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Attendance, Season Tickets: St. Peter (via Berardino)

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#1 JB_Iowa

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Posted 25 January 2014 - 09:21 AM

I found the following article interesting: http://www.twincitie...home-attendance

Apparently even the prospect of All Star game tickets couldn't stop the bleeding with the season-ticket base:

A full season-ticket equivalent base that has dropped steadily from 25,000 in 2010 to last year's 19,000 is only projected to reach 17,000 by Opening Day, St. Peter said.

....

"To get back to 19, let me just say this, it would take a pennant race in September in order for us to get there," St. Peter said. "If we're having a good season, it's feasible you could add a couple thousand FSEs during the course of the season. That's possible. But if you're not in contention, that's going to be tough."



I hope the players they've signed will help the Twins stay below the 90 loss level but does anyone think they've done enough to truly make them contenders?

#2 twinsnorth49

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Posted 25 January 2014 - 09:26 AM

Nope

#3 minn55441

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Posted 25 January 2014 - 10:40 AM

Opening day tickets went on sale yesterday at 4:00pm. One day later and there are still plenty of tickets left in a variety of good sections of the field.

#4 minn55441

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Posted 25 January 2014 - 10:49 AM

"To get back to 19, let me just say this, it would take a pennant race in September in order for us to get there," St.
Peter said. "If we're having a good season, it's feasible you could add a couple thousand FSEs during the course of the season. That's possible. But if you're not in contention, that's going to be tough."

With the boost they received from the All start game, the true level of interest in the Twins could actually be, as viewed in FSE terms to be in the 14,000 to 15,000 range. I would guess that a .500 season in 2014 would bring us to that level if not lower. They have been doing a lot of advertising for Twinsfest and with the limited number of tickets available because of the space constraints of Target Field, it is a telling sign that you can still get in on Sunday. I have heard that Saturday is sold out.

#5 70charger

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Posted 26 January 2014 - 09:39 PM

Opening day tickets went on sale yesterday at 4:00pm. One day later and there are still plenty of tickets left in a variety of good sections of the field.


I think a lot of this may have to do with the fact that it is one of the worst winters on record, and that many fans remember the frigid conditions of last year's game.

I was one of the people who bought face value opening day tickets last year only to run into a friend who got tickets in the fancy padded seats behind home plate from a scalper for $20 each. Less than I paid for a much more plebian section.

Guess who isn't buying face value tickets this year?

#6 TheLeviathan

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Posted 26 January 2014 - 10:01 PM

Guess who isn't buying face value tickets this year?


That's exactly it, many of us who were former season ticket holders or people that would buy directly from the Twins have long wised up.

I think minn's point is really spot-on. I imagine a significant portion of the 17000 that are signed up are there for only one more year for their all-star seats. Getting back to 19,000 might require a heckuva lot more than St. Peter realizes by this time in 2015.

#7 Winston Smith

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Posted 26 January 2014 - 10:18 PM

Spend more money, put a better product on the field and people will buy tickets!

May all our prospects be All Stars and the beer be free.


#8 jokin

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Posted 26 January 2014 - 10:25 PM

Spend more money, put a better product on the field and people will buy tickets!


If only the Twins had hired a "Plan B" consultant with just such advice way back in 2010.

#9 Old Twins Cap

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Posted 26 January 2014 - 10:26 PM

I hope season ticket sales continue to fail. Their product is terrible. I mean, c'mon, look at who they send out to the mound as a starting rotation. I'm a lifelong fan, but they've lost all credibility as a professional baseball club. Someone needs to hold them accountable for their product.

I used to own season tickets but I won't go back. The thing that really gets me is that their organization blithely rehires Gardenhire after three 90 loss seasons. They don't play with passion, they aren't prepared to start games, and they don't have a plan to beat teams. They are feckless, disinterested and frankly, boring. But for management, that's good enough. Bring back Gardy. Well, let's see what the number is that gets us a new manager. Wake up and smell the coffee boys, the ship has been sinking for years.

#10 mikecgrimes

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Posted 26 January 2014 - 10:52 PM

I think a lot of this may have to do with the fact that it is one of the worst winters on record, and that many fans remember the frigid conditions of last year's game.

I was one of the people who bought face value opening day tickets last year only to run into a friend who got tickets in the fancy padded seats behind home plate from a scalper for $20 each. Less than I paid for a much more plebian section.

Guess who isn't buying face value tickets this year?

As the season ticket holder base decreases the secondary market dries up. Only way those tricks work this year is if it's a horrible product on the field.

#11 minn55441

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Posted 26 January 2014 - 11:00 PM

The problem is we are baseball fans. It doesn't matter how bad they are, I will watch. I will go to the games. It's actually cheaper to attend games now that they stink. Once the new crop of young players arrive and they attain some level of success, it will be harder to get cheap tickets.

To be honest, I would rather they win and make it hard to get good tickets.

#12 JB_Iowa

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Posted 27 January 2014 - 08:41 AM

When TF opened, there was endless talk about the "TF experience" .... much more than about the baseball. As though this were merely an entertainment option and the product didn't matter. It was all about marketing.

