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Article: Gleeman & The Geek Episode 70: Denard Span for Alex Meyer

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#1 John Bonnes

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Posted 30 November 2012 - 10:21 PM

You can view the page at http://twinsdaily.co...-for-Alex-Meyer

#2 kcm

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Posted 01 December 2012 - 02:51 AM

How have you guys not murdered each other yet?

#3 NoCryingInBaseball

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Posted 01 December 2012 - 11:18 AM

Lions Tap Pub? Damn, a half mile from my house!

#4 Rick Niedermann

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Posted 01 December 2012 - 04:27 PM

Gleeman really needs to take a nap before these podcasts. Kinda Grouchy and Condescending.

#5 Seth Stohs

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Posted 01 December 2012 - 10:44 PM

Rick,
Is this the first of the 70 episodes you've listened to? :) Ha!

#6 Twins Twerp

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Posted 01 December 2012 - 11:45 PM

Thanks for the soap opera men. John...STOP BREATHING INTO THE MIC.

#7 Seth Stohs

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Posted 01 December 2012 - 11:52 PM

No clue what John was talking about with the A/B/C prospects... I'll say this, in my opinion:

A - Sano, Buxton, Arcia, Meyer
B - Hicks, Gibson, Rosario, Berrios

That said... Sickels will likely have just 1 A because his grading system involves how far they are, risk, things like that.

#8 twinsfaninsaudi

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Posted 02 December 2012 - 07:14 AM

I totally disagree with John's take on how the BJ Upton signing influenced this deal. I think he has it backwards. Once the Nationals had lost out on Upton, and the FA centerfield market was set higher than they wanted to get into (especially since they are planning to sign a starting pitcher) they decided to pull the trigger on a deal giving up their best pitching prospect - which they would have rather not done.

Do you think they would have given up AJ Cole for Span in the summer of 2011? No way, and the 6'9 fireballer is no small pill for them to swallow now.

One of Terry Ryan's skills as a GM is that he is stubborn, he is not afraid to NOT make a deal if he has any leverage at all. The Twins have been turning down offers of lesser players for Span for almost two years now and it has paid off. The Reds really wanted Span in July, but Ryan was insistent on getting Cingrani from them and would not budge from it. So a deal didn't happen, he waited, and now he got the kind of return he was looking for after the CF market was set with the Upton signing. It was the Nationals who got more urgent, not TR.

#9 John Bonnes

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Posted 02 December 2012 - 10:31 AM

No clue what John was talking about with the A/B/C prospects... I'll say this, in my opinion:

A - Sano, Buxton, Arcia, Meyer
B - Hicks, Gibson, Rosario, Berrios

That said... Sickels will likely have just 1 A because his grading system involves how far they are, risk, things like that.


To me, Sano and Buxton are A. Hick and Arcia are B. That's why, to me, Meyer is borderline B. It's also why I kept trying to understand objectively what is generally considered an A vs. B vs C prospect in terms of overall rankings. If, generally, the top 100 guys are considered B prospects, then given the rankings, Meyer is a B.

I am a little amazed that everyone seems to want to sight his numbers in Low A (or his overall numbers, which are weighted more far more heavily by his Low-A numbers) rather than cast a skeptical eye over his High A numbers.

#10 diehardtwinsfan

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Posted 02 December 2012 - 12:43 PM

No clue what John was talking about with the A/B/C prospects... I'll say this, in my opinion:

A - Sano, Buxton, Arcia, Meyer
B - Hicks, Gibson, Rosario, Berrios

That said... Sickels will likely have just 1 A because his grading system involves how far they are, risk, things like that.


Sickles has Sano at A- and Buxton, Arcia, and Meyer at B+...

#11 Seth Stohs

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Posted 02 December 2012 - 01:48 PM

It's a tough question because there are no A,B,C ratings for prospects other than Sickels, so it's really hard to judge. I've never 'graded' prospects by letter, just be ranking. I was just hoping that you'd ask Aaron for where Meyer ranked among Twins prospects.

I 100% agree that the further from the big leagues, the less that stats matter... with Meyer, it's all about the projection.

