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Twins drop Rochester as AAA affiliate, Pensacola also may be gone

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#1 Nine of twelve

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Posted 10 November 2020 - 06:15 PM

This is a piece by LEN III lifted from the StarTribune web site.


https://m.startribun...ment/573034791/

Edited by Hosken Bombo Disco, 10 November 2020 - 10:06 PM.
Revising to comply with Fair Use

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#2 IndianaTwin

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Posted 10 November 2020 - 11:53 PM

If Pensacola ends up with Miami, has there been any speculation where the Twins would go? 

 

Bummer — I was looking forward to going to Pensacola. Still can, but the draw would be less. 

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#3 h2oface

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Posted 11 November 2020 - 04:11 AM

Loyalty is a thing of the past. I like the Saints being an independent league team.

I vote Sioux Falls.


#4 Rosterman

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Posted 11 November 2020 - 09:50 AM

I'm not sure the status of Indy Ball going forward. Will have more oversite as MLB takes over some areas as tryout leagues, or extended leagues. Be interesting to see how this all plays out.

 

The rumble is that Ft. Myers will become Low-A ball, which works well with the training camp. Does that make Cedar Rapids High-A Ball.

 

Gotta see how all the different KEPT teams play out as they look at schedules, travel...and hopefully increased pay for most minor league players. 

 

I look at the Saints, though, and wonder where the players playing there will live. It's not like St. Paul is just a small town in itself, but a major metropolis. 

 

$20 million needs to be paid by someone!

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#5 USAFChief

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Posted 11 November 2020 - 10:02 AM

Having the AAA team across the river in St Paul has always seemed like a no brainer.

Do it.

As for fewer minor league teams, this has been a trend for decades.
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#6 rdehring

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Posted 11 November 2020 - 10:02 AM

Would be thrilled to have the Twins AAA team in St. Paul. Would certainly go to a few games every summer, assuming they have some day games.

 

Expect the Twins will have to contribute part of the entrance fee. Do they end up with a small part of the ownership? No question they would have a substantial travel savings not having players and others flying back and forth to Rochester.

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#7 ashbury

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Posted 11 November 2020 - 10:07 AM

Having the AAA team across the river in St Paul has always seemed like a no brainer.

Do it.

It's a question of money. There is no AAA team in St Paul to switch to. Organized ball requires something like a $20M payment (going from memory, someone else can fact-check) for a franchise to be granted, and the ballpark also has to be upgraded to certain minimums such as seating capacity.

 

The Saints are playing a game of chicken, which they may well win, by wringing some concessions from the team to foot the bill at least partially for these things. If they overplay their hand, somewhere else might still wind up being the destination.

 

Geographically it may be a no-brainer, but some brains are still going to be needed to make it actually come about.
 

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#8 Vanimal46

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Posted 11 November 2020 - 10:13 AM

Pretty sure Seth Stohs just put his house up for sale and looking for studio apartments in downtown St. Paul. 

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#9 DocBauer

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Posted 11 November 2020 - 12:42 PM

No offense to Rochester, who by all accounts I've ever read have treated the Twins well and do a great job, it just never felt like a good fit. I mean, didn't they sell something like 2-1 Yankees merchandise vs Red Wings in the pro shop?

Sorry to see Pensacola go if true. Seems we just arrived and the park looks great.

Assuming St Paul takes over for one location, really interested who becomes the remaining affiliate. Any thoughts or rumors?
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#10 nicksaviking

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Posted 11 November 2020 - 06:28 PM

 

Loyalty is a thing of the past. I like the Saints being an independent league team.

I vote Sioux Falls.

 

Sioux Falls barely draws 2K fans per game. I don't think they were ever really an option, I'd guess the rumors are just leverage to get the Saints on board.

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#11 lecroy24fan

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Posted 11 November 2020 - 07:17 PM

 

 the ballpark also has to be upgraded to certain minimums such as seating capacity.

 

 

 

 

Lavelle's article says the seating minimum will be waived because the Saints are a top drawing team.


#12 Nine of twelve

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Posted 11 November 2020 - 07:59 PM

 

Lavelle's article says the seating minimum will be waived because the Saints are a top drawing team.

CHS Field was designed to accommodate expansion.


#13 Nine of twelve

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Posted 11 November 2020 - 08:12 PM

 

Loyalty is a thing of the past. I like the Saints being an independent league team.

I vote Sioux Falls.

Other than St. Paul, the only city in the 5-state area that could possibly support a AAA team is Des Moines and there is no chance that the Cubs are looking to end their 40-year relationship with that city. Some will claim that Madison could support a AAA team, but this is not a thing. Madison can't even support a Midwest League team. Moreover, if Madison were a viable location the Brewers would be all over it. Proposals for a AAA team anywhere else in the upper midwest are laughable.


#14 lecroy24fan

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Posted 11 November 2020 - 09:35 PM

 

CHS Field was designed to accommodate expansion.

Yes but nobody is going to pay for that right now.


