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What would you do at DH?

josh willingham minnesota twins
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#1 Collin Kottke

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Posted 20 December 2013 - 03:42 PM

After the Doumit trade I started thinking about what I want the Twins to do with the DH spot. I concluded (over at Puckett's Pond) that I want Josh Willingham to be the full-time DH and improve the defense out in left field.

I'm curious what others think about this. It's been consuming me the past couple of days.

#2 Brock Beauchamp

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Posted 20 December 2013 - 03:48 PM

If you want to field the best team possible, Willingham should DH.

If you want to keep Josh's trade value higher, Willingham should be LF.

Personally, I think Josh should DH, at least when Hughes is on the mound. I don't want that poor guy pitching while Arcia and Willingham bumble around the OF.

#3 Thrylos

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Posted 20 December 2013 - 04:27 PM

I think that you trade Willingham now, sign someone like Michael Young to keep 3B warm for Sano and be in the DH rotation, and move Plouffe full time at OF/DH. Have an DH rotation of Plouffe, Kubel, (with Arcia and Young taking breathers there). Full time OF of Plouffe-Hicks-Arcia (L-R) with Presley as late inning replacement/4th OF.

This would work for me. Just don't want to see Willingham on the field again, and I know that if he is around Gardy will play him.
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#4 Marta Shearing

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Posted 20 December 2013 - 04:41 PM

Well if sano makes the team, plouffe and kubel should platoon.

#5 Danchat

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Posted 20 December 2013 - 05:09 PM

If Kubel makes the team, he should really only be the DH and pinch hitter. Willingham should get some reps at DH but it looks like he will play some LF. Parmelee perhaps? *Gets hit with a baseball*

#6 stringer bell

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Posted 20 December 2013 - 07:05 PM

I think it will primarily be Kubel, with Hammer getting several starts against LH pitching. If Colabello makes the club, he might get quite a few starts at DH vs. left handers.

#7 mike wants wins

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Posted 20 December 2013 - 07:46 PM

Willingham for sure, with good defenders in the OF. This is a fly ball staff. If you are just trading willingham, no reason to sign Pelfrey, IMO.
Lighten up Francis....

#8 Thrylos

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Posted 20 December 2013 - 08:24 PM

If you are just trading willingham, no reason to sign Pelfrey, IMO.


Actually it is the opposite, if you sign Pelfrey who had a horrible .337 BABIP because of the likes of Willingham and Doumit and Parmelee & Co in the corner OF positions, you got to get rid of them to make your team successful... Am I missing something here?
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#9 Bark's Lounge

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Posted 20 December 2013 - 09:02 PM

I am not sure why some TD posters think Plouffe is a viable option for playing the outfield. Almost 2 years ago, Ryan said that Plouffe tried, but is not an option for playing the outfield - his transition did not go so well. Plouffe is probably 3B or bust... maybe some DH duty,

Preferably, I would like to see Willingham at DH, as I think Kubel is a better outfielder than Willingham. Neither is very good, but from the days of past watching Kubel play LF or RF - he is way more fluid.

I do agree with Beauchamp, that playing Willingham in LF would increase his trade value to a certain degree, which is undefinable at this time.

I hope that is what happens.

#10 Kwak

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Posted 20 December 2013 - 09:27 PM

History has shown that Gardenhire will use many line-ups in April--baseball's version of whack-a-mole. I would expect that Parmelee is the RF most days, Willingham the LF most days, and Arcia plays about as many in RF as he does in LF. There will be several DHs. Kubel is in Rochester at first, but if anybody (other than Willingham) "messes-up"--Kubel will replace him and will play the OF as much as he DHs. Plouffe is a fixture at 3B--unless he "pulls a Valencia", then we might see a merry-go-round there. There should be a contest for the exact number of line-ups used in April (disregarding the SP)--I got 19!

#11 johnnydakota

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Posted 20 December 2013 - 09:33 PM

I think that you trade Willingham now, sign someone like Michael Young to keep 3B warm for Sano and be in the DH rotation, and move Plouffe full time at OF/DH. Have an DH rotation of Plouffe, Kubel, (with Arcia and Young taking breathers there). Full time OF of Plouffe-Hicks-Arcia (L-R) with Presley as late inning replacement/4th OF.

