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Article: Twins Roster Projection 2.0

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#1 Seth Stohs

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Posted 07 March 2014 - 08:15 AM

You can view the page at http://www.twinsdail...-Projection-2-0

#2 jokin

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Posted 07 March 2014 - 09:02 AM

The Santana option was my very first thought when Florimon's appendectomy was made public- it's a potential nice opportunity for both Danny and the Twins. And it doesn't have to be for the full 15 days. Have your heard anything Seth, about the possbility that the Twins might place Florimon on the DL sooner than March 31, to enable an earilier regular season debut?

#3 John Bonnes

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Posted 07 March 2014 - 09:05 AM

Couple of thoughts as I leave. I think Diamond over Worley if it's close. We'll see how Worley does today. I think they trust Diamond more.

After Wed nights crapstorm, Gardy was really impressed with Tonkin. Something like "he threw the living expletive out of that ball."

#4 jokin

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Posted 07 March 2014 - 09:08 AM

Couple of thoughts as I leave. I think Diamond over Worley if it's close. We'll see how Worley does today. I think they trust Diamond more.

After Wed nights crapstorm, Gardy was really impressed with Tonkin. Something like "he threw the living expletive out of that ball."


Do you mean he's replaced the now-cliched "fire" adjective with something more colorful? New attitude, indeed!

#5 John Bonnes

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Posted 07 March 2014 - 09:12 AM

Also, no way on Santana. No way. Gardy likes what he's seen and apparently volunteered that early. But the reason you've heard so much about him was just a natural progression-
1. Gardy mentioned him to Mike.
2. Mike wrote a story on him so asked people about him
3. just as the story was being run, Santana had a good game in late innings and demonstrated his speed, which led to more talk.

They like him. He might be Gardy's new Brian Dozierlike jones. But I don't see anyway they mess with him by promoting him no matter if Florimon is out or no.

I also believe you'll see Florimon in games soon and starting the season with the Twins, so I think it's a moot point.

#6 jokin

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Posted 07 March 2014 - 09:13 AM

Couple of thoughts as I leave. I think Diamond over Worley if it's close. We'll see how Worley does today. I think they trust Diamond more.


John, do you have any impressions or feelings that the 2 "losers" in the SP battle take the RP spots from T-Bar and Pressly, get traded or DFA'd, or go on the DL?

#7 mike wants wins

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Posted 07 March 2014 - 09:17 AM

so, 90+ losses three years in a row, and only 1 young player is added to the roster, and several that came up last year aren't on the roster? If Hicks and Arcia go down, and Gibson isn't up, that leaves Escobar as the only player to come up from the minors in the last two years. Pretty sad. They need to COMMIT to the rebuild. I really cannot understand how Kubel could be on this roster, and not Arcia. As the Gibson and Collabelo comments John reported show, these guys need to keep getting their feet wet.

#8 Rick Niedermann

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Posted 07 March 2014 - 09:17 AM

Does Florimon have options? Why isn't Escobar being considered for the everyday shortstop job? He seems to have a better bat. And we need every bit of offense we can get.

#9 Jim Crikket

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Posted 07 March 2014 - 09:24 AM

so, 90+ losses three years in a row, and only 1 young player is added to the roster, and several that came up last year aren't on the roster? If Hicks and Arcia go down, and Gibson isn't up, that leaves Escobar as the only player to come up from the minors in the last two years. Pretty sad. They need to COMMIT to the rebuild. I really cannot understand how Kubel could be on this roster, and not Arcia. As the Gibson and Collabelo comments John reported show, these guys need to keep getting their feet wet.


I don't necessarily disagree, mike, but maybe I'm just feeling more patient. I'm a lot less concerned with what the roster looks like in April than I am with what it looks like in June, July and on. Regardless of where some of those young players start the season, I can't imagine a scenario where we don't see a lot of them for four months or so of the season. I'm OK with that. I just don't want to see them all sitting in Rochester all summer long while the "veterans" rack up 95 losses again.
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#10 jokin

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Posted 07 March 2014 - 09:33 AM

so, 90+ losses three years in a row, and only 1 young player is added to the roster, and several that came up last year aren't on the roster? If Hicks and Arcia go down, and Gibson isn't up, that leaves Escobar as the only player to come up from the minors in the last two years. Pretty sad. They need to COMMIT to the rebuild. I really cannot understand how Kubel could be on this roster, and not Arcia. As the Gibson and Collabelo comments John reported show, these guys need to keep getting their feet wet.


