So when do Mauer's prime years start?Quote:
Originally Posted by mike wants wins
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So when do Mauer's prime years start?Quote:
Originally Posted by mike wants wins
While they're at it they should make a push for Hamilton too. I love the idea and I think he has great stuff but nothing in the Twins DNA would suggest they will even pay 5 million for a free agent pitcher this off season. This team wouldn't even get Cliff Lee for a couple prospects when they had a team that was very good in 2010. Afterall, where would they be without Aaron Hicks? This orginazation makes money 1st, and if they have a good team that just a bonus. You've been hoodwinked if you believe otherwise.
1. I guess I don't agree that signing Grienke represents "going all in." The Twins can spend more money than they're currently spending, and Grienke costs nothing but money. He doesn't cost you prospects going away for a half season rent-a-player, nor stripping of the farm to acquire MLB players in the offseason.Quote:
Originally Posted by one_eyed_jack
2. It might not work out, but spending money is one way to acquire talent. It can't be the only way, but shying away from difference makers who cost nothing but money isn't good strategy either.
3. You don't upgrade the horrendous pitching by adding more horrendous, but cheap, pitchers.
4. Not exactly sure what "compete for the division" means, but if the goal is to have an outside chance of finishing closer to first than last in the ALC, then yeah, there's no need to sign front line pitchers. If the goals are higher, you need players capable of achieveing that.
I'm not sure Grienke is really what might be called an "ace," but he's a front line pitcher, and the Twins are going to need front line pitching at some point no matter what happens with any other part of the team.
Quote:
Originally Posted by USAFChief
1) The phrase "go all in" was the article author's not mine. And I took it to mean that the Twins spend whatever it takes to get him. I'm not opposed to having Greinke on the Twins, but I am opposed to spending what it will take to get him on one guy.
2) I said I'm in favor of spending money, just not all in 1 place.
3) Who said anything about signing horrendous pitchers? It's not like all pitchers who aren't Greinke are just other versions of Marquis. There's some middle ground there.
4) By compete for the division, I mean be able to hang in the race most of the year with a reasonable chance to win it. If the Twins had gotten mediocre as opposed to horrendous starting pitching and a bit more offense this year they'd be right there. I figure we'd have 6 or 7 more wins had we gotten halfway decent starting pitching and a couple of more clutch hits. That would have put us right in the mix in what is a very weak division. No, it wouldn't make us a legit World Series contender, but we'd at least be playing meaningful baseball in August, possibly later. And that would make it a more attractive destination for free agent like Greinke.
Why would any significant free agent sign with the Twins? I can't see any reason why a player would sign with a team that has so many needs and so little hope for 2013. They have to rebuild the hard way.
The only way the Twins will sign anyone is to overpay so significantly that it couldn't be anything but a bad contract in the long run.
We see comments like this all the time.
Recently... Why didn't the Twins take the money they spent on Capps, Marquis and Zumaya and spend it on Edwin Jackson (who signed an 11 million dollar contract with Washington)?
How can anyone assume that was ever a choice? Given the two options, Jackson would choose Washington every time. Why choose a Twins team coming off a horrible season and a historically bad infield defense? Jackson not only needed to consider this year, but contracts in the future. They would have had to pay much more than Washington to get him.
Signing significant free agents will not be an option for bottom feeders like the Twins. They have to dig their way out with smart player development.
Like being hoodwinked by rumors and assuming that the Twins could have had Cliff Lee for a couple of prospects? Or being hoodwinked by one's own twisted logic that winning and profit are unrelated?Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack Torse
Umm...cuz of addition and the fact that either Edwin Jackson, his agent, or both are capable of it?Quote:
Originally Posted by jorgenswest
I've always thought Paul Maholm would be a perfect fit for the Twins and I would be a little surprised if his option was picked up. His 5.5 K/9 and 1.416 career WHIP are really unattractive though.
Looking at fangraphs for Scott Diamond, I see that you are correct. I was just going off memory and was underestimating Diamond. I thought he was older. This does make me feel a little better about him (and the Twins managment for trading Billy Bullock to keep him...which I didn't like).Quote:
Originally Posted by snepp
The point still goes that the best way to get starting pitching without costing you an arm and a leg is to trade Span for AA arms that might become 2/3 starters. I don't think you can get an ace for him, but obviously that would be nice, too. Do you guys have any thoughts on who they could get for Span?
There is/are (more than?) one thread devoted entirely to this topic. Not too far back if you go to the Forum category and then Twins Talk, you should be able to find lots o' opinions on that.Quote:
Originally Posted by bdhenders
Most recent comp is the trade of Michael Bourn last year. The Braves did not have to trade any of their pitching prospects to get him. They sent Jordan Shafer, Brett Oberholtzer, Paul Clemens and Juan Abreau to Houston.
Span currently ranks 12th in WAR among centerfielders and could help some teams. However, I don't know if they should expect any more than the Astros received for Bourn who has been a better player over the last two years.
Look at the trades over the last few summers. I don't see many #2-3 pitching prospects changing hands. Last year they were included in trades for Ubaldo Jimenez, Hunter Pence and Carlos Beltran.
Fortunately the Twins are in a good position with Span. Worst case, they keep him unless someone comes in a blows them away.
That sounds an awful lot like the scenario I proposed to you on another thread...:rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by one_eyed_jack
I think it's obvious now, even to Twins managment, that long-term contracts are not the way to go. As much as Greinke would fit into Gardenhire's perfect player profile in the locker room (Greinke has been diagnosed with SAD- Social Anxiety Disorder), it would be a foolish move to put even more money at risk on a long-term basis. My proposal for signing some combination of 1st, 2nd & 3rd tier proven starting arms for short-term deals is the way to go until the farm system/draft delivers on some combination of Waldrip/Gibson/Wimmers/(Appel or Gausman) and/or a key (#3-5) starter/pitching prospect(s) acquired by trade for Span/Willingham/Doumit/etc.
If I were GM, I wouldn't go beyond 3 years on FA contracts except under unique and momentous conditions. I believe the chances of seriously courting Greinke are quite remote, and I don't think it would be money well spent. I'd rather they go after 2 #2s or 3 #3s at SP next year. We are not one ace away from competing and succeeding the playoffs.
Career ERA of my potential 2013 Pick-ups (all for 2 or 3 year contracts) I like to see 2 or 3 signed -- I know, it's just a wish, reasonable though I think.
All the following are definite FA, without a club option remaining for 2013
Brandon McCarthy 4.06
Joe Blanton 4.30
Jeremy Guthrie 4.24
Colby Lewis Last 2 years: 3.70, 4.42 and so far this year 3.30
Anibal Sanchez 3.61
Joe Saunders 4.13
Guys that would be nice but probably out of reach: Shaun Marcum and Cole Hammels