This would work for me. Just don't want to see Willingham on the field again, and I know that if he is around Gardy will play him.


Young makes trevor look like a good fielding 3rd basemen , 3 years ago, maybe a different story

#12 johnnydakota

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Posted 20 December 2013 - 09:36 PM

History has shown that Gardenhire will use many line-ups in April--baseball's version of whack-a-mole. I would expect that Parmelee is the RF most days, Willingham the LF most days, and Arcia plays about as many in RF as he does in LF. There will be several DHs. Kubel is in Rochester at first, but if anybody (other than Willingham) "messes-up"--Kubel will replace him and will play the OF as much as he DHs. Plouffe is a fixture at 3B--unless he "pulls a Valencia", then we might see a merry-go-round there. There should be a contest for the exact number of line-ups used in April (disregarding the SP)--I got 19!

How many games do we have in April? subtract 3 and thats my guess

#13 DocBauer

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Posted 20 December 2013 - 09:40 PM

I hate sounding like a broken record, but....

Willingham needs to be the primary DH now. I don't buy him playing LF on a consistent basis to provide trade value. If teams don't know what he brings, or doesn't, defensively by now, that is on them. It's about tutting the best every day lineup on the field and at the plate. Healthy this year, I expect him to resort to solid career norms, which is still potent, if not quite up to 2012 production. Molitor provides the perfect tutor to ease him in to this new role. And he can still play the occasional LF, at least in NL parks.

Kubel or Parmalee, if either prove themselves and make the club, can help off the bench and DH on occasion. And I'm not so sure I look at Willingham necessarily as trade bait. Granted the Twins could look elsewhere next offseason for a new DH, but if Willingham does rebound, not sure i wouldn't be opposed to keeping him all year with the idea of resigning. Just a thought.

i still believe Hicks is a big key to next season. He was rushed, and we all know that. But he has tremendous talent still. Don't let one rushed and failed attempt fool you. I even like him not playing winter ball this year for a break to gather himself, as long as he gets his work in. Carew has even said the same. We saw improvement before injury, the talent is still there, he's always needed a little time to adjust to the next level, and it was just reported he hd a strong finish to his AAA season and might have been their best player the final weeks.

Arcia n RF, Hicks in CF (.230-.250 with power, speed, defense), Presley and Mastro (or a possible insurance signing/trade to come) with Willingham a DH is our best option.

#14 Willihammer

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Posted 20 December 2013 - 09:42 PM

I want Hammer and Arcia in the lineup everyday. After that, play platoons/matchups. If we're not going to upgrade CF, SS, C or 3B then the corner OF needs to hit. Defense should be a secondary consideration IMO.

#15 Trevor0333

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Posted 20 December 2013 - 09:55 PM

If you want to field the best team possible, Willingham should DH.

If you want to keep Josh's trade value higher, Willingham should be LF.

Personally, I think Josh should DH, at least when Hughes is on the mound. I don't want that poor guy pitching while Arcia and Willingham bumble around the OF.


I disagree a bit, having Hammer be a DH 3/4 of the time while spending some time out in LF as a 4th OF to rest the other guys once a week keeps his legs fresh & hopefully able to stay healthy. Teams know his defensive short comings & ability in LF. As long as he is healthy enough to play it once a week it will not hurt his trade value. Staying healthy will improve it more than playing spotty LF full time.

#16 Trevor0333

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Posted 20 December 2013 - 10:47 PM

Honestly the DH options this year & next are very very blah.

Morales will cost a pick as would Butler next year. They both will get ore than I would like to spend on a full time DH.

Kubel/Hammer platoon at DH if Kubel can find find some return to form vs RHP even going into 2015. 7-8 Mill combined would likely get them back on 1 year deals.

Parmelee/Plouffe DH platoon wouldnt be the end of the world for 1 year.

Niether of those options excites me at all but that would keep the seat warm for Vargas or Walker to come in as the DH come 2016.

