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What have we learned so far?

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#1 minn55441

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Posted 19 April 2012 - 08:03 AM

This team can score runs. Although not great in the field, there is a lot of flexibility in the lineup. Gardy should have a lot of options late in games to play pitching match-ups and still not leave a whole in the field for the later innings. Pitching is inconsistent at best. How many legitimate starters do we have that can be counted on, one, maybe two? Blackburn is the only starter that is under contract for next year and our current payroll sits below $95 million. What are the odds of Terry Ryan going shopping to try and find us some pitching during the season? As mentioned, we don't have to worry about having too many starters for 2013 and we don't have any great prospect knocking down the door just waiting for that first opportunity(I'm talking surefire, can't miss pitching help). Is this the new Twin's? Is it possible that we did not chase free agent pitching prospects in the off season with the idea that we would have the opportunity to add a couple during the season? Terry wants to win and win now, I'm convinced of that. I also think that in his prior stint as GM he was severely limited as to what he could do as far as picking up free agents. We have the money now, we have the revenue stream if the team can win. Now the question, who would you be willing to part with in an attempt to attract some quality arms. I’m talking prospects here. What kind of value do Sano, Hicks, Rosario and Parmelee have? I’m not talking about trading away the future, just trading away value at a position that could bring us back some quality arms. I don’t have a specific pitcher or group of pitchers in mind, but are we better off looking to swing a deal during the season, even if it means trading a great prospect or two? The other option I see is struggling through a 72-90 season where we score a lot of runs but can’t get anyone out and then look to sign a group of pitchers on the free agent market after the season ends. I don’t think it is an option to wait for our current group of minor league pitchers develop. We have a bunch of 4th and 5th starters that are still years away from being consistent. Are we a couple starters away from competing with the big boys or are we better off waiting another year or two?

#2 Kneelb4zerg

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Posted 19 April 2012 - 08:18 AM

This team can score runs. Although not great in the field, there is a lot of flexibility in the lineup. Gardy should have a lot of options late in games to play pitching match-ups and still not leave a whole in the field for the later innings. Pitching is inconsistent at best. How many legitimate starters do we have that can be counted on, one, maybe two?

Blackburn is the only starter that is under contract for next year and our current payroll sits below $95 million. What are the odds of Terry Ryan going shopping to try and find us some pitching during the season? As mentioned, we don't have to worry about having too many starters for 2013 and we don't have any great prospect knocking down the door just waiting for that first opportunity(I'm talking surefire, can't miss pitching help). Is this the new Twin's? Is it possible that we did not chase free agent pitching prospects in the off season with the idea that we would have the opportunity to add a couple during the season? Terry wants to win and win now, I'm convinced of that. I also think that in his prior stint as GM he was severely limited as to what he could do as far as picking up free agents. We have the money now, we have the revenue stream if the team can win.


Now the question, who would you be willing to part with in an attempt to attract some quality arms. I’m talking prospects here. What kind of value do Sano, Hicks, Rosario and Parmelee have? I’m not talking about trading away the future, just trading away value at a position that could bring us back some quality arms. I don’t have a specific pitcher or group of pitchers in mind, but are we better off looking to swing a deal during the season, even if it means trading a great prospect or two? The other option I see is struggling through a 72-90 season where we score a lot of runs but can’t get anyone out and then look to sign a group of pitchers on the free agent market after the season ends. I don’t think it is an option to wait for our current group of minor league pitchers develop. We have a bunch of 4th and 5th starters that are still years away from being consistent.

Are we a couple starters away from competing with the big boys or are we better off waiting another year or two?



Good post. I think we're a couple of years away, and if Ryan trades Sano, there should be a riot. No way that happens.

#3 stringer bell

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Posted 19 April 2012 - 08:24 AM

There are a lot of pieces on this team that aren't bound to be here next year. If the Twins aren't in it this summer, I can see some or all of Doumit, Carroll, Span, Pavano, Marquis, Capps, and Liriano leaving in trades. The goal should be simple, if the Twins are marginally in it, they should be trading value for value, but if not (and I think they'll have a hard time competing with that staff) acquire arms and middle infielders. The team as composed right now is pretty good offensively, catches the ball and plays with better defensive fundamentals than last year's huge disappointment. Without a dominant starter and with a lot of question marks in the bullpen, their staff can't and won't be a strength. They should win a lot more games, but moving from 63 to enough to contend is a huge mountain to climb.

