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Article: Is Marcum the Twins' Best Hope?

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#1 Nick Nelson

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 12:05 AM

You can view the page at http://www.twinsdail...Twins-Best-Hope

#2 Top Gun

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 12:57 AM

Gamble ya but you got to find someone better than this.

#3 AllhopeisgoneMNTWINS

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 12:58 AM

Everything free agent is a gamble basically, I wouldnt say Marcum is the Center piece to a rotation. In my mind hes a number 3 pitcher. I would love to have him, but he will probably get more than he is worth, im sure the Twins wont spend somewhere around 20 million for 2 years on a guy like Marcum.

#4 Shane Wahl

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 01:13 AM

It would be good if he wasn't THE BEST HOPE, but the guy would be a very good addition. He fits well for the Twins and Target Field and does manage to strike more people out than what one might expect. I would find it ridiculous to be out-bid on Marcum. A Pavanoesque deal plus inflation might do it, and he is significantly better than Pavano. 2/20 and an option year with 2 million buyout seems easy for the Twins to do. The Twins should have $30 million to spend if ownership wants to. There are great smart pitching moves to be made for that money. AND AGAIN, the dollars are dropping after this season with Morneau, Blackburn, and Carroll off . . . so that 23 million reduction for next year should factor into this. Dempster and Marcum, Jackson and Marcum. Money should be no object there. And they would provide the key for 2014 and 2015.

#5 beckmt

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 01:46 AM

Please no Dempster(too old). Would love Marcum for 2 - 3 years. Would help the blow of the rest of the pitchers the Twins are likely to sign.

#6 Paul Pleiss

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 02:42 AM

I'm beginning to think that signing Marcum, or any other pseudo-big name this off-season is a bad move. I prefer the idea of moving Revere, staying away from big money guys and building for 2014+

-P

#7 mike wants wins

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 08:47 AM

And then spending money in 2014? Why not spend some now? Or do you have another plan for getting players in 2014?

#8 ThePuck

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 08:51 AM

I'm all for getting Marcum. He's a good pitcher.

#9 Riverbrian

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 08:56 AM

It would be good if he wasn't THE BEST HOPE, but the guy would be a very good addition. He fits well for the Twins and Target Field and does manage to strike more people out than what one might expect. I would find it ridiculous to be out-bid on Marcum. A Pavanoesque deal plus inflation might do it, and he is significantly better than Pavano. 2/20 and an option year with 2 million buyout seems easy for the Twins to do. The Twins should have $30 million to spend if ownership wants to. There are great smart pitching moves to be made for that money. AND AGAIN, the dollars are dropping after this season with Morneau, Blackburn, and Carroll off . . . so that 23 million reduction for next year should factor into this. Dempster and Marcum, Jackson and Marcum. Money should be no object there. And they would provide the key for 2014 and 2015.


I agree... Although I have condensed my hope to just one arm. I do agree. This waiting for something to happen is hard.

It would be nice if I could be multiple fly's on multiple walls providing no one has a fly swatter.

#10 old nurse

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 09:14 AM

Marcum might be the highest rank pitcher the Twins can sign without grossly overpaying

#11 ericchri

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 09:33 AM

He seem like the high end of what the Twins will realistically get. I'm not sure if that qualifies as a 'best hope' or not, though.

#12 Jim Crikket

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 10:18 AM

Maybe the Twins' crack medical staff believes they've spotted something in Marcum's medical history that they believe they can fix. #sarcasm

#13 mike wants wins

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 10:30 AM

Jim is on fire across threads.....

#14 Jim Crikket

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 11:12 AM

Jim is on fire across threads.....


Shhhhh... my bosses think all this typing I'm doing means I'm working my butt off!

