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Legit Trade Candidate: Dee Gordon

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#21 ashburyjohn

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Posted 03 December 2012 - 10:58 PM

Or maybe that Hanley Ramirez is simply better? I doubt they have any inclination to waste that investment.


Sure. That's a chicken-and-egg question though - if they thought that Dee had super-upside and was about to break out, would they have acquired Hanley? I think they've made their judgement, and the Twins scouts need to be very very confident that they are smarter than their Dodger counterparts. Maybe they are, and maybe this is the last season Gordon will put up Nick Punto numbers.

#22 kab21

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Posted 03 December 2012 - 11:06 PM

I like it how Dave hypes up gordon and then says he's not worth anything close to a top 100 prospect.

I have never been a fan of gordon so I'm not surprised by his struggles. He might be similar to Revere but he's not as good of a hitter as Revere. He might have hit .302 in the minors but Revere hit .326 and people seem to think he's a .290-.300 hitter in the majors. I could see Gordon hitting .270 and not walking or hitting for any power. Mediocre defense kind of sinks his value to a utility player. and the Dodgers aren't going to just give him away this offseason. they will want someone pretty good imo.

#23 kab21

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Posted 03 December 2012 - 11:08 PM

The Dodgers got Hanley for free so this argument doesn't go anywhere. And he can play 3B unlike anyone else on the Dodgers.

#24 ThePuck

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Posted 03 December 2012 - 11:15 PM

If Revere is a .290-.300 hitter, but still maintains a sub .350 OBP, he will hold little offensive value. He has no power, with almost twice as many balls in play to, or first through, the infield as opposed to OF. His only value offensively is to get on base and use his speed. So we'll see what happens with him. Will going back to leadoff hurt his OBP as he likely sees less fastballs?

Edited by ThePuck, 03 December 2012 - 11:21 PM.


#25 ThePuck

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Posted 03 December 2012 - 11:18 PM

The Dodgers got Hanley for free so this argument doesn't go anywhere. And he can play 3B unlike anyone else on the Dodgers.


The man had a -8.7 UZR/150 at 3B this year. Horrible defensive shortstop, horrible defensive 3B. So if he's the best defensive 3B they have, they are hurting big time :-)

#26 kab21

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Posted 03 December 2012 - 11:48 PM

The man had a -8.7 UZR/150 at 3B this year. Horrible defensive shortstop, horrible defensive 3B. So if he's the best defensive 3B they have, they are hurting big time :-)


Wouldn't it be fair to say then that he's an even worse SS? Which means that the Dodgers acquiring Hanley has little to do with their confidence in gordon as previously argued in this thread.

If Revere is a .290-.300 hitter, but still maintains a sub .350 OBP, he will hold little offensive value. He has no power, with almost twice as many balls in play to, or first through, the infield as opposed to OF. His only value offensively is to get on base and use his speed. So we'll see what happens with him. Will going back to leadoff hurt his OBP as he likely sees less fastballs?


Not sure if you're paying attention to this thread but it's about Gordon. Imo Gordon is a fair amount worse than Revere offensively and I'm not really interested in a low .600's OPS with mediocre defense even if that player is a SS and steals bases. Revere is kind of unimpressive as a starter but at least he has a chance at a .700 OPS and plays good defense.

#27 ThePuck

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Posted 03 December 2012 - 11:57 PM

[quote name='kab21'][QUOTE]The man had a -8.7 UZR/150 at 3B this year. Horrible defensive shortstop, horrible defensive 3B. So if he's the best defensive 3B they have, they are hurting big time :-) [/QUOTE]

Wouldn't it be fair to say then that he's an even worse SS? Which means that the Dodgers acquiring Hanley has little to do with their confidence in gordon as previously argued in this thread.

[QUOTE]If Revere is a .290-.300 hitter, but still maintains a sub .350 OBP, he will hold little offensive value. He has no power, with almost twice as many balls in play to, or first through, the infield as opposed to OF. His only value offensively is to get on base and use his speed. So we'll see what happens with him. Will going back to leadoff hurt his OBP as he likely sees less fastballs?[/QUOTE]

Not sure if you're paying attention to this thread but it's about Gordon. Imo Gordon is a fair amount worse than Revere offensively and I'm not really interested in a low .600's OPS with mediocre defense even if that player is a SS and steals bases. Revere is kind of unimpressive as a starter but at least he has a chance at a .700 OPS and plays good defense.[/QUOTE]

I'm not going to pretend to know what the Dodgers are thinking with Hanley or how it affects what they're thinking with Gordon.

As far as my comment about Revere, I apologize for commenting on something you said about Revere.

#28 Shane Wahl

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 12:39 AM

Absolutely not unless it was for Logan Darnell and Pat Dean or something. Gordon is not good, but I wouldn't write him off completely.

#29 SpiritofVodkaDave

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 12:56 AM

I like it how Dave hypes up gordon and then says he's not worth anything close to a top 100 prospect.

I have never been a fan of gordon so I'm not surprised by his struggles. He might be similar to Revere but he's not as good of a hitter as Revere. He might have hit .302 in the minors but Revere hit .326 and people seem to think he's a .290-.300 hitter in the majors. I could see Gordon hitting .270 and not walking or hitting for any power. Mediocre defense kind of sinks his value to a utility player. and the Dodgers aren't going to just give him away this offseason. they will want someone pretty good imo.

I didn't hype him up, I said he would be a good buy low candidate to go after due to his upside, however he isn't worth a top 100 prospect at this point. I don't think those things have to be mutually exclusive?

#30 SpiritofVodkaDave

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 12:59 AM

. Imo Gordon is a fair amount worse than Revere offensively and I'm not really interested in a low .600's OPS with mediocre defense even if that player is a SS and steals bases. Revere is kind of unimpressive as a starter but at least he has a chance at a .700 OPS and plays good defense.


Give me a break, low .600's? He posted a .742 in the minors, just because he had a bad half year this year doesn't mean he will hit for a low .600s OPS, also range etc wise he is fine, he had a really, really terrible stretch this year where he basically got steve bass disease, other then that there is no reason not to think he cant be a solid contributor defensively.

Offer a C prospect for him, worst case scenario is he is a better option as a bench guy/UTIL guy then an Escobar or Florimon, best case is he can become a cheap league average SS overall (including his speed).

#31 kab21

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 02:47 AM

I'm not overreacting to one season. I've never thought his skillset would transfer to the majors. He hit over .300 in one of the most ridiculous hitting environments in the ridiculous PCL. He hit .277 in high A and .300 in low A and rk ball. I really think he is a .270 hitter in the majors with no power or walks.

I think you also need to be realistic and realize that the Dodgers have no reason to give him away. You're definitely not getting him for a C prospect (outside the Twins top 15).