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At what point?

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#1 Terry Tiffee

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Posted 07 April 2012 - 11:38 PM

Does Gardenhire go on the proverbial hot seat? Before I explain, I should probably make it clear I'm not trying to be one of those fans that overreacts over 2 games, but with his playoff failures, and now the fact that the wheels are starting to come off (based on last year), at what point do you think the team would think about making a change? I like Gardy, but it almost seems like his act is starting to wear thin, and sometimes change is a good thing. Just curious to get your thoughts. I think, and hope, he lasts the whole year. Midseason firings normally don't benefit anybody, really.

#2 JB_Iowa

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Posted 08 April 2012 - 10:16 AM

I don't see him going on the hot seat (more's the pity). Ryan had to know that they have a mediocre team at best. If Mauer and Morneau start performing like their "old" (pre-injury) selves but the surrounding players don't support them, it still seems like more of a Ryan failure than a Gardenhire one. But I doubt that either of them would lose their jobs -- and never at mid-season. After the season, the team might gracefully find a way for them to exit (a la Ryan's 1st retirement).

#3 John Bonnes

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Posted 08 April 2012 - 10:21 AM

48 hours ago I would have thought that Gardy was safe for as long as he wanted. But now I'm wondering. It's a nebulous answer, but it depends how the team looks as much as the results. If they look ugly, you never know. Things could go south much faster than I would have thought.

#4 whydidnt

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Posted 08 April 2012 - 10:27 AM

I hope it doesn't happen. But, if the Twins lose close to 100 games again this year, then it sure should happen. That means that the Twins have had a payroll in the top 1/2 of the league for 2 straight years, and turned it into 2 of the worst results in team history. Someone has to take the blame and it only makes sense that the manager shares in that. I would imagine if we end up there again, Gardy himself might want to consider a change, I don't think he had a lot of fun last year.

#5 mnfireman

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Posted 08 April 2012 - 10:30 AM

Ryan overhauled the roster, but was limited by budget. Gardy continuosly runs the same guys out there with no accountability. Glad too see Valencia get benched after yesterday, sit him for a couple games. Revere is (pick your Gardy favorite from the past) but because he hits .300 its ok. No its not and the argument that a single or BB is the same as a double or triple is not valid because doubles and triples drive in runs and you can't steal a base if its occupied by someone else. Trade some of these OF prospects for pitching help and look to the future, this season could be painful.

#6 spideyo

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Posted 08 April 2012 - 10:51 AM

While the players haven't been doing great, I actually think Gardy has made some decent coaching moves so far. After Doumit turned a fly ball into a triple, he didn't start the next game. Valencia had a rough game, and Casilla hasn't been hitting, and they are sitting today. These are the kinds of things that a manager can control. He can't make guys hit better, he can't make guys play better. But he can hold them accountable, and pull them when they are not doing well.

#7 denarded

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Posted 08 April 2012 - 11:22 AM

I know the poster said "It's only 2 games" but I can't believe were 2 games in and have threads on "Fire Gardy" and "Panic Yet" Sheesh...I thought this place would be a little more positive/realistic than BYTO. Same delusionals, different url.
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#8 gunnarthor

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Posted 08 April 2012 - 11:23 AM

Does Gardenhire go on the proverbial hot seat?

Before I explain, I should probably make it clear I'm not trying to be one of those fans that overreacts over 2 games, but with his playoff failures, and now the fact that the wheels are starting to come off (based on last year), at what point do you think the team would think about making a change? I like Gardy, but it almost seems like his act is starting to wear thin, and sometimes change is a good thing.

Just curious to get your thoughts. I think, and hope, he lasts the whole year. Midseason firings normally don't benefit anybody, really.


He's not in the hot seat. Ryan and the Pohlad's aren't going to fire him. The Twins very rarely fire anyone and Gardy's been a very good manager.

#9 Terry Tiffee

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Posted 08 April 2012 - 12:03 PM

I know the poster said "It's only 2 games" but I can't believe were 2 games in and have threads on "Fire Gardy" and "Panic Yet" Sheesh...I thought this place would be a little more positive/realistic than BYTO. Same delusionals, different url.


Not delusional. What's delusional is letting a manager continue to get a free pass with a historically bad playoff record.

#10 Terry Tiffee

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Posted 08 April 2012 - 12:05 PM

He's not in the hot seat. Ryan and the Pohlad's aren't going to fire him. The Twins very rarely fire anyone and Gardy's been a very good manager.


He's won crappy divisions and has embarrassed himself and the team in the playoffs. "Very good manager" might be a little generous.

#11 Thrylos

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Posted 08 April 2012 - 12:08 PM

I thought this place would be a little more positive/realistic than BYTO. Same delusionals, different url.


Positive and realistic sometimes are not the same, unfortunately.

As far as the original question goes: I think that Gardy is already on the hot seat and if the Twins do not make the post-season (given the dismal performance the last few seasons) I think he (and Ryan) are goners.
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#12 Terry Tiffee

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Posted 08 April 2012 - 12:09 PM

Positive and realistic sometimes are not the same, unfortunately.

As far as the original question goes: I think that Gardy is already on the hot seat and if the Twins do not make the post-season (given the dismal performance the last few seasons) I think he (and Ryan) are goners.


In most organizations, I'd agree. I have a hard time seeing the Pohlads pull the trigger, though, which frustrates me.

#13 gunnarthor

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Posted 08 April 2012 - 12:11 PM

He's won crappy divisions and has embarrassed himself and the team in the playoffs. "Very good manager" might be a little generous.


