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Article: Terry Ryan Discusses Ron Gardenhire's Future

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#1 Parker Hageman

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 02:51 PM

You can view the page at http://twinsdaily.co...8-Is-Gardy-Gone

#2 Jon Marthaler

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 02:59 PM

I call unfair URL usage. Five yard SEO penalty.

#3 Parker Hageman

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 03:02 PM

Grow up, JON.

#4 Shane Wahl

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 03:04 PM

Much ado.

He is going to be back. I guarantee it. I would have fired him last offseason, but I am not Terry Ryan.

#5 ChiTownTwinsFan

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 03:19 PM

If he were going to be back, why wait to say so? Waiting to say what's what is just delaying the inevitable, imo.

#6 ThePuck

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 03:33 PM

My favorite quote: ' Regardless of ERA and those types of things, even Correia and Pelfrey, they’ve done what you might want to expect.”'

yeah, those pesky ERAs and other things that evaluate how a pitcher does...if it wasn't for them, people would say they did great. Apprently the scouts told him they've been better than their numbers suggest :-)

And yes, besides allowing a boatload of inherited runs, the bullpen has been decent.

My favorite line: 'Ryan suggested that injuries to key players played a substantial role in the Twins’ third consecutive losing season '

SUBSTANTIAL role? Blaming this season on injuries is just funny...no team goes without injuries...no team should fold because a guy or two misses some time. This kind of losing is what happens when you put this kind of rotation together backed up by too many guys that either aren't ready for the show or never will be ready for the show.

He focuses on the offensive issues and kind of sidesteps the rotation issues (besides sort of patting himself on the back for the, um, er, success of Correia and Pelfrey)which are even worse and which HE SAID he'd do everything possible to make substantially better.

Edited by ThePuck, 12 September 2013 - 03:52 PM.


#7 mike wants wins

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 03:39 PM

Such a depressingly sad series of quotes.

#8 Tcrose3636

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 03:42 PM

I would be pretty pissed off if I were Gardy if Ryan fires him. Look at the **** he has had to work with the past 3 years because of Smith/Ryan. If Ryan lets him go just before the top talent comes up, I think it would be a disservice to him. Struggle through 3 talentless teams, I think Gardy gets 1 or 2 years with good players. If he can't get back to the playoffs, then let him go but at least give him a decent rotation and more than 4 regulars in the everyday line up to work with.

#9 rickyriolo

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 03:52 PM

i believe TR brings Gardy back. Why? Because TR believes no one could win with the roster that he himself put together. But it will be a 1 year deal with team option for year 2

#10 ThePuck

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 03:53 PM

i believe TR brings Gardy back. Why? Because TR believes no one could win with the roster that he himself put together. But it will be a 1 year deal with team option for year 2


Maybe TR shouldn't bring himself back then, since he wants to shoulder all the blame.

#11 rickyriolo

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 03:55 PM

I agree with you Puck but not my call

#12 Hosken Bombo Disco

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 03:58 PM

Not sure why its controversial to fire an underperforming manager.

#13 Tcrose3636

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 04:00 PM

Maybe TR shouldn't bring himself back then, since he wants to shoulder all the blame.


This is a good statement and question. TR has done well with the minor leagues but refuses to spend any kind of money in FA. How long does he get a pass for not making the MLB club better, we saw what another GM could do and we didn't like that. Is this a stretch of years were we as fans have to be patient until the minor league prospect come up and then judge who stays or goes? Lots and lots of question about this team, managers, and in the FO.

#14 Tcrose3636

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 04:01 PM

Not sure why its controversial to fire an underperforming manager.


Maybe he is not underperforming. With the roster he has, maybe this is all he can get out of it. If he had something that resembled a MLB starting rotation, maybe he would be back in the Playoffs.

#15 Alex

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 04:08 PM

Maybe he is not underperforming. With the roster he has, maybe this is all he can get out of it. If he had something that resembled a MLB starting rotation, maybe he would be back in the Playoffs.


So you're saying if he had better players he'd manage better?

#16 Alex

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 04:21 PM

Such a depressingly sad series of quotes.