#12 Curt

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Posted 02 December 2012 - 02:20 PM

If I may take a stab at what John wants (realizing he had ample opportunity on the podcast and he is here commenting too), he wants some kind of criteria to say what makes a prospect an A versus B or B versus C. Something like this:

A - Sure thing with All-star potential
B - Likely long term regular
C - Likely role player
D - Likely hanger-on for a few years
F - Possible cup of coffee

#13 Brad Swanson

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Posted 02 December 2012 - 02:32 PM

I say this with love: you should change the name of this podcast to "Gettin' wrapped up in semantics, with John and Aaron!" That being said, I was happy to hear John fight back and try clarify his position.

Of course, this is just a D level comment, so what do I know?

Edited by Brad Swanson, 02 December 2012 - 02:39 PM.


#14 Alex

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Posted 02 December 2012 - 03:08 PM

I say this with love: you should change the name of this podcast to "Gettin' wrapped up in semantics, with John and Aaron!" That being said, I was happy to hear John fight back and try clarify his position.

Of course, this is just a D level comment, so what do I know?


I normally agree with Aaron's take, but that part of the podcast was downright arrogant and insulting to anyone who participates in TD. He actually came across to me (tone) in the same way reporters come across to him when they criticize bloggers.. Of course, he then used those "D" comments as part of his evidence for why John's take on Meyer was wrong (something about TD reaction when John posted that Meyer was a C prospect). Honestly I love the podcast in general and was looking forward to this one, but it may have been one of the toughest to listen to and still haven't finished it.

Edited by Alex, 02 December 2012 - 03:15 PM.


#15 Seth Stohs

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Posted 02 December 2012 - 03:14 PM

I say this with love: you should change the name of this podcast to "Gettin' wrapped up in semantics, with John and Aaron!" That being said, I was happy to hear John fight back and try clarify his position.

Of course, this is just a D level comment, so what do I know?


Ha!!! B- comment at worst!!

#16 Twins Twerp

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Posted 02 December 2012 - 04:00 PM

I say this with love: you should change the name of this podcast to "Gettin' wrapped up in semantics, with John and Aaron!" That being said, I was happy to hear John fight back and try clarify his position.

Of course, this is just a D level comment, so what do I know?


I normally agree with Aaron's take, but that part of the podcast was downright arrogant and insulting to anyone who participates in TD. He actually came across to me (tone) in the same way reporters come across to him when they criticize bloggers.. Of course, he then used those "D" comments as part of his evidence for why John's take on Meyer was wrong (something about TD reaction when John posted that Meyer was a C prospect). Honestly I love the podcast in general and was looking forward to this one, but it may have been one of the toughest to listen to and still haven't finished it.


Agreed. I was looking forward to hearing more about meyer and instead got an instruction on how not to argue. John didnt stoop so low but i would have popped a guy if he talked like that about me in front of my face...very disrespectful.

There is a way to rip someone without being an a$$ho1e.

#17 John Bonnes

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Posted 02 December 2012 - 08:34 PM

For those who have listened to a bunch of the podcasts, I don't think it's uncommon for Aaron and I to need to become pretty frustrated with each other before we recognize a deeper paradigm that we haven't really uncovered. After the podcast we shared a pitcher, ordered a few burgers with the rest of the TwinsCentric guys, share a couple of more pitchers and talked through all kinds of stuff.

#18 Twins Twerp

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Posted 02 December 2012 - 08:43 PM

For those who have listened to a bunch of the podcasts, I don't think it's uncommon for Aaron and I to need to become pretty frustrated with each other before we recognize a deeper paradigm that we haven't really uncovered. After the podcast we shared a pitcher, ordered a few burgers with the rest of the TwinsCentric guys, share a couple of more pitchers and talked through all kinds of stuff.


Kisses?

#19 Alex

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Posted 02 December 2012 - 09:15 PM

For those who have listened to a bunch of the podcasts, I don't think it's uncommon for Aaron and I to need to become pretty frustrated with each other before we recognize a deeper paradigm that we haven't really uncovered. After the podcast we shared a pitcher, ordered a few burgers with the rest of the TwinsCentric guys, share a couple of more pitchers and talked through all kinds of stuff.