#4 jeffk

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Posted 19 April 2012 - 08:29 AM

My main take away is that hopefully Span, Mauer and Morneau are not busted but back to being productive players, even if it's a bit early to say for sure. That and Willingham is a beast. My hope is that these four guys stay and remain productive for a few years, until the next wave of strong prospects hits. At that point, buy or trade for a couple of serviceable pitchers and they have a real chance to be competitive. Right now, we know their pitching is absolute rubbish so I am less concerned whether or not they win and more concerned whether or not they hit.

#5 gunnarthor

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Posted 19 April 2012 - 08:40 AM

This team can score runs. Although not great in the field, there is a lot of flexibility in the lineup. Gardy should have a lot of options late in games to play pitching match-ups and still not leave a whole in the field for the later innings. Pitching is inconsistent at best. How many legitimate starters do we have that can be counted on, one, maybe two?

Blackburn is the only starter that is under contract for next year and our current payroll sits below $95 million. What are the odds of Terry Ryan going shopping to try and find us some pitching during the season? As mentioned, we don't have to worry about having too many starters for 2013 and we don't have any great prospect knocking down the door just waiting for that first opportunity(I'm talking surefire, can't miss pitching help). Is this the new Twin's? Is it possible that we did not chase free agent pitching prospects in the off season with the idea that we would have the opportunity to add a couple during the season? Terry wants to win and win now, I'm convinced of that. I also think that in his prior stint as GM he was severely limited as to what he could do as far as picking up free agents. We have the money now, we have the revenue stream if the team can win.


Now the question, who would you be willing to part with in an attempt to attract some quality arms. I’m talking prospects here. What kind of value do Sano, Hicks, Rosario and Parmelee have? I’m not talking about trading away the future, just trading away value at a position that could bring us back some quality arms. I don’t have a specific pitcher or group of pitchers in mind, but are we better off looking to swing a deal during the season, even if it means trading a great prospect or two? The other option I see is struggling through a 72-90 season where we score a lot of runs but can’t get anyone out and then look to sign a group of pitchers on the free agent market after the season ends. I don’t think it is an option to wait for our current group of minor league pitchers develop. We have a bunch of 4th and 5th starters that are still years away from being consistent.

Are we a couple starters away from competing with the big boys or are we better off waiting another year or two?


I think the Twins can do a few things that'll help. In season, I think we can add some payroll. It might not get us a great starter but maybe we could add a good bullpen arm (Houston Street type guy who's owed 9m next year?) If the team is out of it at the trade deadline, I think they should move Span if they can get a Pence-like deal for him (if he's healthy). They have the #2 pick in the draft, so they could grab a guy like Appel, Zimmer or Gausman. Finally, they'll have 24m coming off the books next year in starters salary and Morneau is gone the following year. They do have the resources to make a significant free agent signing (Grienke, Marcum) if they wanted to.

As to your question. Sano has great trade value but I don't think we'd trade him. Benson might have the best trade value of someone we might actually get rid of. He's a top 100 prospect in AAA with great tools. We could probably get a decent pitcher or prospect in return for him.

#6 minn55441

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Posted 19 April 2012 - 08:46 AM

Would you trade Sano for Matt Moore of the Rays? I would in a heartbeat. Would you give up Benson and Hicks for Strasburg? It's difficult to get good pitching. This past offseason Oakland was trading away many of their good young arms, in my mind we don't have many of these elite arms in our system, but we do have a lot of potential in our young bats. How many of these prospects will actually make to the all-star level in the majors? 20%? 40%? Some teams trade for potential, others trade for performance. In the past we haven't done much trading at all, I'm just wondering if Terry Ryan made a conscience decision to scale back our payroll prior to the year in order to give him some options during the season. Don't get me wrong, I would hate to lose Sano, but if we could come up with a young pitcher with the same talent level only in a pitcher, that is something we would have to look at . The examples above are absurd. I don't think there is anyway we could get either Moore or Strasburg, but do you get my point? trading potential for actual big league production is sometimes a good option. Remember the Delmon trade?

Edited by minn55441, 19 April 2012 - 09:04 AM.