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Zulgad: Twins Have A Plan

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#1 John Bonnes

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 03:12 PM

Second story we've seen in a week that basically points out that Ryan got the big stuff (high-upside high-minors starting pitching) right even if 2013 looks kind of dismal. I guess. I'd still maintain it wasn't an either/or scenario. Zulgad compares the Twins to football teams, as is his want....

If the Minnesota Twins are smart, they will spend this spring pointing to the Vikings and saying, "Look, see how quickly a turnaround can take place."


The thought from this corner entering the Vikings season was that Frazier would win about four games. That thought obviously turned out to be very wrong.


I think it's becoming en vogue to swim against the stream when it comes to being pessimistic about the 2013 season. Maybe that's just spring talking. Or maybe it's the Vikings season that just ended. Or maybe it's just the pivot that sportswriters like to take to keep things fresh.

But I gotta say - I think this is going to be one pretty dismal season if one focuses on the results. The stories that will be worth following will be individual. And let's not forget that if either of these high minors arms struggles - or worse yet is injured - the hope that is being sold is going to look awfully silly.

Zulgad: Twins might be a year away but at least there is now a clear plan | 1500 ESPN Twin Cities ? Minnesota Sports News & Opinion (Twins, Vikings, Wolves, Wild, Gophers) | Sportswire: Minnesota Twins

#2 TheLeviathan

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 03:58 PM

There is a pretty big difference between football and baseball. Teams are regularly swapping spots in football and there is almost perennially a team that goes worst-to-first in a division. It's just apples and oranges and I wish people would stop making that comp.

#3 mike wants wins

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 04:52 PM

The Vikings added a big time starting left tackle, got two starting corners back on the field, a legit starting safety, the best kicker in the league, and added two new back up corners. What, exactly, did the twins do that is like that?

#4 snepp

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 05:00 PM

The Vikings added a big time starting left tackle, got two starting corners back on the field, a legit starting safety, the best kicker in the league, and added two new back up corners. What, exactly, did the twins do that is like that?


http://a.espncdn.com...png&w=350&h=254



No?

#5 whatever54

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 05:16 PM

Even then for the Vikings to pull off a 10 win season, a bunch of things all had to fall there way, not the least of which was AD's remarkable recovery. For the Twins to have a similar turnaround, a lot of marginal players would have to have career years and then some. Well spring is the time of year for optimism, so I guess we can hope for a little while.

#6 danbo

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 07:03 PM

All we need is Morny to come in with a BIG start.

#7 Chip Chipperson

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 07:05 PM

All we need is Morny to come in with a BIG start.


To increase what we'll get for him in a trade?

#8 Badsmerf

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 07:26 PM

Twins media machine working its magic. Love seeing articles like this.
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#9 beckmt

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 07:27 PM

What happens to Morneau depends on how he does and how Parmalee performs. If Parmalee fails and Morneau has a good start maybe Morneau is extended and Parmalee goes away. This is certainly possible.

#10 Seth Stohs

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 07:30 PM

The Vikings added a big time starting left tackle, got two starting corners back on the field, a legit starting safety, the best kicker in the league, and added two new back up corners. What, exactly, did the twins do that is like that?


They got the big time left tackle in this year's draft, that legit starting safety in the late first round of this year's draft, that top kicker in this year's draft, and two of the corners in the draft, not to mention Jarius Wright who showed some talent when playing. Guys got healthy... the Twins could get some pitchers back (Gibson, Hendriks, Pelfrey, Worley, Harden)...

The difference is that the draft in baseball generally takes 5-7 years to show its effectiveness. That's the factor.

They Vikings also got some improved play from quite a few players on the lines, and in various phases. The Twins are also hoping that a few of their players step up and improve.

#11 edavis0308

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 07:33 PM

I don't know how it ended up ranking for difficulty, but wouldn't they have played an Easier schedule last year for being terrible the year before?

#12 TheLeviathan

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 07:42 PM

The difference is that the draft in baseball generally takes 5-7 years to show its effectiveness. That's the factor.


Right, hence why any comparisons are ridiculous. In a longer season a team's major, glaring weaknesses get exposed more often. Hell, there are probably at least a dozen reasons this comparison is ridiculous. If the Twins are somehow able to compete this year it will share nothing with how the Vikings did the same. The two sports are apples and oranges.

#13 Thrylos

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 07:45 PM

Zulgad writes about the only sport he cares about again... FB
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Blogging Twins since 2007 at The Tenth Inning Stretch
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#14 ashburyjohn

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 07:57 PM

I'd still maintain it wasn't an either/or scenario.


I'll be repeating myself to say more than just "yes". But, yes.

#15 JB_Iowa

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 08:07 PM

I'm getting dizzy from all the spinning. And have a feeling the earth may shake when the spin-meisters all go kerplunk in April.

#16 Mark_RM

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 08:42 PM

My opinion of Zulgad dipped a bit with his football/baseball comparison. Besides, too many facts to the contrary to drink the "Twins have a chance this year" koolaid

Edited by Mark_RM, 13 February 2013 - 08:47 PM.


#17 ND-Fan

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 09:10 PM

The Twins don't believe it themselves why do think there are so much press on Twins Farm system. They cann't sell this team but they are sure trying to sell the future with potential stars in their minor league system. It didn't have to be this way with the room they have in salary budget compared two years ago. They could have funded shortterm replacements until these kids were ready from the farm system. Instead were left with one or two years thrown away and waste of Mauer being in peak years plus several other quality players. Its cheapest and least risk wise from business standpoint in that they are going to have very nice rate of return on their investment. I still think its going to cost them money from future revenues because the brand of Twins will not have the same value if we experience 100 loss season and could do so again in the following year.