I hope that they have now come to the realization that the "experience" revolves around what happens on the field. If what happens there isn't good, the big screens, bars, soial media nights, etc. etc. don't matter either.

#13 ND-Fan

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Posted 27 January 2014 - 09:12 AM

I think what they have done so far is team has improved to 72 to 76 win total as they stand now with the projected personal. I still think they are going add a piece or two yet before season starts. The thing that could propel them to nearly contending would be if say Hicks, Arcia, and Sano all join team and put up numbers like they have in minors. With this pitching staff and say Gibson or Myer also contribute later in season they could move to 500 hundred team. If they do that prospect of adding couple more of their prospects next season people will start to get excited and it may be possible to reach 19000 tickets. This best case scenario but they could flounder to also 72 and 90 season not real fan builder for season tickets.

#14 diehardtwinsfan

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Posted 27 January 2014 - 10:12 AM

I think the season ticket base will drop next year. That's the downside to a rebuild, and I'd think management would understand that... of interest though, that might be a good time to buy them. 2015 should be seeing Buxton, Sano, Meyer, and Rosario all up for good by then and guys like Arcia, Pinto, and Hicks really starting to blossom as players. I'd half expect them to be in the thick of things Sept 2015.

#15 minn55441

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Posted 27 January 2014 - 10:43 AM

I agree. In 2010, many people attended the games just for the sheer event of it. they weren't there not necessarily to see the Twins play, but instead to experience outdoor baseball and the latest Twin cities attraction.

It was frustrating at times. It's like going to see a movie and over half the people there really aren't paying attention to what is going on. Talking during key moments and walking in and out, disturbing those that are there to watch.

The last couple of years, have really attracted only the people truly interested in watching the game. We won't see the 2010 crowds of going just to be seen at the latest hot spot, but a winning team on the field will bring back the casual fan. With many tickets still available for opening day, I wonder how many sellouts there will be in 2014.

#16 thetank

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Posted 27 January 2014 - 11:03 AM

I think the season ticket base will drop next year. That's the downside to a rebuild, and I'd think management would understand that... of interest though, that might be a good time to buy them. 2015 should be seeing Buxton, Sano, Meyer, and Rosario all up for good by then and guys like Arcia, Pinto, and Hicks really starting to blossom as players. I'd half expect them to be in the thick of things Sept 2015.


If they fall below 2 million in attendance this would be a bad sign. The FA signings and the rookies need to work out. Someone said that for every 100,000 fans brings in $5 million.

#17 Hosken Bombo Disco

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Posted 27 January 2014 - 12:02 PM

I agree this is a good time to get back on board.

But this is not technically a rebuild season. Terry Ryan's own comments from last summer he said "the Twins are not shooting for respectability, we are shooting for the postseason" or words to that effect. I would personally be satisfied with .500 this year but the urgency to sign free agents this offseason tends to back up TR's statement over my own opinion.

#18 eLee612

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Posted 27 January 2014 - 06:46 PM

I guess now is not the time to ask if anyone is interested in sharing season tickets in 3?* Parker, you can make the Pizza face a 40-game occurrence in 2014!

Minn55441 said it right - I / you / 'we' will be there regardless. I might be scalping more than splurging, but I'll be there.

But riddle me this… the Cubs, also 66 and 96 this year, have a season ticket waiting list. They've had one for a long, long time. They've had loosing records consistently for many more years than the Twins (no WS in 105 years), but even comparing just W/L record averages from 2000 to 2013:

Twins: .547
Cubs: .513

I get that Cubs fans are loyal until death do they part. I don't exactly want to be known as the team that always looses but has damn devoted fans anyways. But when the going gets tough, the indifference of the majority of most Minnesotans [TwinsDaily is of course not a representative sample :o] is disheartening.

*True story, if anyone is interested please let me know asap!

Edited by eLee612, 27 January 2014 - 06:52 PM.

Nadie dijo que la vida sería fácil, sólo dijeron que valdría la pena.

#19 minn55441

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Posted 27 January 2014 - 08:02 PM

Cubs fans haven't always been that loyal. I lived in Illinois in the mid 90's and many times walked up to the ticket window to get tickets at Wrigley an hour before the game. In those days they did not consistently sell out. Even for weekend games.

#20 diehardtwinsfan

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Posted 07 February 2014 - 03:36 PM

I guess now is not the time to ask if anyone is interested in sharing season tickets in 3?* Parker, you can make the Pizza face a 40-game occurrence in 2014!

Minn55441 said it right - I / you / 'we' will be there regardless. I might be scalping more than splurging, but I'll be there.

But riddle me this… the Cubs, also 66 and 96 this year, have a season ticket waiting list. They've had one for a long, long time. They've had loosing records consistently for many more years than the Twins (no WS in 105 years), but even comparing just W/L record averages from 2000 to 2013:

Twins: .547
Cubs: .513

I get that Cubs fans are loyal until death do they part. I don't exactly want to be known as the team that always looses but has damn devoted fans anyways. But when the going gets tough, the indifference of the majority of most Minnesotans [TwinsDaily is of course not a representative sample :o] is disheartening.