Actually, one of my bosses is in Dallas and the other in Los Angeles... which probably does partially explain how I can get away with this :)
[COLOR=#0000cd]I opine about the Twins and Kernels regularly at[/COLOR][COLOR=#800000] Knuckleballsblog.com[/COLOR][COLOR=#0000cd] while my alter ego, SD Buhr covers the Kernels for [/COLOR][COLOR=#0000cd][COLOR=#800000]MetroSportsReport.com[/COLOR][/COLOR][COLOR=#0000cd].[/COLOR] [COLOR=#0000cd]
[/COLOR]

[COLOR=#b22222]~You can get anything you want at Alice's Restaurant~[/COLOR]

#15 ashburyjohn

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 12:08 PM

I'm beginning to think that signing Marcum, or any other pseudo-big name this off-season is a bad move. I prefer the idea of moving Revere, staying away from big money guys and building for 2014+


2015, more like. And then you have to have somebody to do more than simply fill out the roster for those two years - you can't commit to 110-loss seasons, this market will quit on you if you did. Contracts have to be viewed in that light. I'd be all for Dempster except he apparently wants 3 years and he's a risk to be bad by that third year, so no-go. I'm fine with trading Revere but you have to have a cost-effective yet capable replacement in mind until the young'uns are really ready (the alternative being to start the arbitration/free-agent clock prematurely on the guys you want to have contributing after 2015 too, in effect paying arbitration money later on for a 2013 of below-par play by a future stud). And so forth.

#16 ashburyjohn

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 12:09 PM

Actually, one of my bosses is in Dallas and the other in Los Angeles... which probably does partially explain how I can get away with this :)


They have teh internets in Dallas and LA too, y'know.

#17 AllhopeisgoneMNTWINS

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 12:17 PM

actually, one of my bosses is in dallas and the other in los angeles... Which probably does partially explain how i can get away with this :)


they have teh internets in dallas and la too, y'know.


^^^ buzzkill

#18 Jim Crikket

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 12:25 PM

Actually, one of my bosses is in Dallas and the other in Los Angeles... which probably does partially explain how I can get away with this :)


They have teh internets in Dallas and LA too, y'know.


You'd have to know my bosses. I'm pretty sure the availability of the internet would be news to at least one of them :)

Besides... I'm really good at what I do, so they tend to make allowances for some of my less productive "hobbies".
[COLOR=#0000cd]I opine about the Twins and Kernels regularly at[/COLOR][COLOR=#800000] Knuckleballsblog.com[/COLOR][COLOR=#0000cd] while my alter ego, SD Buhr covers the Kernels for [/COLOR][COLOR=#0000cd][COLOR=#800000]MetroSportsReport.com[/COLOR][/COLOR][COLOR=#0000cd].[/COLOR] [COLOR=#0000cd]
[/COLOR]

[COLOR=#b22222]~You can get anything you want at Alice's Restaurant~[/COLOR]

#19 DAM DC Twins Fans

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 02:52 PM

While Marcum seems to be a (slight) step up from Edwin Jackson and the rest--I agree with those above--he is at best a weak number 2 (like Diamond). Maybe the best thing for Twins is sign him to a 2 year deal (with 3rd year option) for about 25mill and give DeVries, Deduno, Walters, etc one last shot to show something this year. Hope gibson is good in June and trade at deadline for pitcher.

#20 mike wants wins

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 03:18 PM

What exactly is wrong with a number 2 pitcher, and what do people think those cost?

#21 Nick Nelson

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 03:18 PM

In my mind hes a number 3 pitcher.


On what team, the Phillies?? Seeing him referred to as a No. 3 or a "weak No. 2" tells me that some people have absolutely unrealistic expectations about the rotation. The Twins would be lucky to have a pitcher of his caliber as their top guy next year, as would a number of other teams.

#22 Danchat

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 03:23 PM

This is is our best hope. We can't possibly sign anybody better.
He's a No. 1 on our staff. He's a #3 on a normal staff, or a #4 on the Phillies or Rangers.

#23 LaBombo

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 03:45 PM

In my mind hes a number 3 pitcher.