#15 ToddlerHarmon

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Posted 11 November 2020 - 11:07 PM

 

Yes but nobody is going to pay for that right now.

 

Maybe this is the way out of both boxes. The Saints "give" MiLB $20M, and MiLB "invests" $20M in adding seating capacity to CHS :)

 

Seriously, I would love to follow Twins prospects from home, the Twins save on costs and improve their coaching access, and I think it gives the Saints long term security that the independent leagues can't provide. I gotta think it happens

 

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#16 IndianaTwin

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Posted 11 November 2020 - 11:54 PM

If you're looking for nearby and are discounting Des Moines and Omaha because of their long histories with the Cubs and Royals, the best choice after St. Paul may actually be Grand Rapids, Mich. It's the 51st largest metro area in the country, with Lansing (103rd) and Kalamazoo (184th) and popular vacation spots nearby, and several 90-minute Delta flights to MSP per day.

 

It also would be more convenient to the IL, with teams in Indianapolis, Toledo, and Columbus. St. Paul isn't that great of a fit with AAA. Aside from Des Moines and Omaha, they're all long flights to the rest of the PCL or the IL. 

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#17 rdehring

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Posted 12 November 2020 - 12:22 PM

 

Other than St. Paul, the only city in the 5-state area that could possibly support a AAA team is Des Moines and there is no chance that the Cubs are looking to end their 40-year relationship with that city. Some will claim that Madison could support a AAA team, but this is not a thing. Madison can't even support a Midwest League team. Moreover, if Madison were a viable location the Brewers would be all over it. Proposals for a AAA team anywhere else in the upper midwest are laughable.

As a former minority owner of the Madison Muskies, the A's affiliate back in the early 80's, I can assure you that a AAA team would be a non-starter in Mad City.

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#18 Cap'n Piranha

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Posted 12 November 2020 - 04:45 PM

I don't think the Twins spend all that much on travel to Rochester; a quick google flights search shows first class tickets to Rochester are $500 to $600 a pop.It's about half that for coach (which I'm sure players and lower level staff are getting).That means even if the Twins have 300 round trips from MSP to ROC a year, it's only $150k to $180k a year if every single trip is first class.For an organization with somewhere around $250M to $300M a year in revenue, that's not a significant amount (it's akin to a person making $60k a year saving $35 to $45 a year).

 

Do the Twins save money?Sure.But it's not like doing this allows them to start bidding for Gerrit Cole or anything.The only real benefit is travel savings, and the ability to more closely monitor players; those actually might be significant advantages.


#19 nowheresville

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Posted 13 November 2020 - 10:56 AM

 

If Pensacola ends up with Miami, has there been any speculation where the Twins would go? 

 

To me, this is the interesting question that I haven't seen any sort of even rumors about.

 

AAA seems to be pretty much locked in - it will almost certainly be either St. Paul or Wichita. 

 

AA is the oddball, because it's not like there's really a way to improve the geography. Between the 3 leagues, Eastern, Southern, and Texas, even the closest teams to MN are only marginally closer than Pensacola and usually already have a "local" team, like the Cardinals in Springfield MO or Cleveland in Akron. 

 

There's likely to be some other changes coming - the whole reason Miami is thought to be moving into Pensacola is because their current AA team, jacksonville is rumored to be moving up to AAA. Chattanooga had also been on the contraction list, so presumably there will be another couple cities (probably from the Sally or Carolina Leagues) that will be promoted from A ball to AA but there's no obvious fit for the Twins


#20 IndianaTwin

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Posted 13 November 2020 - 12:33 PM

 

To me, this is the interesting question that I haven't seen any sort of even rumors about.

 

AAA seems to be pretty much locked in - it will almost certainly be either St. Paul or Wichita. 

 

AA is the oddball, because it's not like there's really a way to improve the geography. Between the 3 leagues, Eastern, Southern, and Texas, even the closest teams to MN are only marginally closer than Pensacola and usually already have a "local" team, like the Cardinals in Springfield MO or Cleveland in Akron. 

 

There's likely to be some other changes coming - the whole reason Miami is thought to be moving into Pensacola is because their current AA team, jacksonville is rumored to be moving up to AAA. Chattanooga had also been on the contraction list, so presumably there will be another couple cities (probably from the Sally or Carolina Leagues) that will be promoted from A ball to AA but there's no obvious fit for the Twins

 

It would be a slap in the face to Rochester, which has had AAA for such a long time, but if St. Paul is added as a AAA team, some other city has to lose a team. In addition to the continuity factor, Rochester as the AA team would be a fit geographically as an addition to the Eastern League if another team gets dropped. The Yankees have named that they are moving out of Trenton, for example. 

 

You're right, there's not a good fit geographically, however, given that AA is the Eastern, Southern, and Texas Leagues.

 

Then again, maybe names don't matter -- I'm looking at you, Memphis of the Pacific Coast League.

 

Has any site made a map or list of these rumors and what deals have been committed to for 2021?