*True story, if anyone is interested please let me know asap!


A good friend of mine told me (in the late 90s I might add) that the Twins had a better shot of winning a world series in his lifetime than the Cubs... for the simple reason that it doesn't matter what they put out on the field, it will draw. The Cubs have mastered marketing this as an experience. If you go to Wrigley, you'll see lots of people drinking a beer and chatting, but not nearly as much watching the game... Had a WhiteSox fan friend who absolutely hated Cubs fans for that reason...

Honestly, I think I'd rather the fan base be a bit more fickle... More incentive to put a winning product out on the field.

#21 nicksaviking

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Posted 07 February 2014 - 04:29 PM

I'm just fine with the Twins not being the Cubs. I have no problem with attendance being tied directly to the performance on the field, that should keep everyone honest and competitive. Jobs may finally be tied to performance if performance is also tied to attendance.

#22 mike wants wins

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Posted 07 February 2014 - 05:00 PM

Season ticket sales usually reflect the previous year's results, not upcoming expectations. That's what the research says. I expect next year's sales to be below this years, because they are likely, imo, to be under 75 wins again......And, I believe that most fans should stay away if the product is bad, if they sell 3 million tickets, they have little incentive to get better.....
Lighten up Francis....

#23 twinsnorth49

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Posted 07 February 2014 - 06:21 PM

It's a double edged sword, I get showing your displeasure by not showing up and it's everybody's right to make that choice. However it can become a vicious circle if shrinking revenues begin to hamper the teams ability, or will to become competitive again.

I realize the Pohlads and the Twins have the ability to spend more money but the organization has done a good job potentially setting the team up to be successful on the field in the next 1-2 years. I would think the fan base would support that despite what the results may reflect, knowing that it is headed in the right direction.

#24 rickyriolo

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Posted 07 February 2014 - 06:48 PM

I support my Twins. I will be going to the games in San Diego when they come AND $20 on the Twinkies to WIN the World Series this year @ 80-1....yeah LETS GO TWINKIES

#25 Thrylos

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Posted 07 February 2014 - 06:50 PM

It's a double edged sword, I get showing your displeasure by not showing up and it's everybody's right to make that choice. However it can become a vicious circle if shrinking revenues begin to hamper the teams ability, or will to become competitive again.


There are a few things in play here:

-There is a set of fans who really are Twins fans and follow the games and go to the games and watch the games because they love baseball and they love the Twins. These folks will be there rain or shine and some of them will likely be at the ballpark more during rain (When I was living in the Cities, I saw more games at the Dome in 1990 than I did in '87 and '91. Reason: Cheaper tickets.)

- There is another group of corporate fans. These folks will get their tickets (and suites) year after year after year.

- There is another group of "experience" fans. For these folks baseball competes with the likes of movies, concerts, amusement parks etc. They go there for the food and the races between innings and the such. These folks will go there as well (and might score some concert tickets too and do the wave too and clap their hands, when the music asks them to do so). Modern stadiums have ensured that.

-The only group that it's attendance is affected by bad performance is the bandwagon fans... How big is that group compared to the previous? I don't know. But I think that lots of these folks are "experience fans" as well...

Edited by Thrylos, 07 February 2014 - 06:53 PM.

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#26 Willihammer

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Posted 07 February 2014 - 09:05 PM

There's definitely a weather factor too. 5 of their 6 worst attended games last year were in April. Those tickets were sold. Nobody's making that mistake this year, still lots of good tickets for the dang home opener.

http://minnesota.twi.../opener_tix.jsp

#27 TheLeviathan

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Posted 07 February 2014 - 10:26 PM

The only group that it's attendance is affected by bad performance is the bandwagon fans... How big is that group compared to the previous? I don't know. But I think that lots of these folks are "experience fans" as well...


I think this is way too overgeneralized to be taken seriously. There are plenty of die-hard baseball fans who just choose to watch on TV over spending serious money on an inferior product. Cable TV has made going to a game a luxury rather than a necessity.

For those of us that going to a game can be an hour or more travel time, that's also a major impact. (The weather angle is a big part of this) I think those living in the cities underestimate how much the out-state fans support the game attendance. And we just don't want to pay and drive all that way to watch a game that's over by the 2nd inning.

#28 Tibs

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Posted 07 February 2014 - 10:43 PM

If I lived closer to Target Field, I would be going to as many games as possible no matter how good the team is. I love baseball and I love the Twins. If other people don't want to show up because they think it will help put a better product on the field, I will gladly take their spot.
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#29 ashburyjohn

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Posted 07 February 2014 - 11:17 PM

And we just don't want to pay and drive all that way to watch a game that's over by the 2nd inning.


In 2017 when the Twins start blowing out the opponents these out of towners will not go? :)

#30 TheLeviathan

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Posted 07 February 2014 - 11:34 PM

In 2017 when the Twins start blowing out the opponents these out of towners will not go? :)


Well...the Summit tastes way better in that scenario...no?