Let's be fair, you forgot that "young" player they added most recently to the 40-man, Mike, 25 year old Brooks Raley- he's only a phone call away. The Twins Way has apparently become using up all of your AAAA players and value-less veterans until you can't squeeze one more dime out of their salaries, they even turned one of them into a $500, 000 dividend check in Albers and got a down-on-his-luck, end-of-the-line former 1st round SP by trade, and outrighted some of the dead weight- and they still didn't make room for one of the youngsters. Mind-boggling.

It looks like there's one more year of pretender-"squeezing" over prospect-developing.

#11 jmlease1

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Posted 07 March 2014 - 09:33 AM

I hate the idea that Pinto won't be coming north with the team. I see zero upside for Fryer/Herrmann and a real need to develop Pinto.

I agree with the status on the OF. But I'm really hoping Hicks makes the squad and starts in CF. Need his defense, and I think he'll adjust as a hitter, given the time.

#12 mike wants wins

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Posted 07 March 2014 - 09:34 AM

that's totally reasonable, Jim. I don't share your optimism that they will bench the vets. They didn't last year for Gibson, until too late imo, even though he was clearly better than all but 2 of the awful players they trotted out (maybe 3).

Half a year or more would be good. Less than that, like useless September callups when teams are filled with AAAA fodder, that does not interest me much.

Three awful years is really testing my patience. Good luck selling tickets to see awful veterans the first half of the year......losing a year of Sano is a huge blow. They really needed him to get his feet wet this year.
Lighten up Francis....

#13 jokin

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Posted 07 March 2014 - 09:35 AM

Does Florimon have options? Why isn't Escobar being considered for the everyday shortstop job? He seems to have a better bat. And we need every bit of offense we can get.


Florimon does have options left, but Gardy has already designated him the opening day SS.

#14 DAM DC Twins Fans

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Posted 07 March 2014 - 09:41 AM

so, 90+ losses three years in a row, and only 1 young player is added to the roster, and several that came up last year aren't on the roster? If Hicks and Arcia go down, and Gibson isn't up, that leaves Escobar as the only player to come up from the minors in the last two years. Pretty sad. They need to COMMIT to the rebuild. I really cannot understand how Kubel could be on this roster, and not Arcia. As the Gibson and Collabelo comments John reported show, these guys need to keep getting their feet wet.


I agree. Arcia needs to be in the Twins roster and not sitting. Hicks, Gibson and potentially Meyer could go down and earn their promotion. If we are building towards a contending team in 2015 or 2016, guys need to be getting their feet wet. Guys like Parmalee and Plouffe need to show they are part of that team. Bartlett, Kubel and Willingham are just filler and if they don't show anything in Ft. Myers dump them.

#15 UCLA_YANKEE_COLA

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Posted 07 March 2014 - 09:45 AM

I'm with mike, I don't share the optimism either. I don't see any reason at all to not have Gibson, Pinto, Hicks, Arcia & Parmalee in the lineup everyday from opening day. Give them quality games against major league hitters and pitchers. Everything they do should be focused entirely on having these guys, and the next wave of youth, ready to win in 2015 and beyond. Starting Suzuki, Presley and Diamond, even if they were any good, doesn't do that.

#16 John Bonnes

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Posted 07 March 2014 - 09:47 AM

John, do you have any impressions or feelings that the 2 "losers" in the SP battle take the RP spots from T-Bar and Pressly, get traded or DFA'd, or go on the DL?


Really hard to say. They'll certainly try to keep them. That could be bad news, at least in the short term, for Tonkin & Thielbar. I wouldn't be shocked if they lose one of Worley, Diamond & Deduno. I will be shocked if they lose two.

#17 John Bonnes

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Posted 07 March 2014 - 09:50 AM

It's certainly not crazy to think that Arcia, Pinto, Hicks & Gibson could continue to develop in AAA for at least a few months.

