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Twns MiLB POY?

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#1 mudcat14

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Posted 17 August 2013 - 09:16 PM

Looks like quite a battle this year for the organizations minor league Player of the Year. I count at least five very viable candidates. Buxton & Sano get all the hype of course, but Colabello, Walker & DJ Hicks can each make a viable case as well. My vote is still wide open.

#2 beckmt

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Posted 17 August 2013 - 09:44 PM

Colabello would get my vote. Is near the top in most categories despite spending about a month in the majors.

#3 Oxtung

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Posted 17 August 2013 - 10:19 PM

Jorge Polanco, Zach Jones, Michael Tonkin, Josmil Pinto and Danny Santana are other names that I think should get consideration. If you're going to put Colabello up then you probably also need to add Kyle Gibson as well. They've both spent quite a bit of time at the major league level.

If this was an open poll I think that Sano and Buxton would probably win on name recognition but I think there are others that are equally worthy. Wide open this year IMO.

#4 Larsbars08

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Posted 17 August 2013 - 11:26 PM

I think it's got to be a position player. There have been some good pitching performances, but I don't think any pitcher has had quite as dominant of a year as some of the position players.

You really can't go wrong with either Sano, Buxton, Colabello, or Adam Brett Walker. I think I would probably go Buxton, Sano, and Colabello as the top 3. Walker has been great, but he's done it at one level, and low-A at that. Also, his numbers aren't really close to the other 3 guys. Colabello has amazing numbers in AAA, but I might give Buxton and Sano an edge based on them being at multiple levels in the minors and thriving at both levels.

Colabello: 375 PA .354/.432/.652 with 24 HR, 74 RBIs and 2 SB.
Buxton: 513 PA .330/.415/.526 with 12 HR, 75 RBIs, and 49 SB.
Sano: 453 PA .289/.387/.620 with 31 HR, 92 RBIs, and 10 SB.

This sounds a bit like the MVP debate. Do you give it to the guy who has been all around great in Buxton. A guy with incredible numbers, but not a prospect. Or do you give it to the guy with incredible power numbers and RBIs. After writing this, I have to think it's between Buxton or Colabello. Colabello and Sano's power numbers are close enough that I give Colabello the nod for the superior triple slash numbers.

My vote is Buxton. Defense and baserunning are just as sexy as home runs, and Buxton has good power, with a ton of triples.

#5 Oxtung

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Posted 18 August 2013 - 12:17 AM

I think it's got to be a position player. There have been some good pitching performances, but I don't think any pitcher has had quite as dominant of a year as some of the position players.

You really can't go wrong with either Sano, Buxton, Colabello, or Adam Brett Walker. I think I would probably go Buxton, Sano, and Colabello as the top 3. Walker has been great, but he's done it at one level, and low-A at that. Also, his numbers aren't really close to the other 3 guys. Colabello has amazing numbers in AAA, but I might give Buxton and Sano an edge based on them being at multiple levels in the minors and thriving at both levels.

Colabello: 375 PA .354/.432/.652 with 24 HR, 74 RBIs and 2 SB.
Buxton: 513 PA .330/.415/.526 with 12 HR, 75 RBIs, and 49 SB.
Sano: 453 PA .289/.387/.620 with 31 HR, 92 RBIs, and 10 SB.

This sounds a bit like the MVP debate. Do you give it to the guy who has been all around great in Buxton. A guy with incredible numbers, but not a prospect. Or do you give it to the guy with incredible power numbers and RBIs. After writing this, I have to think it's between Buxton or Colabello. Colabello and Sano's power numbers are close enough that I give Colabello the nod for the superior triple slash numbers.

My vote is Buxton. Defense and baserunning are just as sexy as home runs, and Buxton has good power, with a ton of triples.


If you think a pitcher doesn't deserve it because they only pitch every 5 days or have limited innings out of the bullpen, I can understand that. I disagree but I understand that. I don't understand the idea that some of the pitchers haven't been dominant.

For instance Zach Jones has a 1.81 ERA in 44IP with 24H and 62K's. That's means he's giving up a hit once every other inning and half the time his fielders don't even get to play because he's striking batters out at such an astounding clip. It doesn't get much more dominant than that. Frankly I don't get what he's still doing in Fort Myers.

