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Mackey: Twins Likely Done Making Significant Moves this Year

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#1 East Coast Twin

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 06:04 AM

An interesting quote by Terry Ryan.

"'We've got to start being realistic . . . [a]nd realistic is, in September, (playing) meaningful games. You talk about winning the division -- well, we all want to do that. Postseason, we all want to do that.

'But coming off the amount of losses that we've had. . . Playing major league baseball in September when the games don't mean a thing, that's no good for anybody. We need to get to that point before we can start worrying about much of anything else.'"

Notebook: Twins Likely Done Making Significant Moves this Ooffseason

#2 Highabove

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 06:48 AM

Ryan should be congratulated for cutting the payroll by 30 million dollars. It only took him a year to do so.

#3 Top Gun

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 07:17 AM

I'm sorry to say, the Twins are a joke. SAD!

#4 Brandon

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 07:29 AM

There are plenty of players who are going to have to lower their cotract demands in the next month. i would hope the Twins do some bargain shopping as Kelly Johnson is still available and there are more relievers and Marcum is still available too.

#5 Brock Beauchamp

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 07:43 AM

Sigh... I'm not terribly surprised to read this but it's still disappointing. If the Twins are in rebuilding mode, just blow it up and give it the proper treatment. Put Morneau and Willingham on the block and be done with it.

I'm not against shying away from the FA market and slashing payroll with the clear message "we're building for 2015" but riding the fence is unacceptable. You either try to win or you blow up the roster. There's no point in trying to play both sides. It rarely (almost never) works.

#6 Winston Smith

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 08:14 AM

Very nice, another looooong season.
This comment brought to you from the Rosedale Mall studio by Hamm's Beer, brewed in the land of sky blue waters.

#7 scottz

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 08:51 AM

On the positive side, when I want to take my son to a game, we'll just be able to go down to Target Field and find tickets for dirt cheap from somebody on a street corner.

#8 nicksaviking

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 09:17 AM

I just don't understand why rebuilding requires this drastic of a payroll cut. If your concerned about signing vets that would take away playing time from young guys, they why bother signing guys like Correia? If the team admits signing Correia is a stop-gap move to keep the seat warm for the youngsters, then why not sign a better pitcher to a two year deal?

#9 ThePuck

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 09:22 AM

Sigh... I'm not terribly surprised to read this but it's still disappointing. If the Twins are in rebuilding mode, just blow it up and give it the proper treatment. Put Morneau and Willingham on the block and be done with it.

I'm not against shying away from the FA market and slashing payroll with the clear message "we're building for 2015" but riding the fence is unacceptable. You either try to win or you blow up the roster. There's no point in trying to play both sides. It rarely (almost never) works.


Unless the point is to sell as many season ticket packages as you can...the bottom line...money.

#10 70charger

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 09:23 AM

On the positive side, when I want to take my son to a game, we'll just be able to go down to Target Field and find tickets for dirt cheap from somebody on a street corner.


I'm telling ya, man, this is underrated. Granted, I'd rather be winning, but given that I live less than a mile from the field, if it's a nice night, I can just spend a few bucks and go in person. Better than the TV, and I can't tell you how many times I've ended up several rows up from the field for a very minor outlay.

#11 Nick Nelson

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 09:27 AM

"Unlike in the previous two offseasons, there will be no over-promising and under-delivering by the Minnesota Twins in 2013."

All I could think of was the "pretty darn good pitcher" quote when I read this.

In truth, I don't disagree with Ryan's quote in the original post, but that statement doesn't really jibe with his actions. He hasn't made the necessary improvements to put this club in position to be playing meaningful games in September, IMO.

#12 ThePuck

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 09:28 AM

An interesting quote by Terry Ryan.

"'We've got to start being realistic . . . [a]nd realistic is, in September, (playing) meaningful games. You talk about winning the division -- well, we all want to do that. Postseason, we all want to do that.

'But coming off the amount of losses that we've had. . . Playing major league baseball in September when the games don't mean a thing, that's no good for anybody. We need to get to that point before we can start worrying about much of anything else.'"

Notebook: Twins Likely Done Making Significant Moves this Ooffseason


Right at the beginning it said, 'Unlike in the previous two offseasons, there will be no over-promising and under-delivering by the Minnesota Twins in 2013.'

Ryan said he'd do everything he could to significantly improve the rotation during the season ticket holders conference, didn't he? Didn't he also tell us:

A: He'd do whatever he could to improve the team this offseason.

which would help him achieve plan B...

B: That his plan was to build a team to compete in 2013,

and that

C: Money wouldn't be a problem while doing both A and B?

Yet at the beginning of this article the writer says, 'Unlike in the previous two offseasons, there will be no over-promising and under-delivering by the Minnesota Twins in 2013.'

I guess, technically, the writer is correct, the promises Ryan gave us were told in calender year 2012.

Edited by ThePuck, 09 January 2013 - 09:30 AM.


#13 Boom Boom

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 09:29 AM

Unless the point is to sell as many season ticket packages as you can...the bottom line...money.