#18 Yoshii

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Posted 07 March 2014 - 10:00 AM

I just still don't know how this team is going to score runs. That's a terribly weak infield with Mauer being the only one who can do anything. How can you predict Dozier will have a year like he did before? Very low low power in the infield:/ I would like to ditch Plouffe and Florimon. And just because a player is out of options doesn't mean we HAVE to stick with them. Get rid of some of this dead weight (especially with our catcher options) I completely agree with thoughts about keeping Pinto up here and developing him...I only feel happy about our bullpen at this point.

Edited by Yoshii, 07 March 2014 - 10:04 AM.


#19 halfchest

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Posted 07 March 2014 - 10:10 AM

Couple of thoughts as I leave. I think Diamond over Worley if it's close. We'll see how Worley does today. I think they trust Diamond more.
"


Really? Is that what the Twins think or what you think? I can see the Twins maybe trusting Diamond more but if they both have good springs, Worley has the better track record overall and I hope they go with him. However that leaves us with five righties I suppose.

#20 YourHouseIsMyHouse

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Posted 07 March 2014 - 10:21 AM

It's certainly not crazy to think that Arcia, Pinto, Hicks & Gibson could continue to develop in AAA for at least a few months.


Arcia has had two AAA stints already, Gibson has been in AAA forever, and Pinto was destructive in the IL and performed much better than Fryer did there. A bottom of the barrel catcher like Suzuki shouldn't block a 24 year old with some all around potential. With Hicks, I can see why, but I feel like as old as he is that he should have his 2nd go soon. I wasn't largely in favor of sending him down to begin with and let's not forget that a lot of poor umpiring gave him a much bigger strike zone than he was used to.

#21 mike wants wins

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Posted 07 March 2014 - 10:35 AM

Sure John. They can all sit in the minors for months. You really think they'll cut/trade 4-5 veterans in the middle of the year, and bring up youth? Does any team turn over that much of their roster in a month? You can't look at this in a vaccuum. Do you really want everyone really coming up next year (a few months this year makes this year not really this year), or do you want some guys up this year, and some next year, and some the year after that?

It also isn't crazy that they could come up here and develop, and that they wouldn't benefit from being really tested, and getting experience playing in big stadiums.
Lighten up Francis....

#22 scottz

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Posted 07 March 2014 - 11:15 AM

It's certainly not crazy to think that Arcia, Pinto, Hicks & Gibson could continue to develop in AAA for at least a few months.


I don't think it's a matter of being crazy. There are certainly reasons that each of them could have more time in AAA. But what is really blocking them? For example, how is age 32 and slipping badly Jason Kubel a better option than age 23 and growing Oswaldo Arcia? If it is because Arcia struck out 31% of the time last year, well, so did Kubel. Give me the youngster. Give me Pinto at least half time instead of Fryer a quarter of the time. There will be some growing pains, but if we don't have the kids on the roster it isn't like the pain will go away. It will just be aging pain instead of growing pain.

My roster:
OF - Willingham, Hicks, Arcia, Parmelee, Presley
IF - Plouffe, Florimon, Dozier, Mauer, Escobar
C - Suzuki, Pinto
Bench - right handed bat. i don't really care who this is, as along as they are willing to step in and swing hard at a moment's notice. maybe 1 game a week they are in the line up.
SP - Nolasco, Hughes, Correia, Pelfrey, Worley
BP - Perkins, Burton, Duensing, Fien, Swarzak, Thielbar, Deduno (Long Relief)

Goodbye to Diamond. Gibson to AAA because of the FA signings and the mess of out of option players. Hopefully he's throwing well when someone gets a blister or achey shoulder.

#23 Dman

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Posted 07 March 2014 - 11:25 AM

It is always a tough to figure out what the FO is thinking. Do they want to try and build trade value with bounce back years from veterans? Are they concerned about service time for younger players? When service time is used up do you want to give players away for nothing? If players have struggled at the MLB level do you give them more time in the minor's? There are a lot of moving parts to any decision you make.

Like most I am itching to see what the young guys can do and would like to see the clog of pitchers cleared up so that we have a chance to check out Gibson and Meyer at the MLB level. At the same time I am concerned about getting nothing for the players that are out of options and worry that they might perform reasonably well for another team. Several of them have done well for periods of time just not consistently. So I waffle back and forth on the best course of action. I really hope the Twins get the younger guys some playing time by June especially if we are going to lose 90 games again anyway. At some point the talent from below has to push out the players that are not performing well. You can't keep them all.