#17 Shane Wahl

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Posted 21 December 2013 - 12:52 AM

Presley-Hicks-Arcia/Kubel in the OF with Kubel/Arcia at DH for many games against righties (Willingham is in many of those games too), and Willingham-Hicks-Plouffe (post Sano arrival) against lefties doesn't seem too crazy.

#18 kab21

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Posted 21 December 2013 - 02:43 AM

If you want to field the best team possible, Willingham should DH.

If you want to keep Josh's trade value higher, Willingham should be LF.

Personally, I think Josh should DH, at least when Hughes is on the mound. I don't want that poor guy pitching while Arcia and Willingham bumble around the OF.


Willingham's trade value is higher if he's healthy which is more likely at DH.

I would like the Twins to sign another competent bat that hopefully plays better defense than Willy. Not much left aside from Morales and Cruz. And neither of these players are worth a 2nd rd pick for the Twins.


Hopefully Arcia is ready to be up full time with the Twins. I'm optimistic long term about him but not in the short term. After that DH/LF will likely be rotation of Willy, Parmelee, Presley, possibly Mastro and eventually Plouffe. I am not a fan of this but other than a trade there aren't many options other than waiting for Buxton, possibly Rosario (moves to LF), Vargas and the rest of the prospects.

I would like to get Jesus Montero if he's available relatively cheaply.

#19 Joe A. Preusser

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Posted 21 December 2013 - 06:12 AM

I would strike out a lot and on occasion make some weak contact.

Hammer, who should be our everyday DH, would do considerably better.

#20 cmathewson

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Posted 21 December 2013 - 08:15 AM

I agree with most of the comments. I think they signed Kubel and traded Doumit to make Kubel the primary DH. Hammer will get some reps there when the Twins face a tough lefty and need better outfield defense. Say, when Hughes pitches against Sabathia. But the normal lineup should have Hammer in Left and Kubel at DH.
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#21 jorgenswest

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Posted 21 December 2013 - 10:05 AM

I had hoped they would let Willingham go in August to the Orioles and found someone this winter that can play defense.

Keeping him only makes sense if he has trade value midseason. All of his value tied to his bat and health. The DH role gives the best hope of maximizing his value.

There doesn't appear to be a good solution for outfield defense on opening day, but Buxton and Hicks are close. Rosario would have been also.

#22 Rosterman

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Posted 21 December 2013 - 10:41 AM

The Twins have Arcia. They now have Kubel. They have Parmelee. In the wings they have Mastro and Ramirez as fodder. Presley will start in centerfield. They have Hicks in line for a promotion. They have Rosario in the mix. Of course, Buxton looms big. Kepler is at least one year out.

Willingham needs to play the field if the Twins want to show any value in the guy. Depending on the team's overall season, he is trade bait, be it coming out of spring training, at the deadline, or before September rosters are set. He does not figure into the Twins plans in 2015 and beyond. Surely not.

He will also be looking for a bigger payday on his next round of free agency and WANTS to make himself as valuable as possible, by being a fielder (National League contract) and a slugger.

If Ryan gets results and plays it smart, he has some nice trading chips in Willingham, Correia, not to mention any of a number of bullpen arms like Burton, Swarzak, especially Duensing, maybe Diamond and Worley that could ALL go and not really hurt the team, no matter if they are good or bad in 2014. Hicks can replace Willingham. Gibson or May can repalce Correia. We have too many guys in the bullpen and Tonkin will be in the wings, as will Achter and Oliveros and Guerra and maybe Johnson and Albers.

I'm getting excited about the Twins in 2014. Really am! Maybe buy that season ticket package so I can also spend a grand on a couple of All-Star game packages.
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#23 howieramone1406390264

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Posted 21 December 2013 - 11:23 AM

If Ryan gets results and plays it smart, he has some nice trading chips in Willingham, Correia, not to mention any of a number of bullpen arms like Burton, Swarzak, especially Duensing, maybe Diamond and Worley that could ALL go and not really hurt the team, no matter if they are good or bad in 2014. Hicks can replace Willingham. Gibson or May can repalce Correia. We have too many guys in the bullpen and Tonkin will be in the wings, as will Achter and Oliveros and Guerra and maybe Johnson and Albers.


