Jump to content

Providing independent coverage of the Minnesota Twins.
Subscribe to Twins Daily Email

Recent Blogs

Photo

Josh Willingham+Justin Morneau for Mike Olt

  • Please log in to reply
80 replies to this topic

#41 nicksaviking

nicksaviking

    Billy G.O.A.T

  • Twins Mods
  • 10,740 posts

Posted 16 December 2012 - 08:50 AM

Debatable point.


Well he was unobtainable for Justin Upton and the Twins don't have A comparable trade chip.

#42 jokin

jokin

    Twins News Team

  • Twins News Team
  • 11,087 posts

Posted 16 December 2012 - 08:55 AM

Profar is untouchable at this point(for the twins) and Andrus is about to get really expensive in 2 years.

You can live with slap hitting slick fielding MI, you need your 3rd baseman to smack it IMO, I wouldn't over pay just to get a MI over a superior 3rd base option.


Andrus gets expensive right about the time when the only guy making anything over peanuts is Joe Mauer. The Twins can afford him at that point and could answer their SS needs for the next decade and a half- or they could flip him for a boatload of talent in the interim of his team-controlled years. He's a proven commodity at the most important field position. Unless your are certain that Olt is going to be a lock to provide a Beltre-type career, why not acquire the greater need with your best trading chips?

#43 jokin

jokin

    Twins News Team

  • Twins News Team
  • 11,087 posts

Posted 16 December 2012 - 08:58 AM

Well he was unobtainable for Justin Upton and the Twins don't have A comparable trade chip.


Given recent personnel developments on their club and their chief competitors, the Rangers arguably aren't trading from the same position of strength.

#44 kab21

kab21

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 4,581 posts

Posted 16 December 2012 - 08:58 AM

Debatable point.


Debateable with those that have delusions regarding the value of Willingham and Morneau I guess. Offering a top 15 prospect does nothing to close the value gap or the needs that Texas has (MLB needs).

#45 jokin

jokin

    Twins News Team

  • Twins News Team
  • 11,087 posts

Posted 16 December 2012 - 09:21 AM

Debateable with those that have delusions regarding the value of Willingham and Morneau I guess. Offering a top 15 prospect does nothing to close the value gap or the needs that Texas has (MLB needs).


Delusions? The Rangers have depth at certain positions and glaring needs at others, use your imagination, a trade might involve a 3rd team in order to meet all their "MLB needs". As far as value goes, the WARs of Willingham and Andrus were about the same in 2012, and the Rangers have made it clear that Andrus is expendable. They need some splashy moves of their own just to show the fanbase that they are not taking their losses lying down. Willingham would be a major upgrade over Nelson Cruz (WAR 4 vs 1.3). And why does offering a top Twins prospect do nothing to close the value gap?

#46 kab21

kab21

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 4,581 posts

Posted 16 December 2012 - 10:44 AM

Awesome. Willingham has a career season at age 33 and you think that is worth one the best SS's in the league that happens to be 24 yrs old. This is what I consider delusional.

#47 SpantheMan

SpantheMan

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 122 posts

Posted 16 December 2012 - 11:05 AM

It would make sense for us to pay some of their salaries. I know Texas has a high payroll but we also have cap room to spare, especially if we trade those two. Then TR could say that we are playing money to get better prospects and bit just being cheap.

#48 diehardtwinsfan

diehardtwinsfan

    Twins Moderator

  • Twins Mods
  • 11,211 posts
  • LocationThe charred ruins of BYTO

Posted 16 December 2012 - 11:26 AM

Sano will make room in the OF or 1B when he's ready. it's just unlikely that he'll stick at 3B even though he'll have a another season or two to work at 3B.

I'm not sure why the lack of MI prospects was brought up. I'm all for targeting MI prospects also. Schoop is on my list as well as Sardinas and Odor from TEX but Olt is a better prospect than any of them and if I'm trading then I'm trading for the best prospect that I could get. And it's not like the Twins are stacked at 3B.

Profar is completely off the table so please stop bringing his name up. Andrus is also unobtainable for the Twins.


Then you don't make the trade (and to be clear, we should not be targeting Andrus either).

I agree that the Twins aren't stacked at 3B, but right now, but they have options. They have no options up the middle sans Rosario, and he won't be ready in 2014, and there's question as to whether or not he will even stick at 2nd. In most seasons, impact 3B can be found in free agency whereas impact MI cannot.

#49 Guest_USAFChief_*

Guest_USAFChief_*
  • Guests

Posted 16 December 2012 - 03:47 PM

Sano's chances of sticking at 3rd base are less then 50%, him being at least an average defensive 3rd baseman is less then 30% at this point


87.36% of percentages you see on am Internet board are made up on the spot.

#50 Ranger Vic

Ranger Vic

    Junior Member

  • Members
  • 3 posts

Posted 17 December 2012 - 03:51 AM

As a Rangers fan, I don't think the Rangers would do this trade, but I wouldn't completely rule it out. The Rangers could use another bat, but they are likely going to move Ian Kinsler to first base. I think Willingham would be a good fit, but Morneau's injury history would be a concern.

#51 Ranger Vic

Ranger Vic

    Junior Member

  • Members
  • 3 posts

Posted 17 December 2012 - 04:04 AM

That is the Morneau and Willingham trade for Olt is a possibility. I don't think the Rangers would have any interest in trading Andrus or Profar, especially after losing Hamilton. They are planning on playing Andrus at short, Profar at 2nd, and Kinsler at first.