#24 Jim Crikket

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Posted 07 March 2014 - 11:35 AM

It may not be what many people want to hear, but I don't think the Twins are the only organization that would look to start the season with what they believe is the roster that gives them the best chance to win in 2014. Then, if/when reality smacks them in the face (which could easily happen within a couple of months), they trade or release veterans in spots where they have legitimate prospects ready to step in.

You can make a case that a guy like Gibson should have had more MLB opportunities last year but, by and large, I'm inclined to think the Twins have stuck with marginal veterans recently because they really haven't had much for legitimate prospects at the highest minor league levels. That's changing. Sure, the "options remaining" thing will play a factor. It does in every decision with every team. I just don't think the Twins will hand a spot to Kubel over Arcia unless Kubel clearly demonstrates he can perform at a MLB level. A few years ago, they brought Jacque Jones in to camp on a MiLB deal, too, and they didn't give him a big league roster spot just because he used to be good. In fact, perhaps the biggest mistake the Twins have made in recent years in terms of Opening Day roster spots was arguably taking a prospect, Hicks, north last year.

We're just a week in to ST games. Seems too early, to me, to be too worked up over what decisions may or may not be made at the end of the month.
[COLOR=#0000cd]I opine about the Twins and Kernels regularly at[/COLOR][COLOR=#800000] Knuckleballsblog.com[/COLOR][COLOR=#0000cd] while my alter ego, SD Buhr covers the Kernels for [/COLOR][COLOR=#0000cd][COLOR=#800000]MetroSportsReport.com[/COLOR][/COLOR][COLOR=#0000cd].[/COLOR] [COLOR=#0000cd]
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#25 MichiganTwins

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Posted 07 March 2014 - 12:08 PM

Also, no way on Santana. No way. Gardy likes what he's seen and apparently volunteered that early. But the reason you've heard so much about him was just a natural progression-
1. Gardy mentioned him to Mike.
2. Mike wrote a story on him so asked people about him
3. just as the story was being run, Santana had a good game in late innings and demonstrated his speed, which led to more talk.

They like him. He might be Gardy's new Brian Dozierlike jones. But I don't see anyway they mess with him by promoting him no matter if Florimon is out or no.

I also believe you'll see Florimon in games soon and starting the season with the Twins, so I think it's a moot point.


If you are trying to get a job in the Twins FO, you are doing a great Bill Smith impression. I think there is a way for Santana to get a look early in the season until FLorimon is ready. It might be a long shot, but it is possible.

#26 S.

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Posted 07 March 2014 - 12:24 PM

These projected rosters make me queasy. Someone remind me again why I'm supposed to bother watching any games if Arcia, Pinto, Gibson start in AAA, or do they figure no one is going to watch this trash until Meyer gets called up anyways? I've easily watched 120+ games each of the last 3 seasons, but if we're not going to see any of the young guys for a few months, I'm probably better off flipping on MLB.tv and watching some good baseball games instead of the Twins.

#27 CRArko

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Posted 07 March 2014 - 12:33 PM

These projected rosters make me queasy. Someone remind me again why I'm supposed to bother watching any games if Arcia, Pinto, Gibson start in AAA, or do they figure no one is going to watch this trash until Meyer gets called up anyways? I've easily watched 120+ games each of the last 3 seasons, but if we're not going to see any of the young guys for a few months, I'm probably better off flipping on MLB.tv and watching some good baseball games instead of the Twins.


There's a lot of good books out there, too. :)

#28 JB_Iowa

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Posted 07 March 2014 - 12:45 PM

Yeah, just sitting back trying to recapture
a little of the glory of, well time slips away
and leaves you with nothing mister but
boring stories of glory days





#29 howieramone1406390264

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Posted 07 March 2014 - 12:54 PM

Yeah, just sitting back trying to recapture
a little of the glory of, well time slips away
and leaves you with nothing mister but
boring stories of glory days






The past is never over........it's not even really the past.


---
anonymous

Edited by howieramone, 07 March 2014 - 12:59 PM.


#30 adjacent

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Posted 07 March 2014 - 12:58 PM

Couple of thoughts as I leave. I think Diamond over Worley if it's close. We'll see how Worley does today. I think they trust Diamond more.

"

Well, if they didn't, they will after today.