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The #5 pitcher on the 1965 Twins

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#1 Flattery

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Posted 07 July 2020 - 01:56 PM

Tim Flattery had a conversation with Dwight Siebler, who was the 5th start on the 1965 Twins World Series team (the Sandy Koufax series). 

 

Old guys tell the best stories- 

 

"Harmon Killebrew was one of the nicest men I ever met. We got to be good friends... we didn't just go chasing skirts every night!"

 

https://www.moonligh...minnesota-twins

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#2 Number3

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Posted 08 July 2020 - 08:31 AM

Listened to the whole thing right away and enjoyed every minute. Checked a box score I had from Aug. 1, 1963 doubleheader between the Senators and Twins in Washington. Low and behold it was the game Siebler talked about in the interview which was his first start in the majors after his less than great relief appearance 2 days earlier. Line was 9ip, 3hits, 1 run 2bb, 4ks. Allen, Hall Killebrew and Versailles homered. Twins won 10-1 and Siebler had 5 plate appearances with 1 hit,1 run and 1rbi. Quite a first start. Twins won game 1 14-1 so I thoroughly enjoyed the evening. I was 16 at the time.

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#3 stringer bell

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Posted 08 July 2020 - 11:06 AM

When I read the title of this thread, I tried to guess who was considered the #5 starter for the '65 Twins--Merritt, Stigman, Boswell? Dwight Siebler didn't enter my mind. Siebler appeared in 7 games and made one start. I guess I wouldn't consider him the fifth starter but that probably doesn't change anything about his stories.


#4 ashbury

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Posted 08 July 2020 - 11:11 AM

When I read the title of this thread, I tried to guess who was considered the #5 starter for the '65 Twins--Merritt, Stigman, Boswell? Dwight Siebler didn't enter my mind. Siebler appeared in 7 games and made one start. I guess I wouldn't consider him the fifth starter but that probably doesn't change anything about his stories.

SABR friends are prone to reminding one another to fact-check every single nugget you glean from an interview with an old player. It's good advice for historians anytime, of course; the point being to not let your guard down because it's a first-person account from a kindly senior.

 

You could always tell who was the fifth starter, back those days of four-man rotations. It was because of the onion the manager gave you to wear on your belt. :)
 

It's so simple to be wise: think of something stupid and say the opposite. -- Sam Levenson


#5 jkcarew

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Posted 08 July 2020 - 07:23 PM

E

When I read the title of this thread, I tried to guess who was considered the #5 starter for the '65 Twins--Merritt, Stigman, Boswell? Dwight Siebler didn't enter my mind. Siebler appeared in 7 games and made one start. I guess I wouldn't consider him the fifth starter but that probably doesn't change anything about his stories.


Yeah. I thought it was maybe ‘tongue in cheek’. Just the one start...and there was no such thing as a number 5 starter. No one had heard of the term. #4’s didn’t even see regular turns. But, as you say, doesn’t detract from the stories. The members of the ‘65 team still with us are, sadly, fewer and fewer...so, definitely enjoyed seeing this!

#6 jorgenswest

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Posted 08 July 2020 - 11:27 PM

Fun listen. Thank you.

 

it is probably fair to view him as the 5th starter or the starter that gets called up next if some one goes down in 1963 and 1964. He filled in that role in 1963 at the end of the season for Kaat and he started 25 games in AAA in each of 1964 and 1965. 


#7 Nine of twelve

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Posted 09 July 2020 - 06:23 PM

For the sake of factual clarity here are the starting pitchers from the 1965 season with the number of games started:

 

Kaat, 42

Grant, 39

Pascual, 27

Perry, 19

Boswell, 12

Merritt, 9

Stigman, 8

Nelson, 3

Pleis, 2

Siebler, 1


#8 Number3

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Posted 10 July 2020 - 07:25 AM

Dominating those 1963 Senators was no small feat so I am surprised that Siebler didn't get more opportunities. The insight to how he was treated by Griffith in the pre Curt Flood era I guess was typical of pre free agent baseball.


#9 twinfan

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Posted 10 July 2020 - 10:07 AM

I honestly didn't remember Perry being on the Twins that early but remember seeing Boswell and Merritt pitch during that season. In fact, Boswell was considered nearly the best all-around pitcher on the team by the Baseball Reference site. However, back then you basically had 3 starters who made 30-35 starts eachand 2-3 backups who maybe started 15 games each.