Totally understandable and I've enjoyed several of those hard nosed discussions. It might be worth noting, though, that a host should be aware that his audience might include listeners from Twins Daily before taking a negative approach to the comments here as a whole. Again, I say this while very much looking forward to the next podcast.

#20 Steve Penz

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Posted 02 December 2012 - 09:27 PM

After 60+ episodes i have come to expect and accept a high level of arguement in the podcast. Thats part of the package. What I want to know is what is up with the baby crying in the background? The lack of bar-type noises was different. And, it was like you guys were whispering. I still enjoyed the analysis and the drama. It was just a bit different.

How about getting Gleeman to come back to his old hood for a podcast? The Nook and The Groveland Tap are calling your names. AG could visit his mom after you are done!

#21 lightfoot789

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Posted 02 December 2012 - 11:39 PM

I listened to a podcast the other day that spoke of Rory Rhodes. I hadn't heard his name in many months and wondered what does his future look like. He was demoted to Elizabethton last year (from Beloit) and was on fire to start the season before injury hampered his season. Good looking prospect - What does future hold for Aussie?

#22 kbjones11

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Posted 03 December 2012 - 01:39 PM

Is it just me or did Bonnes keep heavy mouth breathing into the microphone on this one? And there was a repeated sound multiple times that was very reminiscent of flatulence. What was going on here?!?

#23 Wookiee of the Year

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Posted 03 December 2012 - 06:24 PM

Gosh. I normally enjoy your and Aaron's back-and-forth, but this one was a little much for me (plus, I rushed to listen to it for thoughts on the trade and details on Meyer, so my expectations were probably above average for a podcast going in).

They're weird arguments, too--I tend to agree with you that Aaron seems to arguing with someone else half the time. In any case, he often gets much more worked up and defensive (and, dare I say, offensive) about these things than you get, John.

While I agree with Aaron that Meyer should be labeled better than a C prospect, I totally agree with you that you can really use any scale you want, so it makes sense to ask him, "What scale are you using? Roughly how many A, B, and C prospects would you say there there are per team?" I don't know why asking that question warrants minutes of insults.

I often go back and forth as to which of you I agree with in your back-and-forths, but the one thing I can never figure out is why Aaron would rather argue than discuss.

#24 SanePerson

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 07:40 PM

I've enjoyed this podcast too much over the past year to quit on it over one episode, but sheesh, this one really got out of hand. I hope you guys are able to work something out to avoid these unending unwinnable circular arguments. Maybe hit pause on the recording, go to a break and take a breather over a beer?

Also this episode made it quite clear that behind Aaron's misanthropic never-leave-the-house shtick lie some pretty serious issues. Bless you, John, but I would've gotten up and left the minute he started intimating that his "reputation" was being damaged by associating himself with you. The constant threats to find another co-host are also getting old, and are nowhere near as cute as he thinks they are.

All that said, I hope whatever set this argument in motion gets resolved, because 90% of the time this podcast is an invaluable resource for news and analysis.

#25 Brad Swanson

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 08:00 PM

I think that everything that needs to be said on this topic has likely been said, so I want to move this thread in another direction.

I really liked that John stated that he wanted to get something up quickly for the TD community to discuss. To me, this shows that the leaders of TD really want this to be a community, and not simply a place to display their great articles. The community aspect makes it a lot more fun for me. I like being able to see some gut reactions from time to time, as they can be very entertaining, and often the most honest. The wide variety of opinions is one of the most interesting and enjoyable parts of this community. The fact that we all feel empowered to express our opinions is what makes this a fun place to visit on a daily basis. Being able to interact with writers that I have read for years is a really great idea. Also, just seeing what other people think on a variety of topics and reading various member blogs is really enjoyable for me. So kudos to John, and the whole TD staff for providing this forum and this site for us to use and enjoy.

#26 Seth Stohs

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 08:06 PM

Thanks Brad! When John, Nick, Parker and I first became TwinsCentric, "community" was one of the keys to the whole discussion. When we all lived in the cities, we had fairly frequent get-togethers. As we were discussing TwinsDaily.com (before it had a name/url), "community/forum" was an absolute. And, this community has been great for that!

#27 mike wants wins

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 08:25 PM

I agree, I like the back and forth, mostly it is respectful.