I agree with you. Trader Terry First Scout has some trading chips. I'm hoping Correia goes out the back door, as Arroyo comes in the front. I actually like the idea of Florimon playing next to Sano, but I'm guessing SS with be addressed prior to 2015. Also, I think Brock first mentioned, there could be a 24 month gap between Meyer and our next top starting pitching prospect. I wouldn't be surprised to see this gap addressed a la Gilmartin.

#24 jorgenswest

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Posted 21 December 2013 - 12:08 PM

Willingham needs to DH.

If he plays the field, he will do so as the bottom LF. His ability to play LF isn't going to change if he DHs. Teams know what they will get from him in the field. Playing DH doesn't decrease his value. His lack of range in LF decreases his value. His value is all bat.

Benefits to playing DH...

- Willingham is more likely to remain healthy. He has no value injured.

- The pitching staff will have better defense behind them resulting in better numbers and better value.

The problem is that with Willingham on the roster the twins did nothing to try to find a LF. They don't have a good solution to play that position until Buxton and Hicks or Rosario are ready.

#25 diehardtwinsfan

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Posted 21 December 2013 - 12:21 PM

I want to see Plouffe and Parmelee getting as many at bats as possible to see if one of them can earn the DH job for the next wave. I'd rather them not go out and sign someone here until we know for certain if either of them can do it.

#26 Riverbrian

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Posted 21 December 2013 - 12:37 PM

I think Willingham needs to play LF... Just for trade value alone. I wouldn't move Willingham right now for a few reasons.

1. Willingham's trade value is low right now. If he rebounds to just normal numbers for Willingham... His trade value improves in July.

2. If the Twins are going to be successful... He is the most legit power source on this club. Willingham rebounding would be a needed thing for this club.

3. If the Twins are not going to be successful... Willingham rebounding is a trade chip to contending club.

4. If Willingham is a potential trade chip down the line... Being positioned as a LF instead of a DH increases the trade options and therefore value.

5. If Willingham doesn't rebound... none of this matters... His trade value and value to us will be insignificant. Just let his contract run out and move on.

Willingham can and should DH on occasion... but I think Kubel is the most logical DH option as the roster stands right now.

Edited by Riverbrian, 21 December 2013 - 12:43 PM.

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#27 JP3700

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Posted 21 December 2013 - 01:15 PM

I would sign Jeff Baker and rotate the DH. He has a career .875 OPS against lefties, can play all four corners and second base.

Parmelee starts against righties, allowing Willingham, Arcia or Mauer to DH. Baker starts against lefties, allowing Plouffe, Willingham, Arcia or Mauer to DH.

Baker would also be nice to have off the bench. Could serve as a pinch hitter in key situations and is versatile on defense.

#28 mike wants wins

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Posted 21 December 2013 - 06:38 PM

Actually it is the opposite, if you sign Pelfrey who had a horrible .337 BABIP because of the likes of Willingham and Doumit and Parmelee & Co in the corner OF positions, you got to get rid of them to make your team successful... Am I missing something here?


yes, they have no offense. If you are not playing your second or third best offensive player, why sign a stop gap pitcher?
Lighten up Francis....

#29 Sconnie

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Posted 21 December 2013 - 07:13 PM

Presley, Hicks, Arcia in OF with Willingham at DH/4th OF would be best, especially during Hughes turn in the Rotation.

#30 Sconnie

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Posted 21 December 2013 - 07:55 PM

yes, they have no offense. If you are not playing your second or third best offensive player, why sign a stop gap pitcher?

True, their defense last year at Third and Left field sucked badly. It's a great to offer such an opportunity to right handed pull hitters. there's a limit as to how much you can sacrifice defense for offense, especially when your two biggest liabilities are on the same side of the field. How many players can you trot out who can hit OK, but can't field worth a damn? Twins have defensive options in the outfield, but zero every day options at third outside of Plouffe. Sano might have a cup of coffee with the hug league club in 2014, but can't be relied upon this year.



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