Not just season tickets, but walk-up tickets as well, especially early in the season before the team is out of it.

Personally, if the Twins went all-out rebuild, I might be more inclined to go to games to "get to know 'em" again. I may be in the minority on that.

#14 edavis0308

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 09:31 AM

I for one am just glad that our rotation is now fortified.

#15 Guest_USAFChief_*

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 09:34 AM

[h=2]Twins Likely Done Making Significant Moves this Year[/h]
I think that's just about exactly what I posted when they signed Correia.

What a sad situation. Not much hope, not much of a plan, and a primary goal of chopping payroll.

#16 edavis0308

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 09:36 AM

I hope those of you going to any of the Caravan stops have plenty of questions on hand! You can report back to us with answers given!

#17 beckmt

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 09:41 AM

Think the payroll was chopped because their was no way to build a club without spending major bucks or trading the farm system. 1 or 2 year deals for pitchers with the expectation of young pitchers coming up is the better way to go.
I don't like this way, and do wish the Twins had been more honest about the direction. The only thing I can now see is the Willingham and Morneau have very good seasons and are traded at the deadline for more upper level prospects.

#18 Boom Boom

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 09:44 AM

Think the payroll was chopped because their was no way to build a club without spending major bucks or trading the farm system. 1 or 2 year deals for pitchers with the expectation of young pitchers coming up is the better way to go.
I don't like this way, and do wish the Twins had been more honest about the direction. The only thing I can now see is the Willingham and Morneau have very good seasons and are traded at the deadline for more upper level prospects.


On Morneau, I get the idea of holding on to him until the deadline because his trade value has been low.

On Willingham, I think the time to trade him is now. His track record doesn't indicate he'll be as good as he was in 2012 in 2013. His value is higher now than it's ever been.

#19 johnnydakota

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 10:38 AM

Sigh... I'm not terribly surprised to read this but it's still disappointing. If the Twins are in rebuilding mode, just blow it up and give it the proper treatment. Put Morneau and Willingham on the block and be done with it.

I'm not against shying away from the FA market and slashing payroll with the clear message "we're building for 2015" but riding the fence is unacceptable. You either try to win or you blow up the roster. There's no point in trying to play both sides. It rarely (almost never) works.


only thing straddling the fense does is give you a case of blue balls...trying to sell 3million tickets while playing both sides will not work,
if ownership or management came out and said we are rebuilding here is a 10% ticket reduction .and we are trading everyone including joe , see you in 2/3 years i would be happier then being lied too

#20 nicksaviking

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 10:46 AM

From the Makey initerview:

"I think we've fortified the pitching staff," Ryan said. "You look at this team and I think we scored enough runs. We have enough defense, even with the loss of Revere and Span. So we're getting somewhat close to the point where we're ready to go and sort this out a little bit (at spring training)."

Perhaps it was a typo? Did Makey mean to type "forfeited the pitching staff."

Also, in what possible way does Ryan think the Twins have enough defense. This is likely a bottom five defense which doesn't go well with the intentionally constructed extreme pitch-to-contact staff.

#21 johnnydakota

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 11:02 AM

Think the payroll was chopped because their was no way to build a club without spending major bucks or trading the farm system. 1 or 2 year deals for pitchers with the expectation of young pitchers coming up is the better way to go.
I don't like this way, and do wish the Twins had been more honest about the direction. The only thing I can now see is the Willingham and Morneau have very good seasons and are traded at the deadline for more upper level prospects.

Once again i am confused, please explain to me how trading Justin at the end of july will garner us better prospects when he would only be a renta player for 2 months?...maybe im missing something?

#22 ThePuck

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 11:03 AM

From the Makey initerview:

"I think we've fortified the pitching staff," Ryan said. "You look at this team and I think we scored enough runs. We have enough defense, even with the loss of Revere and Span. So we're getting somewhat close to the point where we're ready to go and sort this out a little bit (at spring training)."

Perhaps it was a typo? Did Makey mean to type "forfeited the pitching staff."

Also, in what possible way does Ryan think the Twins have enough defense. This is likely a bottom five defense which doesn't go well with the intentionally constructed extreme pitch-to-contact staff.


This

#23 johnnydakota

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 11:11 AM

My favorite part is , we have to start being relistict,....huh ?most fans knew before you did Mr. Ryan?
We have known from the day Bill was sent to inspect toilets in South America, that payroll slashing was the major objection for this franchise

#24 Rosterman

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 11:29 AM

The issues:

TICKETS

Season ticket sales. How many will they actually have. Those are the tickets that are cheap on StubHub or outside Target Field. Again, cheap can be misleading. The expensive seats are never that cheap...yet.

But you will always be able to buy a seat for around $20 direct from the team next year.

MORNEAU

If he fits into some long-term plans, the Twins need to make a 2-3 year offer to him now at what they feel he is worth. If not, you trade him before the season starts, so another team can make him an offer or a "qualifying offer" if they feel he is worth it. It has showed this year that the new "free agency" thing isn't working...for the players...or the teams that don't want to lose a first round, or even their second round draft pick.