No, it's not. And, more importantly, the front office understands that.

#14 Terry Tiffee

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Posted 08 April 2012 - 12:15 PM

Grow up? LOL, just trying to have intelligent Twins conversation... You can partake at any time.

#15 Kneelb4zerg

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Posted 08 April 2012 - 12:54 PM

Grow up? LOL, just trying to have intelligent Twins conversation... You can partake at any time.

OK genius, tell me how changing managers will make one damn bit of difference. Tony LaRussa combined with the ghosts of Connie Mack and Earl Weaver can't make a bad team good.

#16 Billy Bremner

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Posted 08 April 2012 - 12:55 PM

48 hours ago I would have thought that Gardy was safe for as long as he wanted. But now I'm wondering. It's a nebulous answer, but it depends how the team looks as much as the results. If they look ugly, you never know. Things could go south much faster than I would have thought.


Although I think it's less than 50/50 that this will happen, this is the most likely scenario, speaking possibilities-wise.

#17 VodkaDave

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Posted 08 April 2012 - 01:09 PM

Sweet thread. Is this your first year watching baseball or something?

#18 Montecore

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Posted 08 April 2012 - 02:02 PM

Be real nice to see them get rid of him, now, after this stirring nearly no-hit loss. Whatever managerial intangibles spur players on - he lost a long time ago. He should have gotten the ax six years ago. He's a very stupid man, and if they do start off 0-10 - the pressure will build and all the Gardy antics in the world won't save him. They need new blood at the helm, and in the front office. It's gotta happen, or the franchise will lose its value appreciably.

#19 Highabove

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Posted 08 April 2012 - 02:04 PM

I think the Twins Organization starting with the Owner, is the one that is on the hot seat.

#20 nova_twins

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Posted 08 April 2012 - 02:05 PM

Managers start getting heat early in the season all the time. They generally shouldn't, but it does happen. One series is nothing but a bad April could turn it into a legitimate issue. I personally don't think it really matters, but many in the media and fan base think otherwise.

#21 twinstalker

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Posted 08 April 2012 - 02:36 PM

This isn't a Gardenhire-only problem, we're just lucky enough to have a consistently horrible manager who, when he finally has bad teams, leaves us with no delusions as to whether the Twins might actually be good. Thank you, Ron, you make everything crystal clear.

#22 Terry Tiffee

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Posted 08 April 2012 - 03:23 PM

Sweet thread. Is this your first year watching baseball or something?


Heaven forbid anyone demands some accountability around here... Keep making wise ass comments without adding anything into the thread.

#23 twinstalker

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Posted 08 April 2012 - 03:31 PM

Be real nice to see them get rid of him, now, after this stirring nearly no-hit loss. Whatever managerial intangibles spur players on - he lost a long time ago. He should have gotten the ax six years ago. He's a very stupid man, and if they do start off 0-10 - the pressure will build and all the Gardy antics in the world won't save him. They need new blood at the helm, and in the front office. It's gotta happen, or the franchise will lose its value appreciably.

I don't trust that the ownership has any clue as to how to go about doing the right thing. I basically agree with you, I just don't think it will help. And you should have written this Friday morning, because declaring the sky is falling after three losses is both easy and non-credible. Again, not that I disagree with you.

#24 Terry Tiffee

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Posted 08 April 2012 - 03:32 PM

I'd hate to move on from Gardy only to replace him with someone like Ullger... If you fire Gardy, you need new blood to come in.

#25 Boom Boom

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Posted 08 April 2012 - 03:51 PM

Consider the circumstances of the Bill Smith firing - they fire their GM and replace him with the guy who was GM before and had been in Smith's ear on every single move he made. Then they rehire Smith as an adviser. Even when the Twins did eventually fire someone, they did it in a half-hearted kind of way. I truly believe that on any other team Gardy would already be on the hot seat, but with the Twins, the only one who can make Gardy not the manager anymore is Gardy himself.

#26 Riverbrian

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Posted 08 April 2012 - 04:50 PM

With another 90 loss season. Gardy will be respectfully let go with a very pleasent news conference. Everyone will say how much they enjoyed working together. Tears will be shed and a new manager with a new direction will be in place for next year. Gardy will get a job if he wants managing a different team almost immediately and Rick Anderson will follow him. The Mets would be my first guess.

#27 Land Of 10,000 Beasts

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Posted 08 April 2012 - 05:08 PM

The Twins have a lack of talent. That isn't Gardy's fault. Half of our team belongs in Rochester. If we have success this season, it will be because of team chemistry and great coaching, which I think Gardy can provide.

#28 ashburyjohn

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Posted 08 April 2012 - 05:18 PM

The Twins have a lack of talent. That isn't Gardy's fault. Half of our team belongs in Rochester.


Then Gardy should do great if he's sent down there too. :)

#29 roger

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Posted 08 April 2012 - 06:21 PM

48 hours ago I would have thought that Gardy was safe for as long as he wanted. But now I'm wondering. It's a nebulous answer, but it depends how the team looks as much as the results. If they look ugly, you never know. Things could go south much faster than I would have thought.


John, I believe if this team has another 99 loss season, we won't have to worry about Gardy. He will retire either towards the end of this season or after the season. This type of losing gets to him and he will exit without being fired.

#30 roger

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Posted 08 April 2012 - 06:22 PM

I'd hate to move on from Gardy only to replace him with someone like Ullger... If you fire Gardy, you need new blood to come in.


I love the new guy in Rochester. Now they are playing small ball!