#52 ericchri

ericchri

    Generally Clueless

  • Members
  • 435 posts

Posted 17 December 2012 - 04:44 PM

The Sano can't stick at 3B talk seems a wee bit overdone. I don't know any more than anybody else does, obviously, but I don't care that someone (KLaw?) labeled him as iffy to stick there. Until the Twins do something else with him, he's a 3B, and why on earth would you be looking to move him to another position before he has to. You should be encouraging the Twins to stick with him at 3B.

Geez, Corey Koskie was bad at 3B when he first got up, and he turned into a really good defensive player. And he was 6'3", 220 lbs, meaning around the same size as Sano (who supposedly has a fantastic throwing arm). Would Miguel Cabrera be better at 1B than 3B? Sure. But you can't tell me playing him at 3B is a mistake right now, not with the roster composition they have. The absolute best thing for this team long-term is Sano sticking at 3B and Rosario sticking at 2B, and writing them off at those positions for a somewhat sketchy trade now seems kind of silly.

Everyone should be rooting for Swisher to sign with Cleveland, though. Anything to make Texas more desperate.

#53 kab21

kab21

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 4,581 posts

Posted 17 December 2012 - 08:37 PM

The Sano can't stick at 3B talk seems a wee bit overdone. I don't know any more than anybody else does, obviously, but I don't care that someone (KLaw?) labeled him as iffy to stick there. Until the Twins do something else with him, he's a 3B, and why on earth would you be looking to move him to another position before he has to. You should be encouraging the Twins to stick with him at 3B.

Geez, Corey Koskie was bad at 3B when he first got up, and he turned into a really good defensive player. And he was 6'3", 220 lbs, meaning around the same size as Sano (who supposedly has a fantastic throwing arm). Would Miguel Cabrera be better at 1B than 3B? Sure. But you can't tell me playing him at 3B is a mistake right now, not with the roster composition they have. The absolute best thing for this team long-term is Sano sticking at 3B and Rosario sticking at 2B, and writing them off at those positions for a somewhat sketchy trade now seems kind of silly.

Everyone should be rooting for Swisher to sign with Cleveland, though. Anything to make Texas more desperate.


You know what's out of hand? Constantly bringing up Koskie like it's relevant. Keith Law isn't the only person that thinks Sano won't stick at 3B. Pretty much every scouting report says that he's a good athlete but he'll likely be forced off 3B. Of course you give him every chance to stay at 3B but you also need to prepare for a likely inevitable move. The depth chart at 3B consists of Plouffe, Sano and harrison (even worse at defense). Even MI has more depth in the minors.

#54 johnnydakota

johnnydakota

    Banned

  • Banned
  • 1,498 posts

Posted 17 December 2012 - 08:47 PM

Would the Mets part with Dárnaud for Willingham ?
It would be nice to add a piece for the future who is mlb ready
We might have to throw in Herrmann also .

#55 DaveW

DaveW

    Aaron Hicks update (5/17): .326 BA .464 OBP .616 SLG 1.080 OPS

  • Members
  • 12,753 posts
  • LocationNYC aka Aaron Hicks Ville

Posted 17 December 2012 - 09:35 PM

Would the Mets part with Dárnaud for Willingham ?
It would be nice to add a piece for the future who is mlb ready
We might have to throw in Herrmann also .

No. No they would not......

#56 old nurse

old nurse

    Member

  • Members
  • 3,074 posts

Posted 17 December 2012 - 09:44 PM

You know what's out of hand? Constantly bringing up Koskie like it's relevant. Keith Law isn't the only person that thinks Sano won't stick at 3B. Pretty much every scouting report says that he's a good athlete but he'll likely be forced off 3B. Of course you give him every chance to stay at 3B but you also need to prepare for a likely inevitable move. The depth chart at 3B consists of Plouffe, Sano and harrison (even worse at defense). Even MI has more depth in the minors.


Garry Gaetti was bad until he got good. Then he tried to throw the ball when his hands were on his throat. Sadly, the rest is history.

#57 beckmt

beckmt

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 1,827 posts

Posted 17 December 2012 - 10:44 PM

Rosario may be here in 2014, with a chance in 2013. 3B needs to give Pouffe a chance for next year and then see what we have. Sano may or may not stick. Santana may be here in 2014 - 2015. Pitching is the problem area and you need more than max #3 types. Hopefully a couple of the better ones develop. Twins now have about 8 - 10 #4 and #5 types. Better is needed. Twins need to trade only for pitching and MI prospects(second choice). Mariners might be best target(noted above) for a deal to bring back more pitching. That is the way to go.

#58 DaveW

DaveW

    Aaron Hicks update (5/17): .326 BA .464 OBP .616 SLG 1.080 OPS

  • Members
  • 12,753 posts
  • LocationNYC aka Aaron Hicks Ville

Posted 17 December 2012 - 11:50 PM

Remember that one player who was shaky at defense then become good? Yeah, I mean if a couple bad defensive players can become good, why can't we assume everyone else will?

#59 jimbo92107

jimbo92107

    Señor Member

  • Members
  • 3,550 posts
  • LocationSan Diego

Posted 18 December 2012 - 01:10 AM

True about silly moves. With the Angels stacking their lineup with 30+ homer guys, Texas may feel a need to respond with a couple big knockers like Morneau and Willingham. But I'd still rather have a pitcher for them, not another infielder.

#60 Mike Sixel

Mike Sixel

    Now living in Oregon

  • Members
  • 22,969 posts

Posted 18 December 2012 - 08:13 AM

Rosario is not going from A to the MLB.