Tyler Jones has been nearly as dominant. Tonkin might be more dominant.

Another pitcher that deserves consideration is Andrew Albers. He has a 2.28 ERA in 132IP with a 1.179 WHIP and 116K's (7.9/9IP).

#6 lightfoot789

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Posted 18 August 2013 - 12:22 AM

My arguement for Adam Brett Walker II is that although he didn't play at 2 levels - He did most of his damage after Buxton and Hicks left Cedar Rapids. He is a huge reason that the CR Kernels are 30 games above .500 and have sported a better record during the second half of the season as opposed to the first half. The Kernels are still loaded but no one would deny that they were more loaded during the 1st half of season. Great season either way. He is ranked in the Midwest League in several categories:
2nd - Runs / 1st - HRs / 1st - RBI / 1st - SLG% / 1st - Total Bases / 3rd - OPS / 62 XBH / Never caught stealing as a pro!! A much improved 21.2% K Rate for a Slugger type player. As good an upside as any one in the system not name Buxton or Sano - based on impact this season and teams winning percentage.

Edited by lightfoot789, 18 August 2013 - 12:27 AM.


#7 Larsbars08

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Posted 18 August 2013 - 12:34 AM

If you think a pitcher doesn't deserve it because they only pitch every 5 days or have limited innings out of the bullpen, I can understand that. I disagree but I understand that. I don't understand the idea that some of the pitchers haven't been dominant.

For instance Zach Jones has a 1.81 ERA in 44IP with 24H and 62K's. That's means he's giving up a hit once every other inning and half the time his fielders don't even get to play because he's striking batters out at such an astounding clip. It doesn't get much more dominant than that. Frankly I don't get what he's still doing in Fort Myers.

Tyler Jones has been nearly as dominant. Tonkin might be more dominant.

Another pitcher that deserves consideration is Andrew Albers. He has a 2.28 ERA in 132IP with a 1.179 WHIP and 116K's (7.9/9IP).


I should have been more specific. Andrew Albers is someone I overlooked, he's been excellent, he definitely deserves Twins minor league pitcher of the year. I think starters absolutely deserve consideration. However, I don't really think relievers deserve real consideration. They are important pieces, but the lack of innings pitched, compared to a starter and how much a position player plays, is too much to overcome. Maybe you disagree with me. I'm not trying to malign relievers, but I really don't think they deserve the Twins minor league player of the year award over any half a dozen other guys who have had great seasons. My overall point, is that the three guys I mentioned have had truly great seasons, while mostly playing every day. Albers comes close, but even so I don't think he's been as dominant as Buxton or Colabello.

Edit: It just occurred to me, don't the Twins have minor league hitter of the year and minor league pitcher of the year? If they do, than this whole argument is kind of moot, and we're just rehashing the MVP debate for the Twins minor league system.

Edited by Larsbars08, 18 August 2013 - 12:42 AM.


#8 diehardtwinsfan

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Posted 18 August 2013 - 05:36 AM

My arguement for Adam Brett Walker II is that although he didn't play at 2 levels - He did most of his damage after Buxton and Hicks left Cedar Rapids. He is a huge reason that the CR Kernels are 30 games above .500 and have sported a better record during the second half of the season as opposed to the first half. The Kernels are still loaded but no one would deny that they were more loaded during the 1st half of season. Great season either way. He is ranked in the Midwest League in several categories:
2nd - Runs / 1st - HRs / 1st - RBI / 1st - SLG% / 1st - Total Bases / 3rd - OPS / 62 XBH / Never caught stealing as a pro!! A much improved 21.2% K Rate for a Slugger type player. As good an upside as any one in the system not name Buxton or Sano - based on impact this season and teams winning percentage.


I haven't paid that close attention to him, but that certainly is encouraging. I remember Law kind of slamming the Twins for keeping him down, but he also said Walker isn't a very good prospect. Cutting down the Ks will go a long way to him turning into something workable at the MLB level.