On what team, the Phillies?? Seeing him referred to as a No. 3 or a "weak No. 2" tells me that some people have absolutely unrealistic expectations about the rotation. The Twins would be lucky to have a pitcher of his caliber as their top guy next year, as would a number of other teams.


Yeah. It's probably not just Twins fans that expect too much. Some dude named Jeff Sackmann compiled the results of the 2006 season and found what rotation spots league-wide averaged in ERA.

Spot_ #1_ #2 _#3 _#4_ #5
MLB 3.60 4.14 4.58 5.10 6.24

AL 3.70 4.24 4.58 5.09 6.22

NL 3.51 4.04 4.57 5.11 6.26

Marcum posted ERA's of 3.64, 3.54, and 3.70 the past three seasons. So by definition, about half the teams in baseball got less from their 'ace' than the Jays and Brewers did from Marcum. and even if he regresses (age, league switch, etc) to his FIP/xFIP territory, he's still a legit #2 in the AL. I think when people think #3 starter, they tend to think of a guy whose ERA is about 4 or ideally a bit under, but most teams are lucky to get that from their #2 guy. Btw, Sackmann included the injury fill-ins, so the replacement-level guys really drag down the 4th and 5th spots.

Edited by LaBombo, 05 December 2012 - 03:53 PM.


#24 Brock Beauchamp

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 03:53 PM

In my mind hes a number 3 pitcher.


On what team, the Phillies?? Seeing him referred to as a No. 3 or a "weak No. 2" tells me that some people have absolutely unrealistic expectations about the rotation. The Twins would be lucky to have a pitcher of his caliber as their top guy next year, as would a number of other teams.


Five #1s or bust, Nick.

#25 danswanson

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 08:05 PM

In my opinion this is not the year to sign the top free agent pitcher. We need 4 to compete for the division which thanks to the Pohlad family we will not until our prospects mature. Signing Marcum adds a handful of wins to a ninety loss team. I say we don't waste the first and probably second year of a long term deal this year. Wait until we are competitive again and then go all in. Realistically this is a rebuilding year and anyone who does not see that is blind

#26 kab21

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 08:36 PM

Marcum is actually perfect since he won't require a long term deal. Just because you are rebuilding it doesn't mean that you have to go the Marlins route and not try to win a few games. Marcum clearly won't be blocking anyone decent and it's not like he's going to get this crazy deal like some of the FA starters.

#27 YourHouseIsMyHouse

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 09:13 PM

Marcum is a front line type of pitcher and I've been hoping for him all offseason. He's expensive, but not too expensive.

#28 Top Gun

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 01:15 AM

No he our last hope.

#29 Owl in a Koa Tree

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 03:30 AM

Umm, guys, best hope? Not. Hear tell the Mets kinda looking to move Johan Santana and are willing to eat some of the $25 mil/yr contract he has in 2013 (2014 is an option year). Yeah, he's older - he turns 34 on 13 March, hardly OTH (if only I were that young again!). Sure, he got injured a couple times during his NY tenure (with his lack of run support, it's a wonder he didn't have a nervous breakdown), missed 2011 with TJS, and had a losing record last year -- for the Mets (like, who didn't?). Dude threw 199 innings in 2010, 117 last year despite it all, and seemed +/- his old self again. So who are the Twins willing to trade to get braddah Johan back with a goodly part of his salary left back in NY? Willingham, Plouffe, Rivera, Morneau and a percentage on beer concessions at Target Field? Or perhaps it wouldn't eat into the roster that much - remember the Mets are "rebuilding." How about a hot high class A pitcher who was the 23rd pick in the 2011 Amateur Draft and would best ripen on the farm 'til 2015? It could also save face, 'cause from out here the Twins look like they wen' got took by the Nats, again. Just a thought from a distance - perhaps my perspective is skewed by the 90 degrees and 95% humidity.

P.S. Would the owners please trade Sir Ryan and whatever else it takes to Cincy for Walt Jocketty? Please!

#30 kab21

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 10:36 AM

remember the Mets are "rebuilding."


They are not the only team...