I agree. It comes across as pathetic excuse making and just not owning up. I'm sure it's because he can't just come out and say he made huge mistakes, but anyone should be able to read between the lines here -- that or he comes across as pretty mule-headed about the real reasons the Twins are terrible.

I'd like to see how the Twins actually rank up when looking at injuries. I mean, relatively recent injuries (like those to Deduno and Mauer) occurred after the wheels had come off. The team has been incredibly healthy at almost every spot, especially when compared to two years ago. Willingham is the only exception, and he'll still end up with 500 PAs, not to mention he's not a 10 win guy.

The bottom line is that there went into this season aging players who looked older this, hopes at 3B and RF that missed, a rookie CF who was not at all prepared, a 1B who was a shell of his former self, and a starting staff that was a lottery ticket where the max win was $10.

#17 Marta Shearing

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 04:23 PM

The disturbing thing is that if he's replaced it will just be someone in the gardenhire mold. I wouldnt be a bit sueprised if it was ullger. In that case they'd be better off sticking with gardy.

#18 Kwak

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 04:49 PM

Maybe Gardenhire wants out?

Change is inevitable. Ryan is correct in pointing-out that the talent level is such that any manager would struggle--but let's not be deceived that Gardenhire was a helpless pawn with regard to the roster. The pitching philosophy, whatever catchwords you prefer, was a part of Gardenhire's input and was most definitely enforced to the detriment of any pitcher who disagreed. Twins' pitchers have a poor K/game ratio--and suffer because of it. But (at least this year) the Twins' hitters have an equally poor K/game ratio--and suffer just as much. Any baseball manager (field or general) should see these deficiencies and seek to correct them--but I haven't heard a peep from either Ryan or Gardenhire! They can all they want about getting ahead in the count and getting ground-balls, but if there is darn little threat of being struck-out the opponents just cherry-pick the pitches. Inversely the hitters strike-out so often that scoring is made really difficult--the OBP of a K is less than .01!

#19 Danchat

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 04:49 PM

Look, I love Gardy, I think he's a great coach, but he needs to go. I think Rick Anderson and TR's theory of "let's strike NOBODY out!" has really wrecked the rotation. Instead of signing pitchers who have a little risk and a chance to be good, we signed the most conservative non-strikeout pitchers money could buy. Look, I'd much rather can TR than Gardy. But Anderson has to go, and if Gardy will leave with him, so be it.

#20 jimbo92107

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 04:50 PM

Gardenhire brings in a pitcher, pitcher gives up a bunch of runs. Gardenhire brings in a new position player, player hits under .240.

Solution? Fire Gardenhire. Heck, all the next manager needs to do is bring in players that play better. What could be simpler than that?

#21 Thrylos

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 04:50 PM

I would be pretty pissed off if I were Gardy if Ryan fires him. Look at the **** he has had to work with the past 3 years because of Smith/Ryan. If Ryan lets him go just before the top talent comes up, I think it would be a disservice to him. Struggle through 3 talentless teams, I think Gardy gets 1 or 2 years with good players. If he can't get back to the playoffs, then let him go but at least give him a decent rotation and more than 4 regulars in the everyday line up to work with.



a. 2011 was the same team practically as the 2010, other than the differences in the middle infield that Gardenhire himself wanted (remember Gardy's 'we need more speed up the middle' quotes, which he used to justify why he did not like Hardy.) Add the ostracizing of Slowey and sticking with Blackburn & Duensing in the rotation, which was a Gardy & Andy and not a Smith thing, and Gardy is probably more responsible than Smith for 2011

b. Gardy had good teams, including a team that had both the Cy Young and MVP award winners, and he did nothing other than his trademark 3 and out. He had 13 seasons.

It is more than time for him to go away. Bert looks like he is getting a bit too tired/bored with the broadcast and taking half of the games off, and Gardy would be a perfect replacement. Problem solved
---

That said, Ryan's quotes suggest that either he and reality have no connection or he is a plain liar. To say that Pelfrey and Correia were alright and the issues with this season are because the Mauer and Willingham injuries, adds a major intellectual insult to the injury his product has caused to the Twins' fans. Who can take him seriously after those statements? But I suspect a lot of people still taking him seriously after blaming 2012 on Jerry and Stelly and rearranged the rest of the stairs.