#9 Thrylos

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Posted 18 August 2013 - 09:19 AM

There others who are having great seasons, but Sano had a historic season, objectively.

Analysis and argument here (kind of long and there are objective measures involved...)
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#10 Oxtung

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Posted 18 August 2013 - 10:05 AM

I should have been more specific. Andrew Albers is someone I overlooked, he's been excellent, he definitely deserves Twins minor league pitcher of the year. I think starters absolutely deserve consideration. However, I don't really think relievers deserve real consideration. They are important pieces, but the lack of innings pitched, compared to a starter and how much a position player plays, is too much to overcome. Maybe you disagree with me. I'm not trying to malign relievers, but I really don't think they deserve the Twins minor league player of the year award over any half a dozen other guys who have had great seasons. My overall point, is that the three guys I mentioned have had truly great seasons, while mostly playing every day. Albers comes close, but even so I don't think he's been as dominant as Buxton or Colabello.

Edit: It just occurred to me, don't the Twins have minor league hitter of the year and minor league pitcher of the year? If they do, than this whole argument is kind of moot, and we're just rehashing the MVP debate for the Twins minor league system.


I can understand your point about relievers vs. everyday players. I'm not sure where I fall. My only problem with your previous post was your statement about pitchers not having dominant seasons.

#11 big dog

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 07:37 AM

Reading these posts has been encouraging enough that I have put aside the last four days' of ineptitude at the ML level. What a great problem to have- which potential stud deserves to be Player of the Year? I don't remember a group this strong in the minors since the early 80s, and this group compares better, at least to me.

#12 amjgt

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 11:28 AM

There others who are having great seasons, but Sano had a historic season, objectively.

Analysis and argument here (kind of long and there are objective measures involved...)

That was a good article and I agree with the conclusion that Sano is the minor league POY, but is completely disregards one of Buxton's best tools and Sano's weakest tools.... Defense

#13 SD Buhr

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 12:07 PM

That was a good article and I agree with the conclusion that Sano is the minor league POY, but is completely disregards one of Buxton's best tools and Sano's weakest tools.... Defense


Exactly.

Thrylos. you wrap up your aticle by saying, "I just cannot see how objectively anyone can justify ranking Buxton higher than Sano..."

You can't see it because you don't even mention or, apparently, consider defensive contributions or abilities. Sano, while apparently improved over the past year, is a mediocre (or worse) corner infielder. He's as likely to cost his team runs with his glove as he is to prevent them. Buxton is an elite fielder at a premium defensive position. Unless the only "objective" measurements you consider are those that go in to wRC+, Buxton absolutely deserves equal consideration in any discussion of POY with Sano.

However, with all due respect to the other excellent players mentioned in this thread, I can't see ranking any of them higher than 3rd, behind Sano and Buxton in some order as 1 and 2. They have had elite seasons playing at levels above their chronological ages.

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#14 Mr. Brooks

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 01:57 PM

Yeah, that's funny that anyone would dismiss an argument for either Sano or Buxton. I don't see how you can call an argument for either one wrong.
My vote would be for Buxton, but I trust that the guys who see them on a daily basis will make the right call.

#15 AROG

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 03:13 PM

For me it is a two way race for first place. Between Buxton and Albers. Both have had remarkable years. Buxton across two levels which is always difficult. Buxton also plays a huge roll as the CF and steals a ton of bases so he makes it easier for the guys to hit while he is on base. Albers is in the top ten of most pitching categories for the league. And the only Twin that is close. Gibson was somewhat close but Albers had better numbers then Gibson when Gibson was called up.

For me it is:
1. Buxton
2. Albers
3. Sano

P.S. Walker is a good player but playing at his level age wise and his BA is still a little lower then I would like. Also, he is prone to long droughts as he did in June I believe, but he would be 4th or 5th for me. Still a great year.

#16 lightfoot789

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 04:14 PM

I agree with Buxton and Sano being premier players and thier accomplishments are excellent for any level. Walker however keeps getting judged as if he was 23 or 24 years old. He is 21 years old. That could put him in the league at age 24 if he progresses at current pace. I just love how he sits at the top of so many categories in the MWL on a team that lost so many players to promotions.