Will he be worth more at mid-season. Depends on who else is out of competition. But the decision ahs to be made now and we have to live with it.

Willingham would be a more likely candidate to trade mid-season and get some real value, i.e. prospects, back.

2013

If we are truly rebuilding for 2014, then 2013 will have to see a whole hsot of upcoming players on the field. Not just Hicks and Gibson, but also pushing Rosario over Dozier, Sano over Plouffe, giving Buxton a real early look, making May and Meyer part of the rotation by mid-season. Otherwise, if you wait until September or 2014 to put these guys on the field, then THAT is the rebuilding year. Anyway you look at it, 2015 would be the earliest we would see in-house excitement from the future Minnesota Twins.

FREE AGENCY

The Twins aren't players. They were lucky last year with decent contracts with Willingham and Doumit. Marquis and Zumaya were busts. Carroll was okay. But nothing cost them an arm or a leg, except perhaps Pavano and Capps.

We are all up-in-arms about money not being spent, moreso wondering where it is going. Target Field was supposed to make us competitive, not bottom feeders, in the free agency market. The Twins would be able to afford a gamble or two on a contract that may not play out. Looking at reality, the Twins could throw away $25 million, right now, today, and if it pays off...be competitive. If it doesn't, they suck, but still have stayed within their 50% payroll guidelines.

MEANINGFUL GAMES IN SEPTEMBER

That is what we all want. We want a competitive team on the field that plays well and gives us a chance of winning, at least, in the division.

Otherwise, I'm more than happy to sit amidst a bunch of empty seats and stretch out and watch AAAA ball, if the seats are cheap, and I bring my own grub.

Something isn't right. Something isn't be said truthfully. Something big has to happen to the Twins.
Joel Thingvall
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rosterman at www.twinscards.com

#25 TwinsFanInPhilly

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 11:58 AM

My favorite part is , we have to start being relistict,....huh ?most fans knew before you did Mr. Ryan?
We have known from the day Bill was sent to inspect toilets in South America, that payroll slashing was the major objection for this franchise


Major objection??? Thank you Mrs Malaprop.

#26 ThePuck

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 12:13 PM

Major objection??? Thank you Mrs Malaprop.


You understood what he meant right? Do you take issue with what he was saying, or do you just want to nitpick how he says it to avoid the actual point of the post?

This isn't English 101, people.

Edited by ThePuck, 09 January 2013 - 12:32 PM.


#27 edavis0308

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 12:38 PM

You understood what he meant right? Do you take issue with what he was saying, or do you just want to nitpick how he says it to avoid the actual point of the post?

This isn't English 101, people.


Seems to happen around here a lot.

#28 Highabove

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 01:17 PM

[FONT=Arial] " This can be a hard thing to do when the other clubs are searching for the same thing but (no one is going to try harder than the Twins.")

Direct quote to the Season Ticket Holders

Is this statement true?




[/FONT]

#29 Oxtung

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 01:42 PM

The issues:


MORNEAU

If he fits into some long-term plans, the Twins need to make a 2-3 year offer to him now at what they feel he is worth. If not, you trade him before the season starts, so another team can make him an offer or a "qualifying offer" if they feel he is worth it. It has showed this year that the new "free agency" thing isn't working...for the players...or the teams that don't want to lose a first round, or even their second round draft pick.

Will he be worth more at mid-season. Depends on who else is out of competition. But the decision ahs to be made now and we have to live with it.

Willingham would be a more likely candidate to trade mid-season and get some real value, i.e. prospects, back.

Morneau is worth almost nothing right now. No team is going to take on $14m for a 1st baseman that has significant health questions and only slugged .750ish last year. The only way the Twins get anything significant in return is if they eat a large portion of his contract. If the Twins aren't willing to pay a pitcher more than $10m then there is little chance they will pick up a significant amount of Morneau's salary.

2013

If we are truly rebuilding for 2014, then 2013 will have to see a whole hsot of upcoming players on the field. Not just Hicks and Gibson, but also pushing Rosario over Dozier, Sano over Plouffe, giving Buxton a real early look, making May and Meyer part of the rotation by mid-season. Otherwise, if you wait until September or 2014 to put these guys on the field, then THAT is the rebuilding year. Anyway you look at it, 2015 would be the earliest we would see in-house excitement from the future Minnesota Twins.


Rosario, Sano and Buxton; why stop there? I think we should pencil the top HS pitcher into the Twins rotation come June!

#30 ThePuck

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 01:56 PM

[FONT=Arial] " This can be a hard thing to do when the other clubs are searching for the same thing but (no one is going to try harder than the Twins.")

Direct quote to the Season Ticket Holders

Is this statement true?




[/FONT]


Doesn't seem like it's true at all, the results so far certainly don't seem to jive with the statement, but we can't know for 100% certain if it's the truth or an outright lie. I guess it depends on what he defines as 'trying harder.' To him, does that mean make an offer, but not above what HE thinks they are worth? If that's what he means, he could be telling the truth in the strictest sense. Question is, is that how others would define trying harder than any other team?