Needed changes will be made for 2014 (like last season.) Maybe Scotty will be the pitching coach (the only position he did not have,) Andy the third base coach, Vavry the bench coach and Steiny the first base coach. That would solve all problems.

I cannot see how anyone can trust Ryan. He has to go first and foremost for this team to compete.

Edited by Thrylos, 12 September 2013 - 04:54 PM.

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#22 Winston Smith

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 04:51 PM

A Ryan question, where do they sit on spending the allowed Int. signing money? I know he spent some of it but I thought a lot was still left. Ryan said he'd spend it all, just wondering.

#23 josecordoba

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 04:59 PM

My favorite quote: ' Regardless of ERA and those types of things, even Correia and Pelfrey, they’ve done what you might want to expect"

Ryan is of course correct. Unless one happens to think that Team Defense has no impact on a pitcher's outcome. Which would lead one to believe that Bruce Chen has been a better pitcher this year then Justin Verlander.

#24 old nurse

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 05:25 PM

A Ryan question, where do they sit on spending the allowed Int. signing money? I know he spent some of it but I thought a lot was still left. Ryan said he'd spend it all, just wondering.


I do believe there are about 9 months left in the signing period, what is the rush. Was there a quote somewhere that said he was done signing prospects?

#25 ThePuck

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 05:54 PM

Ryan is of course correct. Unless one happens to think that Team Defense has no impact on a pitcher's outcome. Which would lead one to believe that Bruce Chen has been a better pitcher this year then Justin Verlander.


You think it's just ERA that show they haven't been up to par? He said 'ERA AND those type of things'. Did you see my response to that quote?

If you wanna blame it all on defense, well, look at their FIPs. Not that great either.

...oh, and maybe if it's defense that is the big probelm, and it is a big problem, he should maybe take some blame for that too...maybe he should have also taken the defense into account when he decided to get a bunch of pitchers who need to rely very heavily on defense to be successful

Edited by ThePuck, 12 September 2013 - 06:05 PM.


#26 MarshalltheIrish

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 06:30 PM

There's no question Gardy should go. As if three straight losing seasons of this caliber weren't bad enough, let's not forget he has a hideous 12-game playoff losing streak under his belt as well. The team has failed in every way under his tenure, even with the some successes like the division titles. If they truly want to rebuild I think they'd benefit not only from a new manager next year, but one from the outside. My top pick is Dave Martinez, the bench coach for the Tampa Bay Rays. He's been on the staff for all these great and resourceful Rays teams, and age and career-wise I think he'd be poised to take on a managerial job. In any case, it's time for Gardy to walk.

#27 Alex

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 06:44 PM

You think it's just ERA that show they haven't been up to par? He said 'ERA AND those type of things'. Did you see my response to that quote?

If you wanna blame it all on defense, well, look at their FIPs. Not that great either.

...oh, and maybe if it's defense that is the big probelm, and it is a big problem, he should maybe take some blame for that too...maybe he should have also taken the defense into account when he decided to get a bunch of pitchers who need to rely very heavily on defense to be successful


An interesting comparisons might've to look at last year's defense vs. this year's. The OF wasn't as good without Span and Revere, but up the middle infield was improved greatly -- best combo In the league by some metrics.

So, I'm not convinced the "it's not the pitcher's fault" really flies.

#28 ThePuck

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 06:58 PM

An interesting comparisons might've to look at last year's defense vs. this year's. The OF wasn't as good without Span and Revere, but up the middle infield was improved greatly -- best combo In the league by some metrics.

So, I'm not convinced the "it's not the pitcher's fault" really flies.


Truth is...we have failed horribly in every aspect of the game...every...single...aspect. Even the bullpen, though overworked for sure and with a decent ERA, has failed when it comes to inherited runners scoring...which is a pretty important part of relieving.

#29 Alex

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 07:07 PM

Truth is...we have failed horribly in every aspect of the game...every...single...aspect. Even the bullpen, though overworked for sure and with a decent ERA, has failed when it comes to inherited runners scoring...which is a pretty important part of relieving.


I don't disagree with the exception of 2B, C, and CL

#30 ThePuck

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 07:08 PM

I don't disagree with the exception of 2B, C, and CL


True, but I meant as a team...as a whole.