the depth chart to make a big impact on our 2021 season, and I don't know that his hot streak thus far would have changed our long-term outlook either -- we'd probably still be talking about how to flip him for a reliever next offseason, rather than disrupting our future depth chart.

But the reliever we got for him last offseason was so bad, and so swiftly shown the door, that it puts the disappointment -- and the FO/coaching culpability -- into stark relief.

You betcha, I agree with all of that. Good points!

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Look, this sucks for the Twins and is great for the Giants (Wade has always seemed like a great dude, so good for him).

but could someone tell me where in Wade's history anyone saw this kind of slugging coming? In his limited time in the majors with the twins he showed a discerning eye at the plate and no power to speak of. In his whole minor league career his SLG % was .409. outside of rookie ball and a short stint in A+, he's never hit for power. Literally never. His value at the plate before this season was primarily tied to his ability to get on base (decent average plus plenty of walks). If his SLG% this year was around his career average we'd be saying "Hey, good luck LaMonte but you're who we thought you were".

The retro-grade on the trade right now sucks, but I don't recall a single person saying LaMonte Wade was going to turn into a power hitter. The organization kept Cave over Wade because they saw them as being pretty comparable value overall as hitter but were more comfortable with Cave in CF. (Seeing as how SF has only had Wade out in CF twice this season, I suspect they don't see him as anything other than an emergency option out there too.) And literally out of nowhere Wade is slugging .581. If he slugs .415 does anyone care?

there's also zero question that Cave was better than Wade in 2019. 2020 was a down year for Cave, but Wade didn't show a lot in his limited chances with the Twins either. So betting that the guy with 2 years as a quality 4th OF would bounce back after a weird pandemic year was a pretty reasonable bet at the time. If the twins had said "We're keeping Wade over Cave because we think he's about to have a big power explosion" everyone here would have laughed at them. everyone.

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