#18 notoriousgod71

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 09:16 PM

Even then for the Vikings to pull off a 10 win season, a bunch of things all had to fall there way, not the least of which was AD's remarkable recovery. For the Twins to have a similar turnaround, a lot of marginal players would have to have career years and then some. Well spring is the time of year for optimism, so I guess we can hope for a little while.


AD's season was like if Mauer suddenly bats .400 with 40 homeruns.

#19 edavis0308

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 09:19 PM

AD's season was like if Mauer suddenly bats .400 with 40 homeruns.

And wins ten games as a pitcher.

#20 Winston Smith

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 09:20 PM

It seems like a lot of guys making sure they keep a spot in the twins press box buffett line.

May all our prospects be All Stars and the beer be free.


#21 IdahoPilgrim

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 09:49 PM

I have to say I find it interesting to compare the mood on this site today with what I saw last fall. If I recall correctly, the majority of the posters were saying that next year (2013) doesn't matter and the front office shouldn't worry about trying to contend short-term, and instead should focus on contending in 2014 and 2015.

Now, people are mad because, in their view, the front office isn't trying to put a quality product on the field this year and is looking ahead too much to 2014 and 2015.

I'm not sure what to make of this.

#22 johnnydakota

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 10:03 PM

Gee what i took from the article was, that the Vikings improved once they got a new general manager.....
some thing to think about

#23 twinsnorth49

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 10:05 PM

Curious that there was no mention of the large payroll drop and it being the reason most people believed this could be a try to compete year, as well as a rebuild year. He seems to place most of the emphasis for not being competitive in 2013 on the trading of Span and Revere as opposed to not bothering to try to spend any money on decent pitching and a little MI depth.

The prediction for a "greatly" improved team by 2014 is drinking the Kool-Aid while wearing your rose coloured glasses. Just a poor article overall.

#24 Kwak

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 10:12 PM

"Talk of building a staff around pitch to contact should be long gone." So many ways to respond: a) should have happened years ago; b)none of these guys have pitched for the Twins yet so we can't be sure of that; c) who will be managing the team when they all get to the Twins?; d) what's the backup plan if someone fails? As far as I'm concerned the only thing that can be said about PtoC is that it won't be stated as the Twins' philosophy anymore.

"Starting pitching is the hardest thing to find and Ryan knows the best way to go about obtaining it isn't to dip into an expensive free-agent market." So many responses.
A poorly written sentence. The writer starts to tell us Ryan knows the "best way", but doesn't--he simply claims that signing expensive free-agents isn't the "best way"--with nothing to support that conclusion. This off-season several inexpensive free-agents were signed, are we to infer that that is the best way? Or should Mackey (and Ryan) just state "we're blowing-off 2013 and hoping to lose enough games in order to select the guy in the 2014 Draft that will right this ship and get us going full speed ahead".

#25 drivlikejehu

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 11:17 PM

The Pirates have been rebuilding for what, 20+ years? The Twins have dug a seriously deep hole that will not be easy to climb out of. There is zero evidence they have a "plan," other maybe than praying none of their few pitching prospects get hurt.

Indeed, their actions tend to indicate the exact opposite of a plan. Trading away a young outfielder, but holding onto Willingham? Writing off 2013 but overpaying Correia? The kool-aid drinkers will always be there, but the reality just isn't good.

#26 LoganJones

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 12:02 PM

There was exactly 1 reason the Vikes made the playoffs. Adrian Peterson. The guy dominated enough games that they outlasted a couple other teams for that bottom playoff spot.
This is something that every single MLB team can dream of now. Getting a chance to play the WC game in an integrated league will not require as many wins. Integrating the leagues like this will minimize the interleague effects, and suppress AL records a few games. The bottom wild card spot might even go to a team with 85 wins. Who knows? Sure that means a 22 game improvement for the Twins. When does that happen? Just about every single year, actually. Twice last year to two teams that had "no talent" at the beginning of the year.

This is about the 'plan' though. The plan the Twins have to build for the future while having enough MLB players to get lucky in a down year, and buy at the deadline.

#27 Badsmerf

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 12:14 PM

I have to say I find it interesting to compare the mood on this site today with what I saw last fall. If I recall correctly, the majority of the posters were saying that next year (2013) doesn't matter and the front office shouldn't worry about trying to contend short-term, and instead should focus on contending in 2014 and 2015.

Now, people are mad because, in their view, the front office isn't trying to put a quality product on the field this year and is looking ahead too much to 2014 and 2015.

I'm not sure what to make of this.


Disagree. The mood was positive because JR made a few nice trades and had a lot of money to spend and make the team better. Problem is that he used it to sign a bottom feeding starting pitcher and nothing else despite cheap contracts being handed out to guys that would help this team. Everyone has a right to be upset he didn't do more to help the 2013 Twins... including the current players on the 25-man roster.
Do or do not. There is no try.

#28 old nurse

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 12:16 PM

Baseball and football work very differently in terms of adding talent. The left tackle, safety and kicker all came through a draft that adds immediate talent. The corners you mentions all got torched in the playoffs. Those were added through free agency. Therein lies the problem of free agency in picking up what was discarded.

#29 twinsfaninsaudi

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 12:24 PM

[QUOTE=...let's not forget that if either of these high minors arms struggles - or worse yet is injured - the hope that is being sold is going to look awfully silly. [/QUOTE]

Awww, why do you gotta say that?

#30 mike wants wins

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 03:25 PM

Ugh...... This myth that any free agency is a bad idea is so tired. How do you feel about Antoine Winfield, or CC sabbathia. Yea, some guys bust, so do draft picks. There is no one right channel for adding talent. Sano was essentially a